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Denon AVR-X4700 AVR Review (Updated)

amper42

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Audirvana caches the entire song to the drive and if it's a playlist multiple tunes. I was playing Qobuz tunes via the internet and the modem lights went off due to an internet outage. I thought there goes the music? Instead, the music continued to play for 7 minutes while the internet was down and continued playing like nothing happened once the internet was back on. The Qobuz playlist never stopped while using Audirvana as the playback app. I imagine there has to be some limit but I was really shocked how much music it caches.

I have seen HEOS, the Qobuz app and Tidal all fail within a few seconds of an internet outage. It's really a great feature to have that amount of caching to the drive. It keeps the music playback on tap! :D

Try turning your modem off while playing back music and see how long it lasts. My bet is many apps from the on-line services don't cache much at all.
 

kevin1969

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Does the 4700 allow you to perform an Audessy calibration of speakers on Zone 2 or even manually set the speaker parameters for just Zone 2?

I should really just bite the bullet and print out the damn PDF and study it like it's the bar exam.
 

kevin1969

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Audirvana caches the entire song to the drive and if it's a playlist multiple tunes. I was playing Qobuz tunes via the internet and the modem lights went off due to an internet outage. I thought there goes the music? Instead, the music continued to play for 7 minutes while the internet was down and continued playing like nothing happened once the internet was back on. The Qobuz playlist never stopped while using Audirvana as the playback app. I imagine there has to be some limit but I was really shocked how much music it caches.

I have seen HEOS, the Qobuz app and Tidal all fail within a few seconds of an internet outage. It's really a great feature to have that amount of caching to the drive. It keeps the music playback on tap! :D

Try turning your modem off while playing back music and see how long it lasts. My bet is many apps from the on-line services don't cache much at all.

Ahh yes that would be one advantage of running something local on a PC/Mac. A lot of the appliance based products like Sonos, Bluesound are definitely limited by buffers so they don't cache as much of the music locally as you noticed. I actually ran into an issue once where Tidal was giving out bad server info for the location of music files. This was causing the buffers to run out because the devices we're pulling the music file data down from across the country instead of using local content servers. You don't need a lot of bandwidth to pull music content data off the internet but you do need the servers to be as close as possible as the clients. You can install Wireshark and actually watch this process happen on a computer that's downloading content from a music service.
 

amper42

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Does the 4700 allow you to perform an Audessy calibration of speakers on Zone 2 or even manually set the speaker parameters for just Zone 2?

I should really just bite the bullet and print out the damn PDF and study it like it's the bar exam.


I keep my Denon 4700 manual handy in PDF form so I can search for keywords. Audyssey only works on the MAIN zone. The other disadvantage to using ZONE 2/3 is they will not work if amp assign is set to preamp mode.

To get Zone 2 to work you need to set it up in amp assign and use the Denon internal amps to power Zone 2 speakers. If you try using the pre-outs Zone 2 will not work correctly. Page 264 of the Denon 4700 shows you can adjust Bass and Treble with Zone 2, adjust volume, setup a high pass filter or configure mono or stereo mode. See below:

Zone2.png
 

amper42

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You mean if the whole receiver is in pre-amp mode right?

I found ZONE2 and the A/B Front configurations are both limited to using the Denon internal amps.
1. If pre-amp mode is selected in Denon Amp Assign = no Zone 2 available.
2. If Zone 2 is setup in Amp Assign and I try to use the Pre-outs of the Height 2 channels for Zone 2. Did not work properly.
3. If A/B Fronts is selected in Amp assign - trying to use the pre-outs would not allow B front to work.

I wrote Denon tech support and they confirmed that's how it's programmed. If you select Zone2 or A/B Fronts plan to use the internal amps.
 

kevin1969

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I found ZONE2 and the A/B Front configurations are both limited to using the Denon internal amps.
1. If pre-amp mode is selected in Denon Amp Assign = no Zone 2 available.
2. If Zone 2 is setup in Amp Assign and I try to use the Pre-outs of the Height 2 channels for Zone 2. Did not work properly.
3. If A/B Fronts is selected in Amp assign - trying to use the pre-outs would not allow B front to work.

I wrote Denon tech support and they confirmed that's how it's programmed. If you select Zone2 or A/B Fronts plan to use the internal amps.

That's crazy. Why do they bother showing you that this is a valid config in the terminal connection illustration?? I haven't yet received my external amp but I am glad I bought a preamp also just in case what you're saying is really how it works. It makes no sense but what do I know I've only had the thing for 3 days.
 

amper42

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I only ran into this as I wanted to run my 7' Towers as "B" Fronts with an external amp. It didn't work until I used the Denon internal amp. When I wrote Denon they indicated the pre-outs are only designed to work with the function labeled on the amp terminals...

So if you look at the 4700 speaker terminals you won't find Zone2 on the label. You will get Height 2 instead. :D
The one way you can get around this is select "Multi-channel stereo" mode.

4700-back.jpg
 

kevin1969

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I only ran into this as I wanted to run my 7' Towers as "B" Fronts with an external amp. It didn't work until I used the Denon internal amp. When I wrote Denon they indicated the pre-outs are only designed to work with the function labeled on the amp terminals...

So if you look at the 4700 speaker terminals you won't find Zone2 on the label. You will get Height 2 instead. :D
The one way you can get around this is select "Multi-channel stereo" mode.

View attachment 114198

Ahh ok. That's a reasonable work around.
 

Rottmannash

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Ahh yes that would be one advantage of running something local on a PC/Mac. A lot of the appliance based products like Sonos, Bluesound are definitely limited by buffers so they don't cache as much of the music locally as you noticed. I actually ran into an issue once where Tidal was giving out bad server info for the location of music files. This was causing the buffers to run out because the devices we're pulling the music file data down from across the country instead of using local content servers. You don't need a lot of bandwidth to pull music content data off the internet but you do need the servers to be as close as possible as the clients. You can install Wireshark and actually watch this process happen on a computer that's downloading content from a music service.
Wow-so the music I stream off Qobuz isn't coming off one server somewhere?
 

kevin1969

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Wow-so the music I stream off Qobuz isn't coming off one server somewhere?

Ha! It might be. Actually depending on what music you're trying to play It's probably asking the service what the best place is to request that musical resource. Or it just might be like magic or something. :)
 

Maejstictone

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I like pre-amp mode in the Denon 4700. With it engaged the energy usage of the 4700 drops to 46W no matter how loud or how many channels are playing. If the 4700 is in stereo mode at low volumes using internal amps it uses 120W+. Of course, any saved energy from pre-amp mode is eaten up by my Monolith 7x200. :D

I also like Auto-3D on the Denon 4700. It offers a nice option with height channels.

Did you have the opportunity to A/B the Denon 4700 against the Yamaha RX-A3080 for overall sound quality with your speakers?
Thanks!


How do you like that Monolith 7x200 ? Been reading up on it since I went from 5.1 to 7.1 currently using a Acurus A125
 

AllCourtGuy

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@amirm , I want to make sure I understand the work around for this issue. If I use S/PDIF audio connections from my DVD player to the 3700H, and if the audio is coming in compressed 5.1 or compressed 7.1 format will it successfully downmix to a 3.1 configuration without the excess noise issue that you had with an HDMI connection? Is that correct?

I need to know before I purchase my center and sub woofer.
Thanks for your help!

Anyone?
 

amper42

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1. When I use my Sony UBP-X800M2 4K player for playing CD's it sends the music out as Stereo then the Denon 4700 plays it in Stereo or up mixes it to Auro-3D or multi-channel stereo whichever I select. No problems at all.

2. When I play the "John Williams In Vienna" Blu-Ray it allows me to select ATMOS or 7.1 on the Sony player and output that directly to the Denon 4700. The Denon recognizes the UBP-X800M2 and automatically selects the correct mode to accompany these formats. Works great.

3. I can't imagine wanting to play a 5.1 or 7.1 mix on a 3.1 system. But if you do that you could select stereo mode and just hear the fronts or select dolby surround sound and hear the front and center material. The situation you are describing would be very rare. I don't see a setting on my 4700 to down mix 7.1 to 3.1. You can down mix to stereo but I would never select that option and you would have to over ride the Denon 4700 settings to do so.
 

AllCourtGuy

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1. When I use my Sony UBP-X800M2 4K player for playing CD's it sends the music out as Stereo then the Denon 4700 plays it in Stereo or up mixes it to Auro-3D or multi-channel stereo whichever I select. No problems at all.

2. When I play the "John Williams In Vienna" Blu-Ray it allows me to select ATMOS or 7.1 on the Sony player and output that directly to the Denon 4700. The Denon recognizes the UBP-X800M2 and automatically selects the correct mode to accompany these formats. Works great.

3. I can't imagine wanting to play a 5.1 or 7.1 mix on a 3.1 system. But if you do that you could select stereo mode and just hear the fronts or select dolby surround sound and hear the front and center material. The situation you are describing would be very rare. I don't see a setting on my 4700 to down mix 7.1 to 3.1. You can down mix to stereo but I would never select that option and you would have to over ride the Denon 4700 settings to do so.

@amper42, thanks for the help. I will be going 5.1 and later 7.1 when finances allow. I just wanted to know if I could get valid content from a center speaker and sub without suffering from the down mixing issue in the meantime.

Thanks again for taking the time to explain it to me.
 

amper42

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@amper42, thanks for the help. I will be going 5.1 and later 7.1 when finances allow. I just wanted to know if I could get valid content from a center speaker and sub without suffering from the down mixing issue in the meantime.

Thanks again for taking the time to explain it to me.

Subwoofer Setup in Stereo
The Denon 4700 has dual subwoofer control. You can easily connect a sub or two. Audyssey will automatically balance the volume and detect the distance away from prime seating. This will work in Stereo mode as well as 5.1, 7.1.
Stereo Configure: Look at the Denon 4700 on screen setup. Go to Speakers: Manual: 2ch Playback. Then set "Fronts" to Small and "Subwoofer" Yes. Next, set the crossover frequency to 80Hz or other. This will allow the sub to integrate with Stereo.
If you don't turn on Small for Fronts the sub will not be active.

Using 3.1 Setup
I am not aware of a way to down mix 5.1 or 7.1 to 3.1, but Multi-channel stereo mode would allow the center channel to be active. The other option would be to use a surround sound mode. It just wouldn't contain the side or rear surround feed. But, it's possible you may not even notice.

If you like Jazz and want to test out your new subwoofer setup on the Denon 4700 search for "Wood" by Brian Bromberg track #1 "The Saga of Harrison Crabfeathers" on Qobuz. I love hearing all of the resonance and overtones of this upright bass performance.

Wood.png
 
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kevin1969

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1. When I use my Sony UBP-X800M2 4K player for playing CD's it sends the music out as Stereo then the Denon 4700 plays it in Stereo or up mixes it to Auro-3D or multi-channel stereo whichever I select. No problems at all.

2. When I play the "John Williams In Vienna" Blu-Ray it allows me to select ATMOS or 7.1 on the Sony player and output that directly to the Denon 4700. The Denon recognizes the UBP-X800M2 and automatically selects the correct mode to accompany these formats. Works great.

3. I can't imagine wanting to play a 5.1 or 7.1 mix on a 3.1 system. But if you do that you could select stereo mode and just hear the fronts or select dolby surround sound and hear the front and center material. The situation you are describing would be very rare. I don't see a setting on my 4700 to down mix 7.1 to 3.1. You can down mix to stereo but I would never select that option and you would have to over ride the Denon 4700 settings to do so.

I have the same Blu-Ray player. I only have a 2ch system. Is it better to configure the Blu-ray player to output just stereo or is it better to tell it to output the surround and let the Denon 4700 downmix it into stereo?
 

amper42

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I have the same Blu-Ray player. I only have a 2ch system. Is it better to configure the Blu-ray player to output just stereo or is it better to tell it to output the surround and let the Denon 4700 downmix it into stereo?

I typically let the Sony UBP-X800M2 play the media in whatever format the disk offers. If it's a CD it will be stereo. I have a few BluRay music discs that offer 5.1, 7.1, ATMOS or stereo. If that's the case, and I only had two speakers I would select stereo.

If you are playing a movie that doesn't offer stereo from the source then I would just let it play in the source the Denon automatically selects. Most of the content comes out of the Fronts anyway. I wouldn't be able to tell much difference. You might miss a door open/slam in the rear surrounds but it would sound out of place in the fronts anyway? If you want to use stereo on the Denon you could, but I wouldn't bother. It's pretty easy to make more of a big deal out of this topic than it needs to be.
 

red_kk

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How does it pair with Parasound A31 rated this way for inputs:

Input sensitivity:
1 V for 28.28 V (THX Reference)

Input impedance:
47 k Ω unbalanced; 94 k Ω balanced
 
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