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Do paint and carpets affect the sound?

DanielT

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Carpets , yes absolutely they can. Colors can affect moods but like this.16:30 into the video and then onwards ..It was like eh ... something eh ..

What is he waffling about?

Edit:
But ok, I have an open mind. Is there any truth in what he says? Note, audible differences.
(let me add, no I do not believe in that)


Edit:
I'm taking this favorite on ASR. It's been a while since I saw it: :)

 
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alex-z

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Well the paint obviously doesn't from a literal perspective, but I do enjoy the disappearing act of black speakers on a dark background. Makes my brain less capable of determining "oh, that came from a certain speaker", which can break immersion during movies or live recorded music.
 

Propheticus

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Just like even a broken clock is right twice a day, these audio gurus (snake oil peddlers) are not always and 100% wrong.
That's precisely it, they speak to common sense and relate the bogus to genuine an valid scientific/physics principles. You need to understand these principles to see where they make illogical jumps in cause/effect and draw unfounded conclusions (that of course lead to ultimately 1 conclusion: my product solves your 'problem')

I'm not going to participate in the mental exercise to filter which parts of what these guys say is holding any truth (and give them credit for it?), while their overall story is bull and aimed at swindling those that fall for it.

How many times must we confirm he is full of shhhh?
 
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DanielT

DanielT

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Well, this with the subjective. That in itself I have absolutely nothing against, on the contrary. Imagine how sad it would be if everyone thought the same. But to make the subjective an objective truth.

Yes, I know now perhaps philosophical aspects of what truth is approaching us. Psychology in the wider sense and so on.It's a hassle. But at the same time it is very interesting.:)
 

Astoneroad

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That's precisely it, they speak to common sense and relate the bogus to genuine an valid scientific/physics principles. You need to understand these principles to see where they make illogical jumps in cause/effect and draw unfounded conclusions (that of course lead to ultimately 1 conclusion: my product solves your 'problem')
... like refute Einstein and Relativity... because he married his cousin? Maybe that's how he (Einstein) came up with the idea... and he (Danny) came up with "Mellow Yellow". It's amazing the investment against facts and truth. Good thing my Ouija board never lies... for $3k it really lifts the veil on nonsense.

shutterstock_693915274.jpg
 
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DanielT

DanielT

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I just think we should not help in generating traffic, clicks, views on these channels.
No danger, as long as you write this:

Come on . Are you American? Your ancestors had rolled such a person in oil and feathers.

Edit:
It was Tar. In any case, Europeans have apparently also used it:


For Danny, of course I mean figuratively.:)
 
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tmtomh

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Carpet obviously makes a difference, as far as I know always measurable, and usually quite easily audible. The effect is not subtle in most cases, so as far as I'm aware there is zero controversy about that.

As for paint, I would imagine that paint itself might possibly make a difference that is measurable, but unless you're painting over a surface like metal or glass that is highly reflective, I would very much doubt that the difference would be within the realm of audibility. (For that matter, I would not entirely rule out the possibility that a highly textured matte paint vs a super-glossy, ultra-smooth-finish paint might produce a very small measurable difference, but again I would hypothesize that difference would be too small to be audible.)

As for paint color, of course not - however, there have been many, many studies over decades showing that humans do have different perceptual responses to different colors. I'm not familiar enough with the scientific literature to know how consistent those different responses are across gender, culture, and so on. But it certainly is possible - and I would say possible bordering on likely - that certain paint colors in a room could produce an objectively measurable change in people's subjective perceptions of sound.

Again, the question of repeatability is an open one there, and so as a practical matter paint color might not be a factor one can predict and therefore might be functionally irrelevant since its effects could never be predicted reliably. And of course I don't buy the idea that paint color objectively changes the sound.

But I am pretty sure that color does have measurable effects on subjective human sound perception.
 
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DanielT

DanielT

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Carpet obviously makes a difference, as far as I know always measurable, and usually quite easily audible. The effect is not subtle in most cases, so as far as I'm aware there is zero controversy about that.

As for paint, I would imagine that paint itself might possibly make a difference that is measurable, but unless you're painting over a surface like metal or glass that is highly reflective, I would very much doubt that the difference would be within the realm of audibility. (For that matter, I would not entirely rule out the possibility that a highly textured matte paint vs a super-glossy, ultra-smooth-finish paint might produce a very small measurable difference, but again I would hypothesize that difference would be too small to be audible.)

As for paint color, of course not - however, there have been many, many studies over decades showing that humans do have different perceptual responses to different colors. I'm not familiar enough with the scientific literature to know how consistent those different responses are across gender, culture, and so on. But it certainly is possible - and I would say possible bordering on likely - that certain paint colors in a room could produce an objectively measurable change in people's subjective perceptions of sound.

Again, the question of repeatability is an open one there, and so as a practical matter paint color might not be a factor one can predict and therefore might be functionally irrelevant since its effects could never be predicted reliably. And of course I don't buy the idea that paint color objectively changes the sound.

But I am pretty sure that color does have measurable effects on subjective human sound perception.
Yep, some things in their own way affect the sound. Carpets, thick ones yes. Or so everyone here at ASR says, has it really been measured? I'm seriously curious about that. Amir often says in his reviews of speakers: Use thick carpet ... but ...?

I do not doubt that light and colors can affect moods and the perception of the present. But it is very subjective.:)
 

mansr

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For that matter, I would not entirely rule out the possibility that a highly textured matte paint vs a super-glossy, ultra-smooth-finish paint might produce a very small measurable difference, but again I would hypothesize that difference would be too small to be audible.
For wavelengths approaching the pitch/depth of the texture, sure. Such wavelengths are far below what could possibly be audible.
 

Plcamp

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My anecdote is my heavily tiled washroom, which echoes like crazy until just two 2’x3’ rugs placed there. Giant difference with just that.

Even a little bit changes things a lot if your room is hard scape?

My theory is that’s why olde English castles were adorned with tapestries.
 
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DanielT

DanielT

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Some things may need to be measured to verify the difference. Note, but do it matters then? Measurable differences are always found, but audible? Now I'm talking about measurable marginal phenomena. How audible are they?

However, anyone can, at any time, even if they are not interested in HiFi, sign on to this extreme case:
Completely empty room, without any furniture in, completely naked room VS then furnished (with lots of furniture, bookshelves, rugs and so on)

There is no one on this earth( unless they have a hearing impairment) that does not hear that difference in sound.
 
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Astoneroad

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It hasn't been publicly announced yet... but Paul & Danny are promoting a line of Audiophool paint. The first color to be released is "Booby Blue"... with the ad campaign of "Birds of a Feather... lie together"
1654797040083.png
 
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DanielT

DanielT

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They seem to be nice guys. Especially Paul.:)

But then sell. What they, Paul, apparently do not know how it works.

Well..discovered in the 70's?....
Ohms law ?

 

Soandso

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Among factors like a pigment's inherent surface tension, the pigment's own surface roughness and the pigment color's wavelength it is the color's wavelength which, for example, makes yellow more reflective of sound than red, which in turn is more reflective than green (ie. more sound bounces off painted walls in the order of yellow > red > green).

As far as different colored paint containing equal pigment content on a very smooth wall surface I estimate that could work out to yellow paint being 1dB[A] more reflective of sound than red paint, which red paint in turn could be 1db[A] more reflective of sound than green paint. Making for an extrapolation of yellow paint being in theory 2dB[A] more sound reflective than green paint of the same pigment concentration on a smooth wall surface.

EDIT: Above I have above mistakenly inverted the color graduations and in a down-thread post correct those. Which is to say the correct extrapolated order of reflectivity is green>red>yellow based on the scientific report I cite as my source down-thread. And the correct extrapolated order of respective dB[A] reflectivity should be likewise inverted. I am deliberately not changing the mistakes I wrote here in the 1st paragraph and am not changing the different dB relationships I wrote here in the 2nd paragraph, just alerting readers to my color/sound order errors here.
 
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Propheticus

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Except when you're colour blind, then it's a total crapshoot.

Next up: what type of sunglasses should I wear to mute harsh highs?

I like polarised glasses, because they let through the direct light, but filter out the light that got polarised while being reflected.
In effect it reduces destructive interference messing with the colour of my listening experience...
 

mightycicadalord

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Except when you're colour blind, then it's a total crapshoot.

Next up: what type of sunglasses should I wear to mute harsh highs?

I like polarised glasses, because they let through the direct light, but filter out the light that got polarised while being reflected.
In effect it reduces destructive interference messing with the colour of my listening experience...

Pit vipers obviously.
 

mansr

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Among factors like a pigment's inherent surface tension, the pigment's own surface roughness and the pigment color's wavelength it is the color's wavelength which, for example, makes yellow more reflective of sound than red, which in turn is more reflective than green (ie. more sound bounces off painted walls in the order of yellow > red > green).

As far as different colored paint containing equal pigment content on a very smooth wall surface I estimate that could work out to yellow paint being 1dB[A] more reflective of sound than red paint, which red paint in turn could be 1db[A] more reflective of sound than green paint. Making for an extrapolation of yellow paint being in theory 2dB[A] more sound reflective than green paint of the same pigment concentration on a smooth wall surface.
I can't quite parse all of that, but it doesn't seem right.
 
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