If you please, how did you contact them? I submitted a support ticket and never heard back. I have a DM7 with 2 speakers and 4 subs and am interested in seeing if it improves over my current setup.
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Dirac Live Bass Control coming to Dirac Live Stereo This YEAR!!
theREALdotnet
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That’s what I did, too.
theREALdotnet
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I believe what DLBC does can also be achieved with REW and Rephase and a lot of work, not to mention a lot of learning. I don’t think DLBC does anything magic, but it hugely simplifies integrating subwoofers and makes a rather complex procedure very straight-forward.
Check out serko70’s posts and videos, if you‘ve gone through that process you will absolutely dread changing anything about your speaker and subwoofer placement or settings. You would have to go through an involved procedure with many steps every time you change a little thing, let alone add another subwoofer.
With DLBC it is as easy as finding the best natural spots for your subwoofers (even response without big peaks or drops), then let the software work out the EQ, delay and phase settings. I basically ran the REW generator putting out pink periodic sub cal noise and watched the RTA plot while carrying the subwoofer around the room, until I liked what I saw. DLBC did the rest.
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It's worth noting that DLBC takes the inevitable interactions among the subwoofer/s and the main speakers into account... also, as expected more subwoofers allow more degrees of freedom for the algorithm with better results
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AudioKC
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I see your point and agee on sub integration (I did it once, found phase and crossover point after multiple experimentations). Multi sub integration is much difficult to manage using REW and EQs.
my motivation for DLBC also is to reduce bass frequency for mains, to reduce distortion. I even closed ports for my revels (no need for port when I do not need extentions, and port is a massive producer of distortion and phase shift). One of the benefits of reduced distortion that you can listen on much higher volumes,
lovely (big change for bookshelve speaker).Basically DLBC is a package of measuring technique, filter design technology and active crossover processor.
Now I set DLBC for my main system with Topping DM7, Hypex NCore, Revels 105 and Monolith Sub. Could not ask for more
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Do you guys think it's worth it to ask for the Bass Control upgrade and get a multichannel DAC for a simple 2.1 desk setup?
My sub is right next to me and works well the way I set it up.
With Bass Control and something like a Motu M4 I would have to ditch my beautiful Denon integrated and use software volume instead of the metal volume knob.
The natural roll off of my port pugged LS50 is at around 70Hz so I would not even need the high pass feature of DLBC.
The way I understand it, Dirac Live BC applies delay to each speaker and sub, sets the phase of the subs and create a low/highpass filter accordingly.
And then it corrects the whole spectrum in regards to magnitude and phase as usual. Am I getting this right and do you guys think it's worth to go for Bass Control in my situation?
My sub is right next to me and works well the way I set it up.
With Bass Control and something like a Motu M4 I would have to ditch my beautiful Denon integrated and use software volume instead of the metal volume knob.
The natural roll off of my port pugged LS50 is at around 70Hz so I would not even need the high pass feature of DLBC.
The way I understand it, Dirac Live BC applies delay to each speaker and sub, sets the phase of the subs and create a low/highpass filter accordingly.
And then it corrects the whole spectrum in regards to magnitude and phase as usual. Am I getting this right and do you guys think it's worth to go for Bass Control in my situation?
theREALdotnet
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Ah yes, good point. Before DLBC my subwoofer was running in parallel with the mains. Now, the mains are high-passed and their drivers have to do a lot less excursion.
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For a single sub and single seating position it's not worth it. Much more cost effective and similar results by using the high-pass and built-in sub crossover, if you have those features.
EDIT: Should point out Dirac in general is absolutely worth it, no matter the setup.
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theREALdotnet
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As promised, a proper REW sweep. Not sure why the RTA plot looked like that. I also added a second subwoofer, so the bass is smoother now and extends further down.
And the step response:
My initial impressions after a week, as posted to the Dirac beta support channel (minus potential noticed bugs):
Basically, it seems pretty good for less complex sub systems and could get good for more complex systems with a little tweaking. Sorry, no time right now to post measurements.Impression so far after implementing on my 2.4 system.
1) Easy to impliment. Kudos. This is certainly easier to implement than Accourate
2) Description of upmix is confusing. Is this just applying Dirac to the lower frequencies?
Suggestions:
1) Add option to also run mains full range with no crossover. My subs are to smooth the bass response across room modes so I want the additional LF from my mains I don't want to take it out. T
2) Add option to have multiple subwoofer subgroups, including for left and right subs. I expected this software would allow for more than a simple single crossover for all subs (and maybe it will). I want some of my subs to run to 250-350 hz but all the subs are being tested for mono. For example, I want to run my Dirac like my own filters: Mains full range, separate crossovers for my two mono subs, and separate crossovers for the two larger stereo subs.
3) Add an option to have the software calculate the optimal crossover based on the response curve. This seems like a no-brainer as you will constantly have people writing things like "it sucks out the bass" because they are using the "recommended" crossover when the recommended doesn't work for them. Of course, this will take some computing time, but it will take out the final piece of guesswork for a lot of casual end users.
For most of these, you have already done the math. The amount of additional functionality that could be gained and market share thereby captured seems like a much smaller increment.
Thanks again for letting me join the beta I am looking forward to implementing on my 2.1 system when i get the time.
Following up here after some experimentation integrating DLBC into an existing active XO setup:
It took some figuring how to get all the routing set up. I used Blackhole 16ch as a virtual input for DLBC and created a 4ch filter with LR + 2 subs which I then used as a plugin within Hang Loose Convolver Host. The filter set I created for my XO within HLC I used bass and subwoofer impulses that allowed DLBC to take control of the XO in that region. In the pic below showing HLC you can see that filter bank 2 is selected and has XO points at 350 and 3500kHz (HP/LP for bass/mid & mid/tweet) indicated within the filter label but in bank 1 you can see a typical XO at 75, 350 and 3700kHz for a 3 way + sub(s). I added in MEquailzer because it has good metering capabilities and I can give the subs a little boost as Dirac seems to have lowered the overall SPL somehow.
My channel filters within HLC are: bass, bass, mid, mid, tweet, tweet, sub1, sub2 but I bypass it and send the sub outputs directly to my output device which is a Okto Dac8 Pro with channel assignments: Lb, Lm, Lt, Rb, Rm, Rt, sub1, sub2. Input is Blackhole 2ch so using this with SoundSource allows me to use the DLBC systemwide or just for select apps.
As you can see, I created a bunch of filters in DLBC playing with different XO placement. My mains go really low so I've got quite a bit of flexibility where I want to put it. I'll get some measurements soon with MMM method and report back. I have measurements from my previous attempts convolving 2ch with Dirac and my own creations in REW with RePhase.
With an A/B plugin you could conceivably toggle between a Audiolense/Accurate filter and one with DLBC.
Sounds good, currently enjoying the XO at 61Hz cranked pretty loud with some reference Floyd going. Time for a drinky.
It took some figuring how to get all the routing set up. I used Blackhole 16ch as a virtual input for DLBC and created a 4ch filter with LR + 2 subs which I then used as a plugin within Hang Loose Convolver Host. The filter set I created for my XO within HLC I used bass and subwoofer impulses that allowed DLBC to take control of the XO in that region. In the pic below showing HLC you can see that filter bank 2 is selected and has XO points at 350 and 3500kHz (HP/LP for bass/mid & mid/tweet) indicated within the filter label but in bank 1 you can see a typical XO at 75, 350 and 3700kHz for a 3 way + sub(s). I added in MEquailzer because it has good metering capabilities and I can give the subs a little boost as Dirac seems to have lowered the overall SPL somehow.
My channel filters within HLC are: bass, bass, mid, mid, tweet, tweet, sub1, sub2 but I bypass it and send the sub outputs directly to my output device which is a Okto Dac8 Pro with channel assignments: Lb, Lm, Lt, Rb, Rm, Rt, sub1, sub2. Input is Blackhole 2ch so using this with SoundSource allows me to use the DLBC systemwide or just for select apps.
As you can see, I created a bunch of filters in DLBC playing with different XO placement. My mains go really low so I've got quite a bit of flexibility where I want to put it. I'll get some measurements soon with MMM method and report back. I have measurements from my previous attempts convolving 2ch with Dirac and my own creations in REW with RePhase.
With an A/B plugin you could conceivably toggle between a Audiolense/Accurate filter and one with DLBC.
Sounds good, currently enjoying the XO at 61Hz cranked pretty loud with some reference Floyd going. Time for a drinky.
Keep us posted. I'm a couple of steps behind you and also beta testing DLBC on a PC (Mele Quieter 3 runnin Windows 11 with JRiver MC 30 as my plugin host, and a standalone DL processsor for measurement). In the past I've run DL3 at the top of the digital stack in a two channel arrangement with Delphonica providing the high/low pass for the subs at the end of the chain. As I understand this, DLBC will provide the high/low pass between mains and subs, so no need for any other crossovers. I will still place the DLBC in front of the PEQ I do on my LS 50 Metas for both the measurement and the playback because I want Dirac to measure my PEQ'd LS 50's before suggesting it's own filter for the higher frequencies.Following up here after some experimentation integrating DLBC into an existing active XO setup:
It took some figuring how to get all the routing set up. I used Blackhole 16ch as a virtual input for DLBC and created a 4ch filter with LR + 2 subs which I then used as a plugin within Hang Loose Convolver Host. The filter set I created for my XO within HLC I used bass and subwoofer impulses that allowed DLBC to take control of the XO in that region. In the pic below showing HLC you can see that filter bank 2 is selected and has XO points at 350 and 3500kHz (HP/LP for bass/mid & mid/tweet) indicated within the filter label but in bank 1 you can see a typical XO at 75, 350 and 3700kHz for a 3 way + sub(s). I added in MEquailzer because it has good metering capabilities and I can give the subs a little boost as Dirac seems to have lowered the overall SPL somehow.
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My channel filters within HLC are: bass, bass, mid, mid, tweet, tweet, sub1, sub2 but I bypass it and send the sub outputs directly to my output device which is a Okto Dac8 Pro with channel assignments: Lb, Lm, Lt, Rb, Rm, Rt, sub1, sub2. Input is Blackhole 2ch so using this with SoundSource allows me to use the DLBC systemwide or just for select apps.
As you can see, I created a bunch of filters in DLBC playing with different XO placement. My mains go really low so I've got quite a bit of flexibility where I want to put it. I'll get some measurements soon with MMM method and report back. I have measurements from my previous attempts convolving 2ch with Dirac and my own creations in REW with RePhase.
With an A/B plugin you could conceivably toggle between a Audiolense/Accurate filter and one with DLBC.
Sounds good, currently enjoying the XO at 61Hz cranked pretty loud with some reference Floyd going. Time for a drinky.
I don't think I've got this nailed yet actually. After some long listening last night I noted some odd behavior with my bass response at times. So today I ran some test signals into DLBC only to discover that it's sending the sub signal to my bass drivers as well. It wasn't immediately noticeable because my mains are capable of going down to 30Hz by themselves but the excess energy they were getting below 30Hz blurs the soundstage. Back to the drawing board and overly complicated digital routing to try to get this to work properly....
Does anyone know how long it takes Dirac to respond to mails? I once asked a question and never received an answer.
Last week I filled in the form for student discount (this time with my uni email address) but didn't receive an answer yet.
Last week I filled in the form for student discount (this time with my uni email address) but didn't receive an answer yet.
Their service is actually very good. I've had occasion to use them recently and it took no more than a day.
I just just successfully completed my DLBC profile for 2.2 this afternoon with nine measurements, set the crossover to 150 hz, ran the DLBC and it appears to come out perfectly and plays well. I put the correction curve in the stand alone processor and it runs smoothly, and sounds really great. Only thing is, I would like to transfer the filter to the VST3 processor running on JRiver MC30, and it doesn't appear I can do that because that VST processssor will only show up as a stereo processor and not one with the custom set up (2.2) I need to run this filter. Anyone know a work around for this issue?
You could try doing what I'm attempting, might work better from a Windows approach. I'm using DLBC as a plugin within a plugin host like Element, Plague Bidule or Hang Loose Convolver Host - these act as a plugin within a plugin and you may be able to covertly use it in JRiver like this for 4ch. This way you can direct certain channels (LR) to JRiver and sub channels to DAC/analog out. Not sure if any of your other EQ has latency, might affect things...
Haven't gotten it to work yet but trying on a new machine with fresh account and I've sent Favio my findings so far which, hopefully, will lead to a solution.
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