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Denon 2023 range X3900H/X4900H/X6800H announcement....!!??

peng said:
They have been saying that it would be nice though it may be hard to quantify the potentially audible benefits. Keep in mind those who own the AV10/20 are likely using more than 15 channels maximum. If you use fewer channels, such as up to only 11 to 15 channels maximum, you will not need as much processing power, naturally.
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on my 11 channel setup (5.2.4) - with ART configured the results are totally exemplary both subjectively and objectively - and I use between 53 and 63 cross terms of the 96 available on my X4800 - but it is possible to max out the cross terms if the configuration is not judiciously set up - and then sound quality suffers.

So yes there could be justification for higher powered DSP's that allow an order of magnitude more cross terms - so as to cater to either more channels, or simply, simpler all to all default support configurations without hitting a cross terms limit wall and degrading the sound. (default setup tried to use my height speakers to support the mains - even though those speakers have nothing to offer below 150Hz!! - but configured that way it maxed out the cross terms, and the sound wasn't as good as when I excluded them - which brought the cross terms down to the 50 to 60 range)

For me and my 4 month old X4800... the only thing that would pique my interest would be an adjustable loudness and volume compression feature.... but whether that would be enough the get me to shell out to replace my brand new AVR.... I doubt it!
 
I've read somewhere in the Denon information that May, 14 is the end of the NDA. Let's see what Denon brings to the table with the dac implementation and the end result in general. There is probably not much change or they would advertise with that dac change. There is nothing found in the marketing material.

Yes, I know, I can't hear the difference, but it just feels good knowing they did their best and higher just feels better. I like the Marantz and Denon brand.
 
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Thank you. I did see them. In the 3800 there is a dac board under the top boards with 8 pcm5102A. Are these those replacements?
 
Toni71 said:
Thank you. I did see them. In the 3800 there is a dac board under the top boards with 8 pcm5102A. Are these those replacements?
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IDK, PCM1803 are ADCs - there has to be another board with DACs.
 
Toni71 said:
Thank you. I did see them. In the 3800 there is a dac board under the top boards with 8 pcm5102A. Are these those replacements?
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If that's true, then it's the same DACs as in the 3800/4800. No surprise there (for me). All this talk about possibly switching to ESS DACs was too much $$$ in my eyes.

index.php
 
Maybe I triggered some confusion. English is not my native language. Sorry, I pointed at the underlying dac board in the 3800H. EemGee pointed at the ADC dacs on top. My answer was 'are these the new dacs?' They aren't.

We will know soon, I guess. If they use ESS or AKM now, there marketing documents would probably mention that. They don't. I would, for better sales.
 
I got some information finally. @peng heads up! :)

Cirrus Logic CS4308S High-performance 8-channel DAC

Dynamic Range: 118dB (the old TI has 112dB)
THD+N: -110dB (the old TI has -93dB)


Both the AVR-X2900H and AVC-X3900H use the Cirrus Logic CS4308S — a new 32-bit, 8-channel DAC — as their main DAC, but in different configurations:

AVR-X2900H: 1× CS4308S (covering FL/FR/FC/SL/SR/SBL/SBR/SW1)

AVC-X3900H: 2× CS4308S (chip #1 for FL/FR/FC/SW1/SW2/SW3/SW4; chip #2 for H1L/H1R/H2L/H2R/SL/SR/SBL/SBR)

Both models also use a TI PCM5100A for the Zone 2 DAC.

The CS4308S is described as a "new 32-bit 8-channel DAC for audio performance improvement" over the previous generation (which used the TI PCM5102 in the X3800H/X2800H). It's controlled via I2C from the MCU.
 
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SynthesisCinema said:
I got some information finally. @peng heads up! :)

Cirrus Logic CS4308S High-performance 8-channel DAC

Dynamic Range: 118dB (the old TI has 112dB)
THD+N: -110dB (the old TI has -93dB)


Both the AVR-X2900H and AVC-X3900H use the Cirrus Logic CS4308S — a new 32-bit, 8-channel DAC — as their main DAC, but in different configurations:

AVR-X2900H: 1× CS4308S (covering FL/FR/FC/SL/SR/SBL/SBR/SW1)

AVC-X3900H: 2× CS4308S (chip #1 for FL/FR/FC/SW1/SW2/SW3/SW4; chip #2 for H1L/H1R/H2L/H2R/SL/SR/SBL/SBR)

Both models also use a TI PCM5100A for the Zone 2 DAC.

The CS4308S is described as a "new 32-bit 8-channel DAC for audio performance improvement" over the previous generation (which used the TI PCM5102 in the X3800H/X2800H). It's controlled via I2C from the MCU.
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That would be fantastic, the 4308s is much better, comparable to the ES9017S used in the 6800, C30 and AV30, and SINAD spec is 17 dB better than the PCM5102A.
 
www.denon.com

AVR-X2900H - 7.2 Ch. 95W 4K/8K Dolby Atmos AV Receiver Powered by HEOS™ | Denon - US

The Denon AVR-X2900H delivers high-performance Dolby Atmos and DTS:X 3D sound, whole-home streaming Powered by HEOS, your choice of advanced room correction, and modern connectivity for flexible, immersive home entertainment.
www.denon.com www.denon.com

www.denon.com

AVR-X3900H - 9.4 Ch. 105W 4K/8K Dolby Atmos AV Receiver Powered by HEOS™ | Denon - US

The Denon AVR-X3900H delivers immersive home theater experiences with powerful multichannel sound, high-resolution video support, advanced room correction, and flexible system configurations, plus whole-home streaming Powered by HEOS™.
www.denon.com www.denon.com

Changes:

Improved 32-bit 8-channel DAC (Cirrus Logic)
LE Audio Bluetooth and Dolby Atmos streaming via AirPlay 2
New Web UI 2.0 interface with HDMI Diagnostics
1440p pass-through, with AMD FreeSync support
New Centre Bi-Amp mode
Channel Level Monitor
New backlit remote
Wireless surround functionality (Denon Home speakers)
USB power at rear
 
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SynthesisCinema said:
Both the AVR-X2900H and AVC-X3900H use the Cirrus Logic CS4308S — a new 32-bit, 8-channel DAC — as their main DAC, but in different configurations:
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The CS DAC looks good on paper, what Denon made out of it has to be measured. Looking forward to that test. :)

The X2900H is stripped of most pre-amp outputs sadly, otherwise it would be a new hot candidate for pre-amp mode with possible superb DAC performance.
 
Ruediger said:
The CS DAC looks good on paper, what Denon made out of it has to be measured. Looking forward to that test. :)

The X2900H is stripped of most pre-amp outputs sadly, otherwise it would be a new hot candidate for pre-amp mode with possible superb DAC performance.
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Marantz is refreshing their line up in the fall and there should be new C70s with the updated DAC and full set of pre-outs. Nothing is confirmed though, i just heard that new Marantz models will be launched later this year. However it may not get the Dirac upgrade option and if it does then it will be like X2900H without support for Bass Control as there is no independent sub outs. Not necessarily end of the world with single subwoofer and some manual tweaking. Still night and day better than the original MultEQ which came around 2004 i believe. We are soon at 2027 and to think D&M engineers can´t implement something better on these. :facepalm: The answer is more like they can, but they don´t want!

I bet everyone is waiting for the X3900H to be tested and also @amirm can now do full testing for the X2900H model as the USA model is fitted with front pre-outs! :) I also reached Gene D.S at Audioholics as he has close ties to D&M.
 
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Ruediger said:
The CS DAC looks good on paper, what Denon made out of it has to be measured. Looking forward to that test. :)
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Fully agreed, though Denon has a solid track record in that they managed to squeeze dry everything from that low SINAD PCM5102A in the AVR-X3800H as indicated in Amir's tests, achieving >90 dB up to about 1.5-1.6 V output, and the AVR-X4800H, Cinema 40 that uses the same DAC IC achieved 94-95.7 dB at 2 V, that actually exceeded TI's specifications of 93 dB!

So, I am somewhat confident that with the Cirrus Logic IC (hopefully the info on that one is reliable), we would likely see better than 95 dB on Amir's test bench, but again we (the SINAD chasers) have to see before jumping in. For those who don't care much about SINAD>80 dB pre out, then the X3800H might be a better deal when it goes on clearance sale.
 
SynthesisCinema said:
www.denon.com

AVR-X2900H - 7.2 Ch. 95W 4K/8K Dolby Atmos AV Receiver Powered by HEOS™ | Denon - US

The Denon AVR-X2900H delivers high-performance Dolby Atmos and DTS:X 3D sound, whole-home streaming Powered by HEOS, your choice of advanced room correction, and modern connectivity for flexible, immersive home entertainment.
www.denon.com www.denon.com

www.denon.com

AVR-X3900H - 9.4 Ch. 105W 4K/8K Dolby Atmos AV Receiver Powered by HEOS™ | Denon - US

The Denon AVR-X3900H delivers immersive home theater experiences with powerful multichannel sound, high-resolution video support, advanced room correction, and flexible system configurations, plus whole-home streaming Powered by HEOS™.
www.denon.com www.denon.com

Changes:

Improved 32-bit 8-channel DAC (Cirrus Logic)
LE Audio Bluetooth and Dolby Atmos streaming via AirPlay 2
New Web UI 2.0 interface with HDMI Diagnostics
1440p pass-through, with AMD FreeSync support
New Centre Bi-Amp mode
Channel Level Monitor
New backlit remote
Wireless surround functionality (Denon Home speakers)
USB power at rear
Click to expand...

Is the CL 4308S info from a highly reliable source, better yet if directly from the D+M? Thanks.
 
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