Denon AVR-X3800H Review

[ivo.f.doma]

OK, it seems like a problem with upmixing 2.0 to 5.1 (I don't know if it's specific to Denon or not). did you run the calibration with Audyssey? they are supposed to fix that. (note that I mentioned XT32 because it's a big step up from XT, and that's a worthy upgrade)

Yes, specific to Denon / Marantz.

 

[beaRA]

Thanks for the replies! Speaker bleed is apparently a known issue with some Denon AVR in surrounds when playing DD 2.0 content unfortunately. I should’ve added, I keep the remote in hand because sometimes it gets louder than I’d expect and I can’t isolate if it’s because some speakers are getting more power than others or if it’s just the avr not being a great fit/or if it’s something I need to adjust

That's just dynamic range. Many consider it a desirable aspect of the content itself.

 

[pielover74]

Thanks for the replies! I should’ve added, I keep the remote in hand because sometimes it gets louder than I’d expect and I can’t isolate if it’s because some speakers are getting more power than others or if it’s just the avr not being a great fit/or if it’s something I need to adjust

OK, it seems like a problem with upmixing 2.0 to 5.1 (I don't know if it's specific to Denon or not). did you run the calibration with Audyssey? they are supposed to fix that. (note that I mentioned XT32 because it's a big step up from XT, and that's a worthy upgrade)

Use the "direct" button multipld times until it selects "auto" mode and see if that helps, you might be running some undesireable surround upmixing and you should disable it before investigating further.

Thanks for the recommendations! I did run setup with audyssey. I’ll look into xt32

 

[Head_Unit]

You are both misunderstanding a bit. Midrange compensation is a dip in the target curve to avoid over-correcting for a sound power dip at the crossover. If you have a flat target curve and a speaker with an in-room response that dips due to a directivity mismatch, you can mess up the on-axis response by boosting to a flat in-room response.

You're correct that I had never seen that idea. On the other hand, a speaker correction system should first flatten the on-axis direct sound, then secondarily the total sound power. Heh, I guess I just described a limitation of correction systems, ow!

 

[Chromatischism]

On the other hand, a speaker correction system should first flatten the on-axis direct sound, then secondarily the total sound power. Heh, I guess I just described a limitation of correction systems, ow!

Smoothed, not flattened

 

[peng]

Smoothed, not flattened

Imo, even flattened is fine, for models that are compatible to apps that allow customized target curves.

 

[Chromatischism]

Imo, even flattened is fine, for models that are compatible to apps that allow customized target curves.

Yeah, I was commenting on this:

a speaker correction system should first flatten the on-axis direct sound

I can't agree, because Audyssey's research specifically flagged doing so as causing bad sound on many speakers. So, MRC exists.

 

[Zedly]

True, but at least for the REW screenshots above from @Zedly, the legend indicates no smoothing was used.

10-137 is sort of an arbitrary range, though. I use 10-200 or 10-300. Without as much stretching, the verticality of issues is more easy to see. I also think it makes sense to see the whole "bass" range, which I consider to go to around 250 give or take. If we all standardized our graphs would be easy to compare.

To clarify, you are correct: no smoothing was applied. The miniDSP 2x4 HD has only 10 PEQ slots, so I only EQed up to 120 Hz. The idea was that this would cover the entire range of the LFE channel and that I would be crossing over low enough that the higher frequencies would be ok without EQ. The 137 Hz is just how REW displayed the range, and I didn't bother to make it a nice number!

 

[jbonn5000]

Whew. Just got done reading 79 pages of this forum. Guess I'll pay up and buy an Anthem MRX 740 8k instead, since the objective measurements of that brand have been stellar. As have been the subjective conclusions. I also like to troubleshoot bugs.

 

[Narnian]

Whew. Just got done reading 79 pages of this forum. Guess I'll pay up and buy an Anthem MRX 740 8k instead, since the objective measurements of that brand have been stellar. As have been the subjective conclusions. I also like to troubleshoot bugs.

Crutchfield has a scratch and dent one.

 

[jbonn5000]

Crutchfield has a scratch and dent one.

Oh nice, thanks!

I'm actually holding out until my new mains arrive (which may not happen until February). In the meantime, hoping we get some idea of how the 4800x will perform. Hoping the same for the Marantz Cinema 50.

 

[Karls_speaker_works]

$1000 more for better measurements

Whew. Just got done reading 79 pages of this forum. Guess I'll pay up and buy an Anthem MRX 740 8k instead, since the objective measurements of that brand have been stellar. As have been the subjective conclusions. I also like to troubleshoot bugs.

I don't see a review of that model? It's $1000 more - worth it? There's an assumption it measures well even though only top-of-the-line Anthem models have been recommended here? Is ARC good?

 

[jbonn5000]

$1000 more for better measurements

I don't see a review of that model? It's $1000 more - worth it? There's an assumption it measures well even though only top-of-the-line Anthem models have been recommended here? Is ARC good?

Gene's bench test yielded excellent results though I don't know if that was for the 8k version (or if it matters) https://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/anthem-mrx-740-1140-receivers

As far as price being worth it, I'm still on the fence. I am upgrading at some point and I view that upgrade as a hopeful "This will be my AVR for years to come". So I'd rather pay for something with excellent reviews. Perhaps I'm wasting my money and time. I'm all for other's input on D+M vs Anthem. (The upcoming x4800 and Cinema 50 are not much cheaper than the MRX 740, which is notable to me.)

I've never used ARC, and Anthems seem to have a long history of bugs. But in almost every forum I've read through and have asked questions in, owners of that series praise its sound, flexibility, room correction, and general aesthetics. My father-in-law has a 540 that I was very impressed with (I do need to borrow it so I can hear it in my room with my speakers).

 

[peng]

Gene's bench test yielded excellent results though I don't know if that was for the 8k version (or if it matters) https://www.audioholics.com/av-receiver-reviews/anthem-mrx-740-1140-receivers

The preamp/dac results were good but not the power amps. If you are to use it as an AVR using the internal amps, the Denon will be better, based on test results.

 

[symphara]

The preamp/dac results were good but not the power amps. If you are to use it as an AVR using the internal amps, the Denon will be better, based on test results.

The test results don’t take room correction into account. I personally had [much] better results with ARC than Audyssey. However I still wouldn’t recommend an Anthem over a Denon just from a product stability point of view.

 

[peng]

The test results don’t take room correction into account. I personally had [much] better results with ARC than Audyssey. However I still wouldn’t recommend an Anthem over a Denon just from a product stability point of view.

People say that but I haven't seen them post supporting objective measurements. We do see lots of REW measurements for Dirac and Audyssey but hardly any from ARCG users. I seem to be among the few who posted such graphs.

 

[symphara]

People say that but I haven't seen them post supporting objective measurements. We do see lots of REW measurements for Dirac and Audyssey but hardly any from ARCG users. I seem to be among the few who posted such graphs.

Anthem is a boutique producer, few people have their stuff, it’s no surprise you see few REW measurements. I don’t have the Anthem gear anymore, I was given it as a loan. The receiver itself was buggy and don‘t want a science project when I want to watch a movie.

 

[peng]

Anthem is a boutique producer, few people have their stuff, it’s no surprise you see few REW measurements. I don’t have the Anthem gear anymore, I was given it as a loan. The receiver itself was buggy and don‘t want a science project when I want to watch a movie.

That seemed like to be the case earlier on, but I think most of the issues have been dealt with by now, give it a try!

 

[symphara]

That seemed like to be the case earlier on, but I think most of the issues have been dealt with by now, give it a try!

I carefully watched the AVM70 launch, being in market at the time for that kind of product, and I was treated to what I’d best describe as a clown fiesta. Thank you, but I’ll pass.

 

[jbonn5000]

The preamp/dac results were good but not the power amps. If you are to use it as an AVR using the internal amps, the Denon will be better, based on test results.

True and good point. I'd be using both. I have an emotiva stereo amp for the mains and would be using internals for all other channels. I might upgrade to a 5 channel external amp in the future, so narrowing down which AVR to get is definitely a challenge.