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Denon AVR-X3700H AVR Review

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#81
I wonder when they will get rid of analog video inputs..2030..:rolleyes:..?
Surely cant be many still using them..
Exactly, plus whoever uses them just get a converter and solved.
Jesus what a waste of AVR space and costs.

Maybe from 2025 and up they start taking gimmicks out and improve SINAD, Power, Auto EQ to the standars of Dirac, etc...im hoping.
 

Dj7675

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#82
Nice to see no surprises and very good performance at this price. It will be interesting in next years models if they choose to have amp disconnect on all channels individually or save that feature for their flagship model. My only other comment is to continue to develop Audyssey. The app was a huge improvement but they need to continue to develop it: more choices on room curves, 4 sub out options, include a better MIC on higher end models, option to disable surround boost with DEQ,
 

peng

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#83
The full lineup:
X3000H = 2013
X3100H = 2014
X3200H = 2015
X3300H = 2016
X3400H = 2017
X3500H = 2018
X3600H = 2019
X3700H = 2020
The 4000 series has also been on a yearly cycle for quite some time, until 2019. I guess they skipped over the more expensive X4600H because of the major changes in the HDMI version and 8K. To make up for the gap they upgraded the X3500H in a big way, offering 2 more internal amps and 11 channel processing, that's up from only 7 channel processing. If you look at the circuit board layout, the real heat sinks (instead of the 3300/3400/3500's stamped metal type) and a better looking transformer that bears the Denon nameplate, it is much more like the X4500H than the X3500H, all for only $100 increase.

X4000 = 2013
X4100W = 2014
X4200W = 2015
X4300H = 2016
X4400H = 2017
X4500H = 2018
X4600H = skipped
X4700H = 2020
X4800H = who knows?
 

Dj7675

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#84
The 4000 series has also been on a yearly cycle for quite some time, until 2019. I guess they skipped over the more expensive X4600H because of the major changes in the HDMI version and 8K. To make up for the gap they upgraded the X3500H in a big way, offering 2 more internal amps and 11 channel processing, that's up from only 7 channel processing. If you look at the circuit board layout, the real heat sinks (instead of the 3300/3400/3500's stamped metal type) and a better looking transformer that bears the Denon nameplate, it is much more like the X4500H than the X3500H, all for only $100 increase.

X4000 = 2013
X4100W = 2014
X4200W = 2015
X4300H = 2016
X4400H = 2017
X4500H = 2018
X4600H = skipped
X4700H = 2020
X4800H = who knows?
I also believe the x8500 is just turning into the x8500a (with the new 8k input) and will stay in the line another few years as well. Also if you have an x8500 you will be able to send it back to Denon to have them upgrade it to the A version with 8k input for a fee. I haven’t heard what the fee is but it is a nice option to be able to make it 8k for those interested in that.
 

Ucftechguru

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#85
Denon is usually on a two year cadence, not a single. 3 years for flagships, AFAIK.

Furthermore, jdsmoothie, on avsforum who seems to be kind of a Denon information carrier, says the x6700h is now on the same three year flagship cycle too, and won’t be replaced until 2023.
https://www.avsforum.com/threads/official-2020-denon-avr-owners-thread-faq-posts-1-8.3151088/

At some point Denon is going to run out of features that generate incentive to buy a new AVR. I think they are nearly there.

I bought the x6700h because I wanted 13 channels. I cannot imagine personally wanting more than 13 channels in my current home theater, so more channels aren’t a draw. New, one off, audio codecs are mostly a bust. IMAX enhanced, Auro 3D, whatever else just around the bend — they will be confined to “also ran” status behind Dolby Atmos and DTS X. Outdated receiver app features can be circumvented by a $50 streaming stick.

Really the last bastions for upgrade incentive are
Better Quality Sound, Better Quality Auto EQ, More/newer HDMI ports. Denon is updating their receiver lines 480p UI to 1080p in the next generation I saw in a Sound United Video on YouTube. So figure that will be the 2022/2023 lineup, but I’m not sure that will make anyone “update” their AVR. I personally don’t see much call for 8k when our human eyes can’t even resolve 4k at normal seating distance. We are at a clear threshold of diminishing returns and I’m quite pleased with the amount of product and “future proofing” I found available in the x6700h for my personal HT “wants”! I have upgraded my AVR on average every 3 years over the last 20 years. My last AVR I kept 4 years (x7200wa). This AVR I expect will last me until I need more than one HDMI 2.1 port, which may be 5 years +.
Denon must be somewhat concerned about this slowing upgrade cycle in their business. Likewise the x3700h for around $1k is very near end game status for a lot of people with its 7.2.4 support. I wonder how Denon HQ plans to address this in their 5 year and 10 year planning meetings.
Maybe that’s why they are not worried about their receivers getting so hot? That’ll make you replace them sooner!
 

Dj7675

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#86
This is a review and detailed measurements of Denon AVR-X3700H 9.2 channel 8K Home Theater AV Receiver (AVR). It is kindly loaned to me by a local member and costs US $1,199.
I’m sure that most probably know this but it will do 9.2 with internal amps, but will to processing for 11.2 with an external 2 channel amp.
 

peng

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#87
Nice to see no surprises and very good performance at this price. It will be interesting in next years models if they choose to have amp disconnect on all channels individually or save that feature for their flagship model. My only other comment is to continue to develop Audyssey. The app was a huge improvement but they need to continue to develop it: more choices on room curves, 4 sub out options, include a better MIC on higher end models, option to disable surround boost with DEQ,
Makes sense, but is the X8500A vesion official, that they will sell as 2020 models, or only a new nameplate for the "send-ins"? I think they had done something like that before for the real flagships (the previous 4520 and 4810 were sort of not full blown flagships). They probably do consider the 8500 a real flagship.

By the way, now then 3 Denons have been measured with very similar SINAD, within 2 dBs in most tests, it is reasonable to expect the 8500 to be in the same ball park, but what is your subjective impression in "sound quality" in comparison with the AVR, or whatever it was that the 8500 replaced?
 
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#88
The way to go would be individually disconnectable amps, or at least add the center channel to the disconnectable ones.

Disconnecting power amplifiers one-by-one from the associated preamp would be a great feature. Hopefully (?) individual disconnection will be done by adding another 8-channel volume control and not by adding more CMOS switches. The lack of the switches in the signal path for the L/R channels in the X3600H seems to be a factor in the better performance shown by the X3600H.

Generally the L/R channels have the worst signal path in D/M AVR's. This is to allow selection between external stereo analog inputs and L/R DAC outputs. Higher end D/M units have more switches in the signal path. These added switches allow more flexibility, but this added flexibility appears to be at the cost of worse performance.

It would also be nice if a third position were added to the relay that controls the rail voltage coming from the transformer for the power amplifiers. Today this relay switches between high and low voltage AC outputs from the power transformer to provide the ECO function. A third position or added relay that would disconnect the power amplifiers completely from power would be really nice. This would allow use of the AVR as a pure AVP without the extra heat or energy use by the unused power amplifier channels. Channel by channel disconnection would be even nicer, but would add significant complexity and cost.
 

D700

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#89
Exactly, plus whoever uses them just get a converter and solved.
Jesus what a waste of AVR space and costs.

Maybe from 2025 and up they start taking gimmicks out and improve SINAD, Power, Auto EQ to the standars of Dirac, etc...im hoping.
I've wondered the same thing for 10 years now. Though Amirm might choke without having an analog input, I'd love to see a simplified digital only integrated from Denon/Marantz. Just get the legacy crap out and focus on performance. I guess maybe an XLR if you have to have something.
 

Dj7675

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#90
Makes sense, but is the X8500A vesion official, that they will sell as 2020 models, or only a new nameplate for the "send-ins"? I think they had done something like that before for the real flagships (the previous 4520 and 4810 were sort of not full blown flagships). They probably do consider the 8500 a real flagship.

By the way, now then 3 Denons have been measured with very similar SINAD, within 2 dBs in most tests, it is reasonable to expect the 8500 to be in the same ball park, but what is your subjective impression in "sound quality" in comparison with the AVR, or whatever it was that the 8500 replaced?
My understanding is there will be an A version sold with 8k input like Marantz 8802 had an A version.
 
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#92
Disconnecting power amplifiers one-by-one from the associated preamp would be a great feature
I would be very surprised if this feature trickled all the way down to the 3000 series. I could see Denon purposely keeping this in the flagship only but wouldn’t mind it coming down the pipeline to their entire X lineup.
 

Baff

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#93
Makes sense, but is the X8500A vesion official, that they will sell as 2020 models, or only a new nameplate for the "send-ins"?
The X8500HA is expected around December. That is the X8500H with HDMI board upgraded to 2.1.

The 110th Anniversary model (110A?) is expected in September. They will likely put out the official announcement in 2-3 weeks. Internally, this will be very similar to the X8500HA, but with a few extra bits of polish, a longer (5 year?) warranty and a 110th anniversary booklet. It will likely cost $500-$1000 more than the 8500.
 

RichB

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#94
Thanks @amirm for the great review.

I have a 3700H configured in a vacation home in Maine, no AC.
It is in preamp mode and the right side is very warm. I cleaned the fans and move the fan to that side of the cabinet which helped a bit. I have a couple of Noctua USB fans on order that should be quieter and move more air. Cleaning the existing fans about doubled their output.
Hopefully, folks wont be using the internal fans much because they can get dusty...

Overall, I do feel the sound is improved over the old Onkyo TX-NR705 (also used as a preamp) but with the current weather, there are lots of fans blowing.. :)

The startup time is a bit longer than the Onkyo, 10 seconds or so. The menus are complete and easy to use. I set the crossovers and that's about it.
I am happy with the purchase.

- Rich
 
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#95
Maybe from 2025 and up they start taking gimmicks out and improve SINAD, Power, Auto EQ to the standars of Dirac, etc...im hoping.
Despite the perception and premium cost, Dirac is not much better than Audyssey XT32, and is in fact much worse when it comes to integrating subwoofers (with the exception of the Bass Control add-on, but they do different things). Neither do a good job of EQ above the bass region. Dirac lacks Dynamic EQ based on equal loudness, but has a better curve editor interface (but you won't use it if only applying EQ to the bass region).
 
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da Choge

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#96
The 110th Anniversary model (110A?) is expected in September. They will likely put out the official announcement in 2-3 weeks. Internally, this will be very similar to the X8500HA, but with a few extra bits of polish, a longer (5 year?) warranty and a 110th anniversary booklet.
That's my understanding as well, although the only place I've read this is from jdsmoothie's posts over at AVSForum; he's very reliable though. I'm hoping it will be just a gussied-up early release of the X8500HA, with the new HDMI 2.1 board already there.

Supposedly, if you have a pre-HDMI 2.1 X8500H (the only model that is available currently), you will be able to get it upgraded with the new 2.1 board, but you'll have to ship it to Denon somewhere in the Northeast - I imagine that will cost a pretty penny for the entire upgrade, especially considering the weight of the unit.
 

GXAlan

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#97
The X8500HA is expected around December. That is the X8500H with HDMI board upgraded to 2.1.

The 110th Anniversary model (110A?) is expected in September. They will likely put out the official announcement in 2-3 weeks. Internally, this will be very similar to the X8500HA, but with a few extra bits of polish, a longer (5 year?) warranty and a 110th anniversary booklet. It will likely cost $500-$1000 more than the 8500.
The 100th Anniversary receiver had special capacitors too. Given the claims of the 6700 defect, it would be interesting if better capacitors can somehow translate into better measured performance in the 110th Anniversary model
 
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#98
Thanks @amirm for the great review.

I have a 3700H configured in a vacation home in Maine, no AC.
It is in preamp mode and the right side is very warm. I cleaned the fans and move the fan to that side of the cabinet which helped a bit. I have a couple of Noctua USB fans on order that should be quieter and move more air. Cleaning the existing fans about doubled their output.
Hopefully, folks wont be using the internal fans much because they can get dusty...

Overall, I do feel the sound is improved over the old Onkyo TX-NR705 (also used as a preamp) but with the current weather, there are lots of fans blowing.. :)

The startup time is a bit longer than the Onkyo, 10 seconds or so. The menus are complete and easy to use. I set the crossovers and that's about it.
I am happy with the purchase.

- Rich
A few questions and comments:

Are you replacing the fans in the X3700H or adding adding fans on the outside of the unit?

Love Noctua fans. Black or the traditional Noctua color, if the fans are available both ways with USB power.

Are you blowing air into the case or pulling air out? I ask that because, IMO, blowing air into the case (positive pressure in the case) and using a filter on the fan would seem best based PC experience. Such a setup leaves the interior of a PC pristine. As you essentially are noting, dust is a real issue that can impede effective cooling.

Any thoughts of driving AHB2's from the X3700H? At high gain that would seem to work.
 
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#99
The X8500HA is expected around December. That is the X8500H with HDMI board upgraded to 2.1.

The 110th Anniversary model (110A?) is expected in September. They will likely put out the official announcement in 2-3 weeks. Internally, this will be very similar to the X8500HA, but with a few extra bits of polish, a longer (5 year?) warranty and a 110th anniversary booklet. It will likely cost $500-$1000 more than the 8500.
Likely the main selling point.
 
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Despite the perception and premium cost, Dirac is not much better than Audyssey XT32, and is in fact much worse when it comes to integrating subwoofers. Neither do a good job of EQ above the bass region. Dirac lacks Dynamic EQ based on equal loudness, but has a better curve editor interface (but you won't use it if only applying EQ to the bass region).
While Dirac was/is late when it comes to integrating subs, it is superior in every other aspect. It's especially good for full range use.
 

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