I hope that this one will actually get some significant upgrades... or not, otherwise I will only get tempted to upgrade my 4800
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Denon 2023 range X3900H/X4900H/X6800H announcement....!!??
- Thread starter rana_kirti
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As if you would ever really hear the difference.
I just got a 3800 and am disappointed by this refresh of the series.
The 3800 will sell out like hot cake now since there is pretty much no incentive at all to go for the newer model with this large price delta.
napfkuchen
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I fail to understand the disappointment. The X3900H offers (only on paper) superior DACs, HDMI 2.3, an Atmos Channel Expander and the ability to use wireless surround speakers. For me, none of these points are relevant. Okay, AirPlay 2 is also worth mentioning, but the functionality of my existing Apple TV is sufficient for me. Also why should the price of the X3800H drop significantly at this stage or its successor reach the 1.000 Euro price point anytime soon?
For me, definitely no reason to upgrade.
Did you mean HDMI 2.2? Well, the 3800H is already 2.1 and 8k all-in/out. My TV isn't there yet nor will it be in the near future.
The wireless speakers might be interesting to some. I was tempted to use that with Yamaha MusicCast in a certain location. Quite a nice option when cabling is very hard to do and one can live with what these wireless speakers achieve.
I suspect many, incl. me, are looking at the DAC mainly. Then again, when I attempt to compare analog/pure direct from an ES9038, analog/adc/dac/stereo and toslink/dac/stereo - I fail to hear any up- or downgrade in sound. For me this is more a thing of putting it on my future wishlist.
Fun fact: my old Harman AVR355 died just the day before the announcement.
I was between 4800 and Integra DRX 5.4. The new specs of 3900 just didn't convince me, after all this waiting time.
I'm pretty sure now that 4900 will have the same philosophy.
I guess I'll choose between the same two again.
I was between 4800 and Integra DRX 5.4. The new specs of 3900 just didn't convince me, after all this waiting time.
I'm pretty sure now that 4900 will have the same philosophy.
I guess I'll choose between the same two again.
Avr refreshes have always been incremental. You get some new standard support but drastic changes? Probably not.I hope that this one will actually get some significant upgrades... or not, otherwise I will only get tempted to upgrade my 4800
There is a new HDMI 2.1b standard. Even within 2.1 there are multiple features that are not fully supported by every implementation. 2.0b is already enough for most people for video only. Higher bandwidth and other features are needed for video gamesDid you mean HDMI 2.2? Well, the 3800H is already 2.1 and 8k all-in/out. My TV isn't there yet nor will it be in the near future.
The wireless speakers might be interesting to some. I was tempted to use that with Yamaha MusicCast in a certain location. Quite a nice option when cabling is very hard to do and one can live with what these wireless speakers achieve.
I suspect many, incl. me, are looking at the DAC mainly. Then again, when I attempt to compare analog/pure direct from an ES9038, analog/adc/dac/stereo and toslink/dac/stereo - I fail to hear any up- or downgrade in sound. For me this is more a thing of putting it on my future wishlist.
RZ-51 will have higher power probably than the RZ-31. That’s similar to the 3800 vs 4800 in terms of channel processing and amplification.
Plus if Onkyo is upping RZ-31 to 11 channel processing they may up the RZ-51 to 13 channel. My guess is the X4900H will also be 13 channel processing
If I'm remotely interested in wireless speakers, then some of the amplification is presumably done somewhere else. Then I'd only care about the 2900 (Dirac capable) or lower end models (not Dirac capable). Unless you really need 9-11 channels, why pay for amplification/DACs you won't use?
Anyone have experience w/how well Dirac performs over wireless speakers?
My guess is, it will stays at 11. Rationale: a) avoid competing with its own cousins, i.e. the AVR-X6800H, and b) The Marantz AV30 preamp/processor.
Just by the way, I am guessing that because it seems obvious, Denon's website info hardly even mention the 13 channel processing capability of the AVR-X6800H, is that a directive from the previous corporate owner Masimo marketing, who wants to maintain a higher volume sale ration of Marantz
enon, for the obvious reason that Marantz products command a much higher profit margin? I assume so..Fun facts: AV30 list price $4,000, AVR-X6800H price $3,799, that's tough enough to pick the AV30 vs the X6800H, and the AVR-X4800H is $2,799, so the AVR-X4900H will likely be around $2,899 to $2,999. With the upgraded DAC, the only main reason to choose the Marantz AV30 would be the aesthetic, and the willingness to pay $1,000 more for that, and if the X4900H actually offers 13.4, then the only other reason for me to pick the AV30 will be I might just be out of my mind, as I don't even have long enough interconnects to benefit from XLR outputs, never had ground loop issues, and if I did, know how to get rid of it.
The DRX 5.4 makes a lot of sense if you don't care about ART. However, the 4800 is more future proof since it is ART-capable and has 4 discrete SW outs.
As I said before, there's no chance the RZ-31 is going to be 11 channels processing. What would be the point of the RZ51 and RZ71 then?
PAC has been fairly predictable in feature set if you follow this pattern: Onkyo 7100/Integra DRX 3.4/Pioneer 305 -> RZ30 -> RZ31. Why would it change from this pattern?
Unless you want 9 channels right - then you have to go for the x3900?
Yes, I did put the 9-11 channel qualifier there.
My curiosity still stands: how well does Dirac (any flavor) do over wireless speakers? I would imagine ART could be a nightmare trying to tame GD. You'd get good performance on days when wireless doesn't get interference?
Looking at historic Onkyo they up power between models. And there wasn’t enough difference IMHO between 7100 and the RZ-30. So a good lineup would be
NR-7200 100W 9/9
RZ-31 100W 9/11
RZ-51 120W 9/13
RZ-71 140W 11/15
Oops sorry I missed that.
You missed the fact that the RZ61 will exist so that throws a wrench in your theory. Look at the CES pic again.
I questioned the existence of the RZ61 as soon as I found out about it. Now Onkyo is more likely to remove features to make all the models in the lineup fit so as to not cannibalize sales!
Summary from CES pic: not only should we "hope" for status quo, there's a good chance features previously enjoyed in prior gen gets shifted in the lineup to a higher product.
The pic you posted had the power of the RZ-61 covered. I found this pic with the power listed.
So the lineup could look like
NR-7200 100W 9/9
RZ-31 100W 9/11
RZ-51 120W 9/13
RZ-61 135W 11/13
RZ-71 140W 11/15
This would also match the 4 channel power amp Onkyo showed which I assume could become 2 channel bridged
