Distortion down to -300 dB, what exactly does that mean physically?

[Geert]

When I do that I get nulls of -110 db which is mainly the noise floor of the ADC in use. I don't see any noise floor modulation when running the appropriate tests.

Indeed, we have that other thread where people have been nulling DAC's for weeks. Most diff's don't show audible differences. So the question remains whats Watt's chasing that we don't yet know how to measure, or is audible below the accepted hearing limits (refering to lets say -100dB, not the -350dB noise shaping accuracy)?

 

[Spkrdctr]

The new up to date term you guys are looking for is "Voodoo Quantum Mechanics". Remember, you heard it from me first! It is the reason that we hear so much stuff that is not measurable. Until we delve into this and really understand it, audio will not progress. Some leaders in this important field are Shinyata and Audioquest. Serious cutting edge research being done by both companies. So, get your mind ready to understand Voodoo Quantum Mechanics. Oh, and under this larger and more inclusive term is the Voodoo Quantum Entanglement science. Thank heavens for Audioquest and Shinyata saving the day for audiophiles!

 

[j_j]

Maybe I’m missing something, and opinions aside, I personally thought Peterzuid conducted himself in quite a reasonable manner?

Repeatedly evading issues, stating unsupported opinions, and attempting to play 'let's you and him fight' are simply put, not "reasonable". Nor, to put it bluntly, is evading the actual physical meaning of 300dB repeatedly, without comment or discussion, only to continue to insist on using terminology that does not have any meaning in the art, refusing to define terms, etc.

All trolling.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Indeed, we have that other thread where people have been nulling DAC's for weeks. Most diff's don't show audible differences. So the question remains whats Watt's chasing that we don't yet know how to measure, or is audible below the accepted hearing limits (refering to lets say -100dB, not the -350dB noise shaping accuracy)?

Until he can prove he hears anything without peeking, my guess is there is nothing there. He is fooling himself.

Richard Feynman quote:
The first principle is that you must not fool yourself and you are the easiest person to fool.

 

[sarumbear]

Advertising ... that's it.

Americans have a word for that: untruth

 

[Andysu]

what would the s/n ratio be of out of space be ? i don't know ?

 

[sq225917]

Well, being a vacuum.....

 

[egellings]

S/N ratios are for signal sources and amplification. Speakers do not have that sort of a specification. Why would complete emptiness have such a spec?

 

[AdamG]

Well, being a vacuum.....

Upright or handheld?

 

[j_j]

Upright or handheld?

6L6GC perhaps?

 

[AdamG]

6L6GC perhaps?

One of these?

 

[j_j]

One of these?

View attachment 216815

Why not? They've got vacuum, they're warm, and they add lots of warmth to the whole room!

Maybe that's what's wrong with Class D, they add coolth instead?

After all, that low-order distortion sounds so good, right?

 

[AdamG]

Why not? They've got vacuum, they're warm, and they add lots of warmth to the whole room!

Maybe that's what's wrong with Class D, they add coolth instead?

After all, that low-order distortion sounds so good, right?

Are we still talking about the same thing? I think I have a train to catch….

 

[j_j]

Are we still talking about the same thing? I think I have a train to catch….

Quick! Don't miss it!

 

[DarginMahkum]

It is an old thread but I recently listened to those claims live at the CanJam. I wish he would have a setup that he can prove that one day, as he claims that "someone" has tested and agreed that he can hear the difference between -200 and -300 dB. If Charles Darwin would be with us in the room, he would be very confused with his explanation that our brain possess the capability to process some information that is not needed for a large predator like us in the evolutionary process, that doesn't need to hear the insects walking on a tree, and that our auditory receptors are also a bottle neck - which can be confirmed with the other predators like cats which need to hear the tiniest of the noises in the wild, with more sophisticated receptors in larger numbers and a more sophisticated auditory system. We didn't evolve to be audiophiles in the end, but to survive.

 

[fpitas]

the other predators like cats which need to hear the tiniest of the noises in the wild

And still don't hear anything near -300dB. The claim is so absurd it makes me wonder about his sanity.

 

[egellings]

And still don't hear anything near -300dB. The claim is so absurd it makes me wonder about his sanity.

Are there any sounds in the entire universe, from the loudest exploding star to the softest whisper on earth, that are that far part, dB-wise? Note: pretend that a star exploding is an audible sound, what with there being no atmosphere to carry it in outer space.

 

[fpitas]

Are there any sounds in the entire universe, from the loudest exploding star to the softest whisper on earth, that are that far part, dB-wise? Note: pretend that a star exploding is an audible sound, what with there being no atmosphere to carry it in outer space.

Only in an audiophile system.

 

[DVDdoug]

Are there any sounds in the entire universe, from the loudest exploding star to the softest whisper on earth, that are that far part, dB-wise? Note: pretend that a star exploding is an audible sound, what with there being no atmosphere to carry it in outer space.

Probably.

Ah... The loudest sound ever made = 310dB !!!! A star exploding would obviously be louder...

On Earth you can only go up to around 170dB SPL (I think the limit is somewhere in that ballpark) before the negative-half of the wave becomes a vacuum and clips. You can go louder on the positive-pressure side but the sound is distorted. I don't think there's a limit to atmospheric pressure, but I'll bet some bad things happen (maybe extreme heating?) in addition to the obvious... blown eardrums and death )

And I assume there are sounds around -300dB SPL. How much sound does an electron whizzing around a nucleus make??? But on earth they would be masked (drowned-out) by other sounds. (Google says the quietest place on earth is an anechoic chamber at around -9dB SPL.)

And as you get very-near the edge of the atmosphere, sounds probably get very-quiet.

In space there is no sound (minus infinity dB). That's probably not absolutely-true... There may be a few atoms/molecules or other mysterious space particles "floating around" and one might occasionally hit your ear (or sound sensing device). Is that "sound"? Does it matter?

Minus infinity also exists "everyday" in the digital domain but that's definitely not "sound". IIRC, 32-bit floating point audio has a range somewhere greater than -1000dB to +1000dB (ignoring the numerical value of zero which is -infinity). There is also a 64-bit floating-point format.

 

[Curvature]

170dB SPL

194dB SPL or 1 atmosphere before air becomes nonlinear.

Edit: Was 2dB off. See @j_j's post below.