Digital audio used to be stored on videotape — it was the only way we knew how

[Urvile]

 

[Hatto]

Nice! This is very interesting, thanks for sharing.

 

[ahofer]

Yeah, that's how the first DAT I used worked. 1985ish

 

[khensu]

I've still got one of those PCM processors! That one is the PCM-701ES. Mine is the 601ESD (which has a coax digital output).

 

[Tim Link]

I was interested in converting a VCR to digital tape recorder back in the early '90s but it was a bit too technical for me. I did, however record CDs on to VHS as analog with a stereo HiFi VCR and the results were quite good, sounding close enough to the CD that it was hard for me to tell the difference. VHS analog audio was much, much better than cassette tape. I would rent CDs from the library and record them on to tapes at low playback speed. You could put a lot of music on a single tape that way. I found out later that my little sister and her friends would listen to those tapes while they studied.

 

[Tim Link]

I was just given a mess of old electronics to sell, give away, or throw away. I think one of these PCM adapters may be included! I remember seeing some weird box that made no sense to me. I also got a bunch of VCRs and old CD players in the lot. I'll have a look when I get home.

Update - nope. It's just a VCR with a bunch of digital special effects features, like picture in picture and perfect freeze frame.

 

[Curvature]

DAT tapes are responsible for the awesome quality of a lot of 80s/90s music at the mastering stage.

 

[ocinn]

I love this guy. One of my favorite creators on YouTube. Is able to distill pretty technical concepts down into a really fun and entertaining format, that literally anyone can understand.

No one else can make a 40min video about laundry detergent or hot water kettles feel like a 5min long sarcastic comedy skit.

Side note: I would love to see a test with one of the professional versions of this (or a modified consumer version) that bypasses the AD and DA chips and can record and playback a digital PCM signal.

I would be curious to see the audio performance of VCR tape with these PCM signals without the degradation of the ancient AD/DA chips. I wonder if it can clear 16 bit. I’m sure it would fail to maintain phase/clock due to scan speed variation but it would be a neat experiment.

 

[tprevett]

Back in the 80s, my dad started his own recording studio, and that's exactly right. the Digital information was stored on VHS. Things were so much cooler back then.

 

[pseudoid]

I don't know why but I saved my original Sony PCM-F1 and it is lucky that it is out of reach for me to purge it from my inventory.
I remember when Sony mini-Disc was selling like hotcakes (numbers were like 50% of the music market) in Japan and when it was originally pitched as the 'perfect sound for ever' in the US market: It tanked.

DAT tapes are responsible for the awesome quality of a lot of 80s/90s music at the mastering stage.

But the HooliganBastards and their Shenanigans did everything to prevent the superior DAT format from reaching the hands of the consumer, because it really was near that real 'perfect sound for ever'!
Yeah, they told us that poor artist were going to starve to death if DAT became consumer format of choice.

[I shouldn't have to apologize for my rant!]
My Sony DTC59ES DAT deck and Sony WMD-D11 Walkman should also be purged from inventory.

 

[khensu]

I still have a Tascam DA20 and the venerable Sony SV-3700 in a closet although I only have a handful of tapes left… mostly from concerts I recorded on a Sony D7 or D8 back in the day.

As much as I loved it, there was no way DAT would have ever been a viable consumer format. Those transports with their microscopic parts were way too unreliable.

 

[Prana Ferox]

DAT didn't really stand a chance with consumers because it couldn't instantly seek and skip back and forth among tracks like a CD. It could do it, it just did it with tape slowness, and that wasn't the future.

Minidisc was cool tech but it didn't have a killer advantage for consumers over CDs, and being lossy was always going to be an uphill battle with audiophiles.

DCC added confusion and fragmentation to the market, making sure none of the three could reach the critical mass consumers would need for adoption. Just a really stupid time to have a format war. And then a few years later you had portable MP3 players anyway.

 

[pablolie]

That's the advantage of digital. You could store it on cuneiform clay tablets and it would make no difference.

 

[pablolie]

DAT didn't really stand a chance with consumers because it couldn't instantly seek and skip back and forth among tracks like a CD. It could do it, it just did it with tape slowness, and that wasn't the future.

Minidisc was cool tech but it didn't have a killer advantage for consumers over CDs, and being lossy was always going to be an uphill battle with audiophiles.

DCC added confusion and fragmentation to the market, making sure none of the three could reach the critical mass consumers would need for adoption. Just a really stupid time to have a format war. And then a few years later you had portable MP3 players anyway.

Wasn't Minidisc lossy? I recall just rejecting it on practical reasons - no one else had one, so you could not have shared media. Same with DAT: only reason to record stuff is to share it somehow, be it your car system or give some to your love interest or close friends. The innovative digital formats never offered themselves to any of it. And to this day I wonder if my car stereo (which is pretty good) really deserves better media than compact cassette... :-D

It was recordable CDs that made the huge difference to me. I recall plonking down a lot of $ for my first CD recorder, prolly around 1995 or so. But CDs were pretty much everywhere then, so the format was eminently re-usable.

 

[khensu]

Yes, minidisc used "ATRAC" (lossy) encoding, iirc. Never any interest from me. DCC was just a joke. I never even knew anyone that had one.

 

[pseudoid]

I did a historical spin around MiniDisc:

The MiniDisc format was based on ATRAC audio data compression, Sony's own proprietary compression code. Its successor, Hi-MD, would later introduce the option of linear PCM digital recording to meet audio quality comparable to that of a compact disc.

Excerpted from Sony's MZ-E30/E50 page: In 1995 approximately 1,080,000 MD machines and 10,000,000 blank discs were sold in Japan. Sony estimates that in 1996, 2,500,000 machines and 25,000,000 blanks will be sold. By March 2011 Sony had sold 22 million MD players. Sony has ceased development of MD devices, with the last of the players sold by March 2013;

As if the ATRAC compression was not a deal breaker the bonus came in the form of:

All consumer-grade MiniDisc devices feature a copy-protection scheme known as Serial Copy Management System. An unprotected disc or song can be copied without limit, but the copies can no longer be digitally copied. Later version1 ATRAC audio could only be copied on consumer equipment three or four times before artifacts became objectionable, as the ATRAC on the recording machine attempts to data reduce the already reduced signal. By version 4, the potential number of generations of copy had increased to around 15 to 20 depending on audio content.

I'll never forgive Sony just because of all the format-wars they engaged in and for the consternation/confusion they exerted on to the consumers.

 

[Doodski]

I did a historical spin around MiniDisc:

As if the ATRAC compression was not a deal breaker the bonus came in the form of:

I'll never forgive Sony just because of all the format-wars they engaged in and for the consternation/confusion they exerted on to the consumers.

I'm minidisc trained for Sony authorized service. At least I was when it was a current model. Fascinating mechatronics for sure. They had very few to no issues with circuitry and it was mostly sensors and lasers that required replacement. I enjoyed working on them very much. After working a DAT mechanism a minidisc was a welcomed sight because they where pretty nice to work on and where not prone to really complicated disassembly operations like a DAT had sometimes. The servo(s) calibration of a minidisc was much easier too. I worked on the minidisc car audio head units, minidisc portables and minidisc home audio units too. The portables caused the most issues and where very dense with the mechanism and floors of FPCs and PCBs crammed into the case.

 

[khensu]

Ah, yes. SCMS, or "scums" as it was not-so-affectionately called. That was one nice thing about the SV-3700. You could ignore it via dip switch settings.

 

[pseudoid]

Ah, yes. SCMS, or "scums" as it was not-so-affectionately called. That was one nice thing about the SV-3700. You could ignore it via dip switch settings.

Wasn't the Panasonic SV-3700 specifically designed as 'professional' gear?
And as such, you can't really tell a creator that FBI will come after them for a SCSM violation...
That only works in the consumer market.

 

[khensu]

Yes, it is a "professional" machine.