Denon AVR-X4800H AVR Review

[EWL5]

looking to put in the extra for the x4800 over the x3800 but...

non engineer here. unable to understand graphs and data.

could someone please explain in layman terms how the x4800 with the same low quality DACs as the x3800 is Recommended where as the x3800 in Not Recommended...?

thanks.

4800 advantages over the 3800:

1) Made in Japan
2) AL32 processing (32-bit extension and 192 kHz sampling), which can lower noise floor
3) Clock jitter reducer

The 4800 was a steal at a price that I just about paid for my 3800. I would have bought it w/o question if I didn't already have the 3800 (price is back to $2499 now so hopefully some of us got in on the deal).

 

[peng]

Just made an order for one of these.
I don't suppose it can run 5.1.4 in my living room and power zone 2 in my kitchen without external amps?

Obviously not at the same time, but otherwise it should be able to, check the owner's manual first for sure. In any other case, unless you need a lot of power for zone 2, 2 ch class D mini amps are cheap, less than $100.

 

[peng]

4800 advantages over the 3800:

1) Made in Japan
2) AL32 processing (32-bit extension and 192 kHz sampling), which can lower noise floor
3) Clock jitter reducer

The 4800 was a steal at a price that I just about paid for my 3800. I would have bought it w/o question if I didn't already have the 3800 (price is back to $2499 now so hopefully some of us got in on the deal).

Your 3800 is still going to be just as good sonically though. All the advantages you listed are just nice to have, but not audible, not without using the eyes anyway lol..

 

[techsamurai]

what cables would you recommend for interconnects - I was looking at the monolith 3ft RCA but with their square top but I might not be able to fit them in the AUX2 section of the Marantz8002 (AUX2 bottom middle) - those connections are much closer together compared to the 4800h. It's going to drive me mad if that happens and I have to return them and buy new ones...

Monolith RCA Cable - Silver - 3 Feet Chord, 24K Gold Plated Connectors, AL foil, OFC Copper Braided Shield

Read reviews and buy Monolith RCA Cable - Silver - 3 Feet Chord, 24K Gold Plated Connectors, AL foil, OFC Copper Braided Shield at Target. Choose from contactless Same Day Delivery, Drive Up and more.

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[peng]

what cables would you recommend for interconnects - I was looking at the monolith 3ft RCA but with their square top but I might not be able to fit them in the AUX2 section of the Marantz8002 (AUX2 bottom middle) - those connections are much closer together compared to the 4800h. It's going to drive me mad if that happens and I have to return them and buy new ones...

Monolith RCA Cable - Silver - 3 Feet Chord, 24K Gold Plated Connectors, AL foil, OFC Copper Braided Shield

Read reviews and buy Monolith RCA Cable - Silver - 3 Feet Chord, 24K Gold Plated Connectors, AL foil, OFC Copper Braided Shield at Target. Choose from contactless Same Day Delivery, Drive Up and more.

www.target.com

I would just buy their regular types.

Or the slighly better ones such as:

Still bulky, but should fit.

 

[techsamurai]

I would just buy their regular types.

Thanks, I bought both types so I can connect the LCR to the external amp and use the other ones for surrounds.

I'm curious to hear the 4800H - it's been 15 years since my last Denon and that audition lasted 1 week. I'll definitely set it up on day 1 to give Denon a fair chance to redeem themselves.

I watched a review of the 3800H (so funny to hear the same things I thought 15 years ago especially vis-a-vis the Marantz, they really don't change the AVRs much, it's just a DAC here and a HDMI board there) and also another comparing the 3800, 4800, and RZ50 and his findings were interesting.

 

[ban25]

Your 3800 is still going to be just as good sonically though. All the advantages you listed are just nice to have, but not audible, not without using the eyes anyway lol..

FWIW, the real difference between the 3800 and 4800 IMO is the presence of a component video/audio input on the 4800.

 

[techsamurai]

Is the 4800H offered in silver anywhere? I saw a picture of a silver one in a British video review. With its antiquated look, the silver version looked way better. Of course, we'll never get that in the States since we've never been worthy of the best looking finishes for their products as they love to remind us...

The knobs look really nice - I'm not even sure why Marantz makes a black version at all. Even the power button is a nice accent.

 

[peng]

Thanks, I bought both types so I can connect the LCR to the external amp and use the other ones for surrounds.

I'm curious to hear the 4800H - it's been 15 years since my last Denon and that audition lasted 1 week. I'll definitely set it up on day 1 to give Denon a fair chance to redeem themselves.

I watched a review of the 3800H (so funny to hear the same things I thought 15 years ago especially vis-a-vis the Marantz, they really don't change the AVRs much, it's just a DAC here and a HDMI board there) and also another comparing the 3800, 4800, and RZ50 and his findings were interesting.

Again, as said many times, Denon and Marantz equivalents won't have the claim of audible sound signatures except if you have superior hearing and use digital inputs for contents at sampling frequency at or below 48 kHz because Marantz use the slow roll off filter, that is now selectable so you can select the filter for the Denon sound.

People will still hear the imagined difference because they have been told they would, thousands of times.

The fact is, aside from the different dac filters, the rest of the parts and circuitry are the same. Measurements show that too.

If you are still bothered by it, that Marantz signature is preferred, there are two ways to fix it lol.

 

[rana_kirti]

self have owned and heard AVRs from different manufacturers with same speakers.

they all have a house sound. the presentation is different. different team making different AVRs at different places using different components and expecting them to sound exactly the same.....? not possible.

 

[rana_kirti]

FWIW, the real difference between the 3800 and 4800 IMO is the presence of a component video/audio input on the 4800.

no. there has to be a difference. several upgrades in the x4800 over the x3800 and expecting them to have the same performance? thts impossible.

yes differences can be subtle to more pronounced but differences will be there.

if that wasn't the case then everyone could buy the lowest level avr from a series and hope it sounds as good as the AVRs tiers above it. not possible.

 

[SCG]

The 4800 was a steal at a price that I just about paid for my 3800. I would have bought it w/o question if I didn't already have the 3800 (price is back to $2499 now so hopefully some of us got in on the deal).

Yes just got a tracking # from Adorama and will be here on Wed, that was definitely a flash sale steal.

Walmart had the TX-RZ70 for $1599 but I missed that one TX-RZ70 $1599

Will be interesting to see what waiting 6 weeks for Black Friday brings.

 

[EWL5]

Yes just got a tracking # from Adorama and will be here on Wed, that was definitely a flash sale steal.

Walmart had the TX-RZ70 for $1599 but I missed that one TX-RZ70 $1599

Will be interesting to see what waiting 6 weeks for Black Friday brings.

Who was the seller from the Walmart listing? I don't think Walmart is an authorized reseller for Onkyo...

 

[techsamurai]

Yes just got a tracking # from Adorama and will be here on Wed, that was definitely a flash sale steal.

Walmart had the TX-RZ70 for $1599 but I missed that one TX-RZ70 $1599

Will be interesting to see what waiting 6 weeks for Black Friday brings.

That's a massive sale on the RZ70. I'm curious to see what happens. Obviously, it's going to be hard to compete with full MSRP when something is nearly half the price.

 

[SCG]

It was from their 3rd party marketplace I believe the seller was either Electronic Expo or WW Stereo. I thought about it for a nano-second and they was gone. I and some others had some issues with Onks overheating in the past but that seems to not longer be an issue with them.

That was a great deal as it has Dirac Live RC included in the price, so would have been $150 cheaper than the X4800 at $1399 plus $350 Dirac Live RC, plus you can add Bass Control immediately today on the RZ70 if so desired.

 

[techsamurai]

Again, as said many times, Denon and Marantz equivalents won't have the claim of audible sound signatures except if you have superior hearing and use digital inputs for contents at sampling frequency at or below 48 kHz because Marantz use the slow roll off filter, that is now selectable so you can select the filter for the Denon sound.

Where do you select that filter?

 

[peng]

Where do you select that filter?

Sorry, I forgot that feature is only available for the flagship AV10.

It is mentioned on page 192 in the Owner's manual.

This is the first time Marantz subtly/virtually/sort of/almost/vaguely, admitted the so called/claimed "Marantz sound" (presumably the warm sound) is due to the DAC filter, as it rolls off the high frequencies.

Take a look:

If you think your hearing can discern such as minor roll off that mainly affect >15,000 Hz, then sure, you may hear a warmer sound depending on the kind of contents you listen to. The fact is, that's with digital contents at sampling rate of 44.1 kHz, if you listen to contents at higher than 48 kHz, there is little to 0 chance you can hear roll off that starts at much higher frequencies, that is in the ultrasonic range.

The AV10, in my opinion, is the best available and affordable (relatively speaking) AV preamp processor, that allows you to a) select Audyssey or Dirac Live, and b) Marantz sound or Denon sound lol.

 

[techsamurai]

Sorry, I forgot that feature is only available for the flagship AV10.

It is mentioned on page 192 in the Owner's manual.

This is the first time Marantz subtly/virtually/sort of/almost/vaguely, admitted the so called/claimed "Marantz sound" (presumably the warm sound) is due to the DAC filter, as it rolls off the high frequencies.

Take a look:

If you think your hearing can discern such as minor roll off that mainly affect >15,000 Hz, then sure, you may hear a warmer sound depending on the kind of contents you listen to. The fact is, that's with digital contents at sampling rate of 44.1 kHz, if you listen to contents at higher than 48 kHz, there is little to 0 chance you can hear roll off that starts at much higher frequencies, that is in the ultrasonic range.

View attachment 317742

The AV10, in my opinion, is the best available and affordable (relatively speaking) AV preamp processor, that allows you to a) select Audyssey or Dirac Live, and b) Marantz sound or Denon sound lol.

Well, my hearing tops out at 14.5khz (funny cause I hear that clearly but not 15khz) so I won't hear much of the Marantz rolloff.

I probably have my own Marantz roll-off filter going on too

 

[SCG]

I would just buy their regular types. Or the slighly better ones such as: Still bulky, but should fit.

I purchased both and they work well but the regular ones stick out way less from the back of the unit, and the locking mechanism on the 3P wasn't needed as much as I thought.

 

[SCG]

That's a massive sale on the RZ70. I'm curious to see what happens. Obviously, it's going to be hard to compete with full MSRP when something is nearly half the price.

Looks like it was also available at Newegg 3rd party marketplace for $1599 sold by Walt's TV TX-RZ70 $1599 so it might come back around again. Here's the website that listed both sellers for $1599 LowPi.com