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Do speakers change all that much after 100 hours of 'burn-in'?

ezra_s

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I just found this video of "The audiophiliac" and Andrew Jones explaining scientifically what this "break-in" thing is. Seems it is still out of the oven (just published)

 
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Fluffy

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He should have talked about elastic limits at the beginning instead of using confusing terms like creep, but at least he did at the end. What I don't understand is how come the compliance of the spider change if they don't go past it's elastic limit, as he claims? And if they do go past it's limit a little bit, then why not using a material with a better elastic limit that won't change its compliance under normal usage?

Other than that confusing bit, it's nice to see him pretty much debunk the whole burn-in myth. There are some other points I wish he would address more directly. First of all, when he says the response change around the resonant frequency, by how much it changes? Is it even by a noticeable amount? And what does he think that people are hearing when they claim they hear a speaker break in over hours or sometimes weeks of playing it? And while the break-in happens primarily in the woofer, does a tweeter break-in also in the same fashion?

Part 2 should be interesting, at any case.
 

Haint

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He should have talked about elastic limits at the beginning instead of using confusing terms like creep, but at least he did at the end. What I don't understand is how come the compliance of the spider change if they don't go past it's elastic limit, as he claims? And if they do go past it's limit a little bit, then why not using a material with a better elastic limit that won't change its compliance under normal usage?

Other than that confusing bit, it's nice to see him pretty much debunk the whole burn-in myth. There are some other points I wish he would address more directly. First of all, when he says the response change around the resonant frequency, by how much it changes? Is it even by a noticeable amount? And what does he think that people are hearing when they claim they hear a speaker break in over hours or sometimes weeks of playing it? And while the break-in happens primarily in the woofer, does a tweeter break-in also in the same fashion?

Part 2 should be interesting, at any case.

As I understood it, he's saying some of the resin bonds break down under normal range/use, not just when pushed past it's elastic limit.
 

Head_Unit

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when he says the response change around the resonant frequency, by how much it changes? Is it even by a noticeable amount? And what does he think that people are hearing when they claim they hear a speaker break in over hours or sometimes weeks of playing it?
As I've posted elsewhere, not in a large set of measurements that I did. The suspension changes did not affect the frequency response much. I'd suppose Andrew thinks people aren't hearing anything physical but have psychologically adapted to the new sound. That's what I believe 98.647% of "break-in" is.
 

Chrispy

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Do they change much after a few minutes? Is it permanent if you go longer/hotter?
 

Emlin

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What I don't understand is why people always claim that speakers break in for the better. Don't even a few get worse?

You know the sort of thing: "Straight out of the box, even though I was willing to be impressed, I wasn't. Somehow there was too much of what I call "sparkle". I contacted the distributor and he said that ideally the speakers should be given at least two years to break in, but 95 hours and 32 minutes would be sufficient in most cases. I took him at his word, and waited. And he was right! Just as the timer clicked over, boy, WHAT A DIFFERENCE! Even the last hint of sparkle had disappeared and all the speakers produced now was a dull monotonous thud."
 
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Somafunk

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Reminds me of reading cable reviews where the companies involved offer to burn them in for you, yeah right........of course they do.
 

Midwest Blade

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If speakers break in over time, what would stop them from eventually wearing out.
I once believed this speaker myth, I think the only thing that breaks in is our head when we get accustomed to the new speaker.
 

Kal Rubinson

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If a break-in believer was given a set of speakers advertised as brand new but which had secretly been broken in at the factory with 1,000 hours of music would the break-in believer perceive an improvement in sound after performing his own 100 hours of break-in?
Sure. If a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, it makes no sound. :)
If speakers break in over time, what would stop them from eventually wearing out.
Nothing and, eventually, they do. Note, also, that no one ever says that "breaking in" results in poorer sound.
 

Head_Unit

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Do they change much after a few minutes? Is it permanent if you go longer/hotter?
The main thing was the resonance frequency just kept dropping little by little by little through the whole 280 hours at full power. Yes it was permanent; the suspensions were just getting the hell battered out of them.
- Unfortunately I don't recall the % of change. Not just a couple % but not like 1/3 either. Maybe 15% by the end?? The frequency responses didn't change appreciably-at least within the limits of a 1/3 octave Bruel & Kjaer analyzer specified by Ford. That's not surprising really since compliance just shifts the whole curve a bit. Into a sealed box the box compliance lessens the effect of woofer compliance change.
 

Head_Unit

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If a tree falls in the forest and no one hears it, it makes no sound. :)
Wait, what did you say? I can't hear you, I'm in the middle of this forest...

Reminds me of reading cable reviews where the companies involved offer to burn them in for you, yeah right........of course they do.
...and it's too loud in the forest because all these cable companies are doing "burn-in"
 

Somafunk

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“We cannot discuss "breaking in" of any audio component without first dealing with cognitive psychology.”

I seriously doubt the cable burn in believers would entertain the possibility of cognitive bias, that would involve a modicum of objectivity.
 

DSJR

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I can believe tweeters may change just a little bit in the first few hours of use (headphones apparently do, but it's a dB either way I gather), but bass drivers should sort themselves out in minutes I reckon and then stabilise for their remaining lives (accepting that many still good measuring speakers over forty years old must have many thousands of hours' use by now).

One company I know making pro and large domestic speakers used to 'thrash' their newly made bass drivers at 20Hz for twenty minutes or so before they were built into cabs or packed as individual drivers, the cones oscillating wildy back and forth. The feeling was that if they could withstand that, they'd withstand anything the end-users would give them short of a faulty amp going 'DC.' Unknowing end users still went on about running the speakers in, totally ignorant of the 'punishment' the drivers had gone through before final assembly and test (every pair were measured and records kept).
 

Cadguy

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I've been interested in audio for 40 years and I have never heard any dramatic changes in any of my speakers that I could attribute to "break in". In my experience, moving speakers 6 inches will have a greater impact on their sound than anything else so how can anyone delineate the difference between positioning and break in? How do speaker designers come with a recommended break in time? If its based on materials science and not on psychoacoustics than why not publish some data to back that up? Or do do they just choose an estimated number of hours that exceeds the length of the money back 30 day in home audition?
 

Daverz

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What I don't understand is why people always claim that speakers break in for the better. Don't even a few get worse?

It's the Practice Effect:

"In this world, instead of objects wearing out as you use them, they improve. This is referred to as the Practice Effect. For example, swords get sharper with use, baskets get stronger the more things they carry, mirrors, furniture and decorations look more attractive the more they are looked at. The downside to this being that an object's condition deteriorates over time if not put to use. Under this system, members of society's higher strata employ servants to Practice their own possessions to perfection."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Practice_Effect
 

burkm

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I am beeing "somewhat" late to the thread with my post... Please don't mind :)

Why they break in for the better: I would suggest, that all parameters stated for a chassis by the manufacturer are for a used / "broken-in" version and not for a new one. He must have used them quite a lot before, experimenting with them and they are finaly been measured when finalizing the product. Thus "burn-in" probably always goes for the "better" because of this. I myself had tried to "burn-in" speakers at least for (duration) 15 (?) hours or so. At the beginning the speakers sounded restricted and locked in. Little (?) seemed to have changed afterwards after that stated period. Than I exchanged the preamp for another (cheap) model and make and it sounded now quite different: It sounded actually a lot better. Why ??? I don't know, because both seemed to have (almost) identical specs.

Probably two causes have come together: The spiders and suspensions of the chassis had been relaxed a bit by exercising them for "some" time and the sound seemed to have changed (surprisingly) by exchanging the preamp! If everything is psychological, I doubt it, but some aspects might be connected to it sometimes.
 
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