LOL yeah but I watched the video first as I missed thatI just went up to edit my post and saw that I had said it was in the comments.
Who is this guy and why is it important, tho?
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Denon AVR-X3900H & PURIFI 1ET6525SA a good idea?
- Thread starter Tanquen
- Start date
Who is this guy and why is it important, tho?- Thread Starter
- #42
I've never bought an external amp and he mentioned in the comments that there was some issue with clipping because audio out from the AVR is too quiet or something I guess? I was just trying to figure out if it would be a problem with a X3900H or what that problem actually was. ???LOL yeah but I watched the video first as I missed that
I've not watched the video (or read the comments) but it sounds like the problem was probably gain matching. I.e. If the gain of the external amps is lower than the internal ones then the AVR has to use its trim adjustment to increase the output level of the channels with external amps. It the external amp gain is too low and the trim is boosted too much you could potentially clip those outputs.
I've added Topping B200s for L and R and even on high gain I had to boost L and R by +6dB (I think). It seems ok but I might struggle to reach full reference level now. An amp with higher gain would probably have been better.
If you use a passive RCA to XLR converter cable you potentially lose some gain too. (I think its because the XLR expects a 4V differential signal but the RCA only gives 2V single ended).
I've added Topping B200s for L and R and even on high gain I had to boost L and R by +6dB (I think). It seems ok but I might struggle to reach full reference level now. An amp with higher gain would probably have been better.
If you use a passive RCA to XLR converter cable you potentially lose some gain too. (I think its because the XLR expects a 4V differential signal but the RCA only gives 2V single ended).
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He's talking about the pre-out voltage capabilities of the pre-amp section he's using. AVRs don't generally have as high a pre-out voltage as dedicated pre-amps (mostly 2ch, some pre-pros are capable).
ps Maybe as Matt indicated, perhaps he's just trying the lower gain setting only....which wouldn't generally match an avr's internal amps.
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If the amp has RCA input and a high/29db gain setting it should match the AVR pretty good.
Reduced gain on the external amp is desirable when everything still gets (easily) loud enough.
And it doesn't create a mix of external and internal gain values (AVR amps also in use) where the AVR has to adjust for a big gain mismatch with his internal offset.
Apples and oranges.
You don't connect to the Purifi module, but to a buffer board before it. And what gain options and inputs you have there depends on the integrator.
If the amp with Purifi module has RCA input, look at it's gain options.
Which one did you have in mind?
- Thread Starter
- #49
I was looking at the Buckeye or the VTV.
PURIFI 1ET6525SA 3-Channel (2nd Gen EIGENTAKT)
I wish it was a normal 17 inches wide.
It does have a high medium and low setting for each.
But like most of the ones I'm finding, it only has the balanced connector so you have to pay $100 bucks for the three unbalanced/balanced or RCA connectors.
With my luck and at the prices they're at it'd be nice to have better than 3 years on the warranty.
VTV AMPLIFIER Three Channel Purifi Audio 1ET-6525SA Amplifier
The base price is similar but all the options are crazy expensive.
It has eight different buffer options.
Still no RCA connections and they want $300 each for their unbalanced/balance RCA Connector.
No built in toggle for low medium and high on the amps.
I do like the case a lot better.
But it only has a 2 year warranty.
PURIFI 1ET6525SA 3-Channel (2nd Gen EIGENTAKT)
I wish it was a normal 17 inches wide.
It does have a high medium and low setting for each.
But like most of the ones I'm finding, it only has the balanced connector so you have to pay $100 bucks for the three unbalanced/balanced or RCA connectors.
With my luck and at the prices they're at it'd be nice to have better than 3 years on the warranty.
The base price is similar but all the options are crazy expensive.
It has eight different buffer options.
Still no RCA connections and they want $300 each for their unbalanced/balance RCA Connector.
No built in toggle for low medium and high on the amps.
I do like the case a lot better.
But it only has a 2 year warranty.
The Denon should have enough pre-out voltage for it. I've read of others doing these amps with similar Denon models just fine. $33 per cable might be a bit high, and they're available elsewhere too (but will be wired correctly, not all rca-xlr cables are setup the same way). There are avrs people have tried to use with xlr inputs that didn't have enough pre-amp voltage, some don't even get to 2V (which you'd generally want even using single ended/rca connections on an amp). IIRC in the ASR measurements of Denon avrs I think ideal SINAD was a bit above 2V on several models, but still could get to 4V.
Why the Purifi modules particularly? I'd probably get the NC500x modules.
Steve Dallas
Major Contributor
I use these adapter cables with my Buckeye amp. They are very high quality and less expensive than the ones Buckeye offers.
Amazon.com: 2 Foot RCA to XLR (Male) Cable Pair - WBC-PRO-LOCAP Low-Capacitance (14pF/ft) 22 AWG Ultra-Silent Audiophile & Pro-Grade Audio Interconnect Cable - Amphenol Plugs & Red & Silver Tweed Jackets : Electronics
Amazon.com: 2 Foot RCA to XLR (Male) Cable Pair - WBC-PRO-LOCAP Low-Capacitance (14pF/ft) 22 AWG Ultra-Silent Audiophile & Pro-Grade Audio Interconnect Cable - Amphenol Plugs & Red & Silver Tweed Jackets : Electronics
www.amazon.com
Too bad they don't have a 3-pack
Steve Dallas
Major Contributor
Right. When I bought mine, they were about $40 per pair, so two pairs were still less expensive than buying 3 from Buckeye, so I have a cable for each channel for the day I find something to do with that unused 4th channel.Too bad they don't have a 3-pack
Also not a bad thing to try diy cable making with....Right. When I bought mine, they were about $40 per pair, so two pairs were still less expensive than buying 3 from Buckeye, so I have a cable for each channel for the day I find something to do with that unused 4th channel.
You could read a full review here in the forums. Those are very good Hypex modules.Sell me on the NC500x.
And if you have a better option for finished amp with rca input and/or gain options, that might make it easier for you.
About the rca2xlr cables in general. Think about them this way: there is a specification from Hypex about how to wire them, leveraging extra shielding despite it not being a balanced connection. That's a bit better than an rca cable. Not a bad addition to your cable collection. Not a simple adapter you just lose money over. Buckeye offers them. Probabaly other sources too, but I don't know any in the US (some in the EU and UK). Offers on amazon might be different, see what people here suggest to you.
These amp modules are both in a higher league than the Denon. It's about the options of the available finished amps for you.
- Thread Starter
- #60
Yeah I'm not even sure I need an app this fancy. I was just looking at something to give me back my missing channel if give up on the 6XXX series Denon units and move to a 3XXX series because the 6XXX is another two grand for two more amps. They're 140 Watts versus (I think?) 105 Watts but I don't think I'd get anything out of that. My speakers are nothing fancy and I can't even get below around -40 volume on the X6500H. I just I can't even imagine how people can play lower than that or let alone reference it's just too loud for me.
So it would be nice to put that $2000 towards a three channel amp that would hopefully, weigh less, run cooler and last more than a couple of years like the Denon and or if a better Denon comes out with features I want I can get the cheaper one and continue to use the 3 channel amp for the LRC speakers, that runs cooler and hopefully will last longer.
Maybe I should just give up on the center rear channel or get an even cheaper simpler amp for just that one channel. I don't think I'd ever even notice it missing but I took the time to wire up the speaker and mount it. Plus I had heard Dirac ART was better with more speakers.
I guess the Hypex NCx500 used to be cheaper so maybe that's why folks are wondering why I wouldn't go that route. Otherwise I don't really see any reason to get one versus the other. If I purchase from Buckeye it's actually slightly more expensive, they have the same inputs and outputs, trigger and cases.
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