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Denon AVR-X3800H Review

Rate this AVR

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 83 18.9%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 206 47.0%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 118 26.9%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 31 7.1%

  • Total voters
    438

DrDal701

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A couple of screen shots from the (much improved) GUI, showing the advanced pre-amp mode.

IMG_3532 (1).jpg
IMG_3531 (1).jpg
 

Vacceo

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Their BS like narrative on the individual sound signature of the numerous reviewed AVRs (feel like at least one a week!!) are hilarious to some of us who trust audio science a lot more than their subjective reviews, but to the less technically informed public I don't find it funny at all. In fact, feel sad about how and why so many people are easily fooled by such reviews. Haven't said that, it may not be a disservice to those people either because if they believe in them, then presumably those who wanted a punchy, bold and crisp sound they would go with a Denon, for sound that is on the bright, details side they would go for a Yamaha, and for smoothness, resolution, refine kind of sound especially for music, then go with Marantz, and for neutral sound, go with Onkyo's RZ50 or Anthem etc.... With such preconception planted in their heads by the likes of A. Robinson (not picking on him, but only remember his name because he has numerous such reviews on Youtube:D.
They sell you a experiencie, not a product. It would be quite uncanny to honestly tell that all those experiences are esentially the same.

I get it, objective reviews are not cheap due to education and knowledge plus measuring instruments. Worse than that, videos of the process look like some sort of dieselpunk tech nerd doing mad scientist stuff. That is not very youtube-friendly; not as much as your fancy home and the train of thought of your otherwise very charismatic wife.

I, however, prefeer the Matthew Poes, the James Larsons, the Erin Hardisons or the Amir Majidimehrs. Just like music, I find pop dull and boring, and subjective reviews without data are just generic pop.
 

peng

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They sell you a experiencie, not a product. It would be quite uncanny to honestly tell that all those experiences are esentially the same.

I get it, objective reviews are not cheap due to education and knowledge plus measuring instruments. Worse than that, videos of the process look like some sort of dieselpunk tech nerd doing mad scientist stuff. That is not very youtube-friendly; not as much as your fancy home and the train of thought of your otherwise very charismatic wife.

I, however, prefeer the Matthew Poes, the James Larsons, the Erin Hardisons or the Amir Majidimehrs. Just like music, I find pop dull and boring, and subjective reviews without data are just generic pop.

I think what you said would apply mostly to the beginners. To the more experienced, there won't be pop and excitement too because they (I do anyway) know such reviewers reinforced each other's blurbs, that's one of the main reasons why we have those hearsay about the brand sound signature. For example, you can predict what Robinson will say about the sound quality of his review based on the brand and price.
 

Vacceo

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I think what you said would apply mostly to the beginners. To the more experienced, there won't be pop and excitement too because they (I do anyway) know such reviewers reinforced each other's blurbs, that's one of the main reasons why we have those hearsay about the brand sound signature. For example, you can predict what Robinson will say about the sound quality of his review based on the brand and price.
True that. I browsed a bit on his comments on McIntosh. They happen to create fine gear, but we all know it is possible to get that or better performance at a fraction of their prices.
 

prerich

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I think what you said would apply mostly to the beginners. To the more experienced, there won't be pop and excitement too because they (I do anyway) know such reviewers reinforced each other's blurbs, that's one of the main reasons why we have those hearsay about the brand sound signature. For example, you can predict what Robinson will say about the sound quality of his review based on the brand and price.
I wouldn't say that about Andrew myself. IMHO Andrew does realize that he's doing subjective reviews (and often states that). He's taken the time to add measurements in his listening room concerning speakers. I've also seen Andrew trash products from brands he loves. I can't predict what Andrew will say because he will sometimes surprise me. I've always stated this...the one thing we fail to take care of, measure, or consider is our ears. We could possibly be getting perfect sound, but if our ears are messed up - we will have to adjust the system to our liking. Meanwhile ....many believe the Denon x3800h is the best thing Denon has on the market, although I like the 4 independent subs, and the preamp mode, I still don't think the x3800h is the best thing Denon has to offer to date.
 

Vacceo

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I wouldn't say that about Andrew myself. IMHO Andrew does realize that he's doing subjective reviews (and often states that). He's taken the time to add measurements in his listening room concerning speakers. I've also seen Andrew trash products from brands he loves. I can't predict what Andrew will say because he will sometimes surprise me. I've always stated this...the one thing we fail to take care of, measure, or consider is our ears. We could possibly be getting perfect sound, but if our ears are messed up - we will have to adjust the system to our liking. Meanwhile ....many believe the Denon x3800h is the best thing Denon has on the market, although I like the 4 independent subs, and the preamp mode, I still don't think the x3800h is the best thing Denon has to offer to date.
That's why you go for measures. First get a well-engineered device and then, adjust to taste.
 

peng

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Meanwhile ....many believe the Denon x3800h is the best thing Denon has on the market, although I like the 4 independent subs, and the preamp mode, I still don't think the x3800h is the best thing Denon has to offer to date.

That is not true relatively speaking, based on the poll results. Last time I checked, only 4.3% thought it was "great".

How many % of the time Andrew surprised you? To me, may be 10% of the time his subjective measurements surprised me. I would admit that's based on way back when I still read those reviews, so things might have changed, hopefully for the better.
 
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Descartes

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It could work for them if they pass their marketing info well ahead of time about such alleged "improvements" to the online/Youtuber reviewers including the high(er) end ones like Andrew Robinson who seemed to be easily affected by such hypes and would blurb out descriptive like wider soundstage, so much clearer yet smooth mid and highs, greater dynamics yet more layback blabalaba. Sort of plant the seed in the spring and harvest in the fall...;)

Sadly, while many of us don't tend to value those subjective reviews too much, some of those reviewers do have a lot of followers and influence. I would guess far more than the likes of the more objective reviewers such as Amir and Gene. It is sad but true, marketing people know it well too, that may be why manufacturers don't care much about bench test results. Instead, all they have to do is to come up with a few audio quality related features (HDAM, and yes DAC IC too when it suits them, such as when D+M first switch from the PCM1690 to the AK4458/4490..) and those paper magazine and online reviewers will do the rest, such as explained it away in their populist way, and in the process, plant seeds in the potential buyers heads an/or suckers via such online reviews that would flood the internet.

By the way, could someone tell me why those online/youtubers seem to have no trouble getting samples, even expensive ones for them to do those semi bs reviews while the more objective fact-based ones like Gene and Amir don't seem to have such luxury? For example, if you do a search on Youtube, you will lose count on how many AVRs Mr. Robinson has reviewed so far this year, it's incredible!
Because these reviewers are just kissing a.. and provide extremely rarely bad review for any product! Science goes out the window unfortunately.
 

Descartes

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Hi everyone! I have a little question. If my room need correction, what should give me the best results, the x3700h with audyssey or the x3800h with dirac? Looks like X3700h > x3800h and dirac > audyssey, which one will have the biggest impact? Also, si there any alternative under 5000$? Any avr or processor with dirac that mesured well? Thank you!
Consider Anthem AVM70 no DIRAC but ARC
 

GabrielPhoto

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So even if using an external 7 channel amp, the 4700h is still a better option? My issue is that I use 7channel monolith thx amp but then I still use 4 AVR channels for ATMOS..so not sure if the selective preamp mode of the 3800h is superior to the 4700h when not using preamp mode so I can use its 4 channels for atmos.
My other option was the RZ50 for Dirac but the review here was not impressive.
 

peng

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So even if using an external 7 channel amp, the 4700h is still a better option? My issue is that I use 7channel monolith thx amp but then I still use 4 AVR channels for ATMOS..so not sure if the selective preamp mode of the 3800h is superior to the 4700h when not using preamp mode so I can use its 4 channels for atmos.
My other option was the RZ50 for Dirac but the review here was not impressive.

The 3800's selectable channel assigned to preamp would be superior in terms of SINAD at higher pre out level, such as way pass 1.5 V. Depending on you spl requirements, speaker sensitivity and distance, you may never have to push the level pass even 1 V or less for the Atmos channels. So it is quite possible that the "superiority" does not apply to your application at all. It would be a bonus if you can find the 4700 that has the AKM DAC IC, in that case I would say it is "superior", at least on paper.
 

GabrielPhoto

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tecnically - whatever amount of subs you have, your setup will still be x.1.x (unless you are able to put your hands on handful of available DtsX Pro mixes, that have 2 LFE channels), so here you are right.

Still there is lot of bass content in all the other channels, that you normally bass manage and lump together in your subs. So independent sub routing makes sense, if you use AVP as an active crossover.

e.g. in my current 9.6.7 setup I have one sub dedicated just for C channel, creating “large“ speaker. This sub has no LFE duty. Although my C is 3 way/4 drivers 1.2m wide monster, it still benefits from extra driver to take it down to 20Hz. Immersion and screen side sound coherence improved dramatically compared to usual “let’s send everything below 80 Hz to all subs” approach.
I would like to see a photo of that setup specially the center and sub!
 

Fidji

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I would like to see a photo of that setup specially the center and sub!
1668880365933.png

Small one in the middle is 10in. This is actually my Stereo, that morphed into HT during Covid. Center is Focus ESL. Photos taken during usual reshuffling and calibration spree.
 

GabrielPhoto

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View attachment 244444
Small one in the middle is 10in. This is actually my Stereo, that morphed into HT during Covid. Center is Focus ESL. Photos taken during usual reshuffling and calibration spree.
How hard was it to integrate it with your other subs? I always thought of getting small 10" sub for the center only. What sub is it?
Thanks!
 

Fidji

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How hard was it to integrate it with your other subs? I always thought of getting small 10" sub for the center only. What sub is it?
Thanks!
Dynamo 800x from MartinLogan, sealed.

To integrate - easy with Trinnov. What is important - this is not "bass management" but active crossover type of setup for C+800X calibrated as such. As you can see - L-R have 2x10in active each, so this is coherent across the screen side. I have 3 subs in "minidsp/MSO" setup used to bass manage front side [FW&FH] + LFE and 2 subs again in the same config for rear speakers [S-SB-SH-RH]

Room is around 32sqm so 4x12 in , 1*15in 1*10in, are more than enough [add 4*10in on L-R] and you have enough of oomph.

You would probably need to use MiniDsp or some other active Xover.
 

Doctors11

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Dynamo 800x from MartinLogan, sealed.

To integrate - easy with Trinnov. What is important - this is not "bass management" but active crossover type of setup for C+800X calibrated as such. As you can see - L-R have 2x10in active each, so this is coherent across the screen side. I have 3 subs in "minidsp/MSO" setup used to bass manage front side [FW&FH] + LFE and 2 subs again in the same config for rear speakers [S-SB-SH-RH]

Room is around 32sqm so 4x12 in , 1*15in 1*10in, are more than enough [add 4*10in on L-R] and you have enough of oomph.

You would probably need to use MiniDsp or some other active Xover.
Did you try the included Anthem Room Correction on that sub?
 

Fidji

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Not on the subs but on Fronts yes [in the times, when it was still stereo] - with their mic [I think is called PBK or smth like this - PC app]. Usual IIR filtering with max boost of +6dB. Works OK. Subs should be the same.

Control App is very good, though and what I like about the subs - you can use them both front and downfiring.

But I would not overlay 2 DRCs one over each other.
 

Doctors11

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Not on the subs but on Fronts yes [in the times, when it was still stereo] - with their mic [I think is called PBK or smth like this - PC app]. Usual IIR filtering with max boost of +6dB. Works OK. Subs should be the same.

Control App is very good, though

But I would not overlay 2 DRCs one over each other.
Thanks. I know I read somewhere that Martin Logan and Anthem say to run the ARC in the sub first, then do a full correction from an AVR, mini dsp, etc.
 
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