Do internal speaker wires matter.

[Front Row]

Paul McGowan of PS Audio had a recent YouTube post about a disappointing practice by speaker manufacturers putting in thin gauge wire inside speakers. I have always wondered if it matters. I see audiophiles buying expensive external cables to power their speakers. However, when you open the speaker cabinet there is this thin copper wire running from the external connections to the speaker. Paul was agitated by this and opined that it was not a good practice but did not offer any scientific data that it undermined audio quality, Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker? Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?

 

[TimVG]

*This expensive wire will subsequently be soldered to 10c spade connectors, followed by a thin tinsel wire, followed by a voice coil which features simple copper cable.

 

[BrokenEnglishGuy]

i think paul need to stop posting videos and improve his products xD it's important to create a community who believe in ps audio but make competitive product it's more important

Also Paul wanna make 5k 10 and 20k speakers... if he can't make a decent speaker at 1000 2000 usd... meh

 

[FrantzM]

i think paul need to stop posting videos and improve his products xD it's important to create a community who believe in ps audio but make competitive product it's more important

Also Paul wanna make 5k 10 and 20k speakers... if he can't make a decent speaker at 1000 2000 usd... meh

Better;, we must stop feeding Paul's BS with our re-posting these.
Please! No more Paul Mc G mentions here. Please!

 

[Front Row]

Better, we must stop feeding Paul's BS with our re-posting these.
Please no more Paul Mc G mention here. Please!

It's not so much Paul's statement but my question.

 

[preload]

No, not any more than the extent that external speaker wires matter.

But if you truly believe that external speaker cables make large audible differences, then yes you'd better start cracking open your speaker boxes and replacing the wiring with silver hyperspiral cryo cable. But don't stop there, be sure to open up your amplifier and replace the shoddy wiring in there. And goodness, did you know audio is going through the PC board tracings? Better scratch those off with a screwdriver and replace it with silver tracings.

 

[bo_knows]

Paul McGowan of PS Audio had a recent YouTube post about a disappointing practice by speaker manufacturers putting in thin gauge wire inside speakers. I have always wondered if it matters. I see audiophiles buying expensive external cables to power their speakers. However, when you open the speaker cabinet there is this thin copper wire running from the external connections to the speaker. Paul was agitated by this and opined that it was not a good practice but did not offer any scientific data that it undermined audio quality, Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker? Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?

Q: Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker?
A: I don't think so. The manufacturer of the speaker (engineer) took that into the consideration.
Q: Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?
A: See above answer.
Disclaimer: I'm not a speaker builder or EE engineer but if you replace internal wiring with a much larger diameter cable, you will/could reduce the resistance (in this case impedance) and "could" potentially shift cross-over points.

Solution: If you are really concerned with the internal wiring and crossover components quality parts, buy a better build speaker. I know, most of us are tempted to mess with the internals but unless you really know what you are doing, better live this to the manufacturer. My two cents.
Lik

 

[EdW]

All decent speaker manufacturers (e.g. the likes of KEF, Revel etc) will have maximised the performance of their product. If they thought that a few extra pennies on the internal wiring would have given an advantage they’d have seized the opportunity. Although they might have been bothered that the speaker was that sensitive to damping factor.
If PS audio wants to design and sell high end audio products one possible route to product improvement is an obsession with high end engineering. So that this is not seen as being anti PS I’d recommend that to anyone trying to sell a product on its audio performance of course.

 

[Steve Dallas]

Define "thin." It only needs to be thick enough to transfer the current. Sixteen gauge is always plenty for such a short run. Eighteen or 20 gauge most likely are as well, although I have not done the math.

Some people believe the last meter of mains wire matters after the electricity has traveled through who knows how many meters of who knows what Romex in the attic and walls, then terminates at an 85 cent socket. Yep. Better spend several hundred or thousand dollars on that last meter.

 

[bo_knows]

All decent speaker manufacturers (e.g. the likes of KEF, Revel etc) will have maximised the performance of their product. If they thought that a few extra pennies on the internal wiring would have given an advantage they’d have seized the opportunity. Although they might have been bothered that the speaker was that sensitive to damping factor.
If PS audio wants to design and sell high end audio products one possible route to product improvement is an obsession with high end engineering. So that this is not seen as being anti PS I’d recommend that to anyone trying to sell a product on its audio performance of course.

I don't think wiring and crossover parts in my KEF R500 are the same "quality" as in KEF reference 3.
They sure did seize the opportunity there and it's listed in all their marketing. Internal wiring looks like some external high-end speaker cable in the ref series. Does this makes any audible difference, I don't know but sure is part of their marketing.

 

[EdW]

I don't think wiring and crossover parts in my KEF R500 are the same "quality" as in KEF reference 3.
They sure did seize the opportunity there and it's listed in all their marketing. Internal wiring looks like some external high-end speaker cable in the ref series. Does this makes any audible difference, I don't know but sure is part of their marketing.

Yup! You’ve got to meet customer expectations when it has been falsely directed toward pretty wiring by these purveyors of nonsense!

 

[Steve Dallas]

Serious question: Do these mongers of BS actually believe what they say, or do they just say it anyway? I know the pressure is on to maintain a continuous stream of clickbait...

 

[Vini darko]

Take a look at the lead outs on the caps and resistors in the crossover. Internal wire really doesn't need to be thicker than that for most applications. 0.8mm solid core is just fine.
Now for very high power woofers yes it's worth having a thicker wire (and inductors)1.5mm should do it.

 

[Thomas savage]

Yes, they might be wired up wrong and just generally not terminated very securely.

They also matter when you start ripping them all out and forget what goes where.

Take pictures man !

 

[Thomas savage]

Paul McGowan of PS Audio had a recent YouTube post about a disappointing practice by speaker manufacturers putting in thin gauge wire inside speakers. I have always wondered if it matters. I see audiophiles buying expensive external cables to power their speakers. However, when you open the speaker cabinet there is this thin copper wire running from the external connections to the speaker. Paul was agitated by this and opined that it was not a good practice but did not offer any scientific data that it undermined audio quality, Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker? Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?

Easily provable hypothesis, McClowan likely didn't bother doing that and just spouted some shite.

In other news McClowan says my mums more friendly after 3 wines , can't argue that tbf and she likes a shyster.

 

[cjm2077]

Q: Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker?
A: I don't think so. The manufacturer of the speaker (engineer) took that into the consideration.
Q: Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?
A: See above answer.
Disclaimer: I'm not a speaker builder or EE engineer but if you replace internal wiring with a much larger diameter cable, you will/could reduce the resistance (in this case impedance) and "could" potentially shift cross-over points.

Solution: If you are really concerned with the internal wiring and crossover components quality parts, buy a better build speaker. I know, most of us are tempted to mess with the internals but unless you really know what you are doing, better live this to the manufacturer. My two cents.
Lik

The change in wire resistance over such small lengths is going to be negligible when looking at the stack up of tolerances that already exist in the crossover. Unless you go to an unreasonable extreme. It is very common in electronics to use higher gauge wire between enclosures, and then smaller gauge internally where you know the resistances will be very small. And then you get down to sizing traces on boards, which are often even finer but for incredibly short lengths in comparison. Knowing where and when certain specs matter is part of being a good engineer.

 

[Shazb0t]

Paul McGowan of PS Audio had a recent YouTube post

This is where you went wrong.

 

[Front Row]

Q: Does it matter that there is thin gauge wire inside the speaker?
A: I don't think so. The manufacturer of the speaker (engineer) took that into the consideration.
Q: Should we open our speaker cabinets now and remove this wire and install thicker gauge wire to gain better audio quality?
A: See above answer.
Disclaimer: I'm not a speaker builder or EE engineer but if you replace internal wiring with a much larger diameter cable, you will/could reduce the resistance (in this case impedance) and "could" potentially shift cross-over points.

Solution: If you are really concerned with the internal wiring and crossover components quality parts, buy a better build speaker. I know, most of us are tempted to mess with the internals but unless you really know what you are doing, better live this to the manufacturer. My two cents.
Lik

I really don't have any desire to change things. I was surprised in the video that step was recommended.

 

[Front Row]

All decent speaker manufacturers (e.g. the likes of KEF, Revel etc) will have maximised the performance of their product. If they thought that a few extra pennies on the internal wiring would have given an advantage they’d have seized the opportunity. Although they might have been bothered that the speaker was that sensitive to damping factor.
If PS audio wants to design and sell high end audio products one possible route to product improvement is an obsession with high end engineering. So that this is not seen as being anti PS I’d recommend that to anyone trying to sell a product on its audio performance of course.

I had a similar thought. As an owner of Revels, I couldn't believe that company would undermine their own products by cutting corners to save a few cents.

 

[Front Row]

This is where you went wrong.

I watched about thirty videos and have grown dismayed with some of the advice given. I realize there will be a bias because he is selling audio products, but some of the conclusions are not based on science or data but conjecture.