dCS Varèse

[boxerfan88]

Improved over what?

Over their previous TOTL model.

This doesn’t seem like a hard thing to do… they made it difficult by putting the damn things in separate enclosures in the first place . They created a solution for a problem that shouldn’t be there

So what? Different strokes for different folks. Just like some like integrated amplifier, some like preamp + mono blocks.

 

[voodooless]

Over their previous TOTL model.

Ah, so they finally caught up with a $80 DAC in that regard.

So what? Different strokes for different folks. Just like some like integrated amplifier, some like preamp + mono blocks.

Yes, it’s our audio jewelry. Then stop pretending it’s for the engineering excellence and sound quality.

 

[boxerfan88]

Ah, so they finally caught up with a $80 DAC in that regard.

What proof do you have? Have you measured the dCS? So much hatred.

Yes, it’s our audio jewelry. Then stop pretending it’s for the engineering excellence and sound quality.

From what is shown in the video, over-engineered for sure, to me it’s engineering excellence, to you it isn’t, that’s ok. So what if the casing is audio jewellery? Why the hatred towards dCS? Jealous that they can engineer something so expensive?

 

[Purité Audio]

‘Jealous they can engineer something so expensive,’ their ‘engineering is no better than any competently designed dac , their pricing reflects the market they are aiming for, the wealthy and technically i’ll-informed.
Keith

 

[boxerfan88]

Ah… so hatred against the wealthy… makes sense…

So let me do a quick test … feel the same way about Patek Phillipe / Rolex? or the likes of Buggati Chiron? as dCS?

 

[DavidEdwinAston]

Sorry Keith, I'm only allowed to give you one like, for that post!
As an aside, why do folks need to use the word hate, for posts that merely critique a product? Got me beat!

 

[Purité Audio]

Don’t be silly, DCS can make as expensive a dac and compartmentalise it into as many boxes as they choose, what I object to ,and this is true of every ‘high-end’ product is the suggestion that the exorbitant price guarantees better sound quality which it does not.
Keith

 

[Mart68]

Ah… so hatred against the wealthy… makes sense…

So let me do a quick test … feel the same way about Patek Phillipe / Rolex? or the likes of Buggati Chiron? as dCS?

It's been said before many times - Rolex don't claim their watches keep better time than a Casio, nor do watch reviewers or watch owners. That's the difference.

 

[boxerfan88]

It's been said before many times - Rolex don't claim their watches keep better time than a Casio, nor do watch reviewers or watch owners. That's the difference.

Ah.. so your beef is with their marketing message… that’s perfectly fine.

 

[Mart68]

Ah.. so your beef is with their marketing message… that’s perfectly fine.

Wouldn't go so far as to call it a 'beef'. It's a UK company, mostly export, helps our balance of payments.

More power to them if they can charge those prices and make sales.

I expect them to write some over-ambitious prose about the SQ in their marketing brochure and their ads. It's all the unpaid cheerleaders that follow on who get a bit tedious.

 

[voodooless]

What proof do you have? Have you measured the dCS?

Have they? They seem to have forgotten to include the most important specs on their spec sheet… let them give the proof.. should not be hard, they must be able to afford an AP after selling a single one of these…

From what is shown in the video, over-engineered for sure, to me it’s engineering excellence, to you it isn’t, that’s ok.

It’s not engineering excellence. It’s just designing insane stuff to be able to spend more money on more expensive parts. It serves no purpose to improve the sound.

So what if the casing is audio jewellery?

I don’t care about the jewelry part. I do care about nonsense claims.

 

[boxerfan88]

Wouldn't go so far as to call it a 'beef'. It's a UK company, mostly export, helps our balance of payments.

More power to them if they can charge those prices and make sales.

I expect them to write some over-ambitious prose about the SQ in their marketing brochure and their ads.

If the above is okay for you.

It's all the unpaid cheerleaders that follow on who get a bit tedious.

Then, why is this a problem for you?

 

[boxerfan88]

Have they? They seem to have forgotten to include the most important specs on their spec sheet… let them give the proof.. should not be hard, they must be able to afford an AP after selling a single one of these…


It’s not engineering excellence. It’s just designing insane stuff to be able to spend more money on more expensive parts. It serves no purpose to improve the sound.

What proof do you have that it serves no purpose?

I don’t care about the jewelry part. I do care about nonsense claims.

What proof do you have that their claim is nonsense?

 

[Purité Audio]

You have looked at some of Amir’s dac measurements?
Keith

 

[voodooless]

What proof do you have that it serves no purpose?
What proof do you have that their claim is nonsense?

Because it’s obvious that it’s nonsense if you have the slightest bit of knowledge on the subject.

And again. Why do I have to prove anything? I’m not the one asking an exorbitant amount of money for something that has been a solved problem for decades and now can be had for as little as $100 or less for SOTA performance. If they think otherwise, they damn well come with some irrefutable proof. Instead they do their best to hide and obscure any useful information.

 

[Mart68]

If the above is okay for you.



Then, why is this a problem for you?

We expect the salesman to sell to us, we take that into account.

Supposedly independent reviewers or 'happy owners' are given a higher level of credibility by punters who do not have a basic grounding in audio.

If you haven't had people coming to you saying they made a big financial mistake by believing 'professional' reviews or following the advice of people who seem to know what they're talking about on forums ('They have really expensive kit, so I assumed they were an expert') then you won't understand. But I've had to try to fix those messes!

 

[AaronJ]

What proof do you have? Have you measured the dCS? So much hatred.


From what is shown in the video, over-engineered for sure, to me it’s engineering excellence, to you it isn’t, that’s ok. So what if the casing is audio jewellery? Why the hatred towards dCS? Jealous that they can engineer something so expensive?

Over-engineering is an oxymoron. Something that is described as “over-engineered” implies the engineering is very poor. Over-specced is nice as it implies there is room for error in manufacturing, but literally any audio component (including modern $100 DACs) whose specifications are beyond the thresholds of human hearing are over-specced. Buying from dCS is purely vanity spending.

 

[fatoldgit]

- A DAC chip is the size of your thumb nail
- the power needed to drive a DAC chip is tiny
- Even if using a set of discrete components as an analogue out stage, the real estate needed is small
- the power needed to drive the analogue out stage is small
- yes we have digital input circuits but these are again small in size and low in power requirements
- good engineering principals would state that co-locating the needed circuits close to the dac chip via board level traces minimizes signal loss/degradation
- locating the power supply in a separate external box makes sense generally

There is no engineering logic which states that separating out all these co-dependant components into their own cases, joined together with masses of umbilical cords makes any sense.

Maybe it sounds great but it is pure engineering masturbation where significant effort would have gone into overcoming all the short comings of the segregated design.

I think from memory there are two boxes containing dac chips, one for the left channel and one for the right and now, for example, you have to wrapped around that some additional engineering to ensure the clock drift between the two boxes is small.

Overall it might be an engineering masterpiece but it doesn't need to exist... co-located sub-systems on the same board achieve the same results without all the design compromises.

Obviously people are free to buy what they want but they are being duped into the purchase via the price tag, their lack of technical knowledge and their narcissistic personalities ****


Peter


**** It always surprises how people with lots of money are so easily fooled. Many/most will have got their money by being hard nosed business people and yet well heeled audiophiles will spaff truck loads of money on a system they don't need...all of a sudden their hard nosed business sense disappears when buying an audio system.

 

[Short38]

Excellent thread most of which belongs in A Call For Humor. So long as dcs has any smsl DAC under the hood or hoods everything is good. With that simple tweak they could publish “end game” specs to go with the case work.

 

[dedobot]