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Do "pre-amps" even exist?

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CharlesC

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When I read the heading I thought you might go down the route of how much time preamps are actually acting as amps rather than attenuators (given line level DAC inputs). Seems like most of it IMO, except perhaps in those low power tube systems.

In theory, digital attenuators on DACs could be problematic, if the DAC isn’t oversampling first. And it seems to me of the output impedance is ill-matched to the amp, we have a design or execution flaw at one end or the other. No?

It was explained to me that impedance matching was more of an issue where analog attenuators were involved. Not really an issue with modern sources having digital attenuators. So I was told.
 

majingotan

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In theory, digital attenuators on DACs could be problematic, if the DAC isn’t oversampling first. No?

I'm curious to see this in measurements. Kindly someone sent the Metrum Jade/Adagio NOS DAC with digital attenuator and use measurements at -20, -60 and -90 dBFS to see if this holds true or not.
 

b1daly

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In some ways it’s a legacy term, related to the era of phono stages and multiple sources like tuners and cassette decks.

The way to think about it now, IMO, is to obtain gear “fit for your purpose.”

There are a lot of different ways audio systems can be rigged up. If you listen exclusively to digital sources through a single converter, and have decent digital EQ on your playback device, then you can look for converter to that fits that need. The most important thing to control playback volume. Do you need a nice feeling knob? Remote? Visual feedback or display? Some ”power amps” have level controls. Some streaming devices have level controls. If you have multiple sources, a passive switcher with level attenuator might be perfect.

How much room do you have? Is appearance important? Power consumption or heat considerations.

Is it a system for critical listening or for playing video games?

I find that these more practical concerns have more impact on my enjoyment of music than theoretical concerns about sound quality.

The rest is semantics.
 

rwortman

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Preamps certainly exist. The question should whether they are necessary. The answer is it depends on the output level of your sources, the input sensitivity of your amplifier, and how loud you want to listen. If I am playing one of those black vinyl things loudly I am almost at minimum attenuation on my Schiit Saga. If I had a lower output cartridge or wanted even more volume, I would need some positive gain. My DAC, my CD player, and my recording interface have enough output to drive the amp to deafening levels. The other question is whether one needs source selection and level control separated from the power amplifier. It’s debatable. There are valid arguments either way. Gear geeks just like having lots of boxes.
 
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