dCS threatens with a 7-figure lawsuit over a review

[shuppatsu]

Sure they have any right. But we all know that the performance does not justify the prices. What is the luxury segment in audio actually, when the gear does nothing measureably better? Better design? I see nothing special in their devices. Better materials? Neither. So what is it then?

I haven’t seen a dCS product in the flesh but Cameron positively gushed about the build quality of the Bartok.

A $20 quartz watch beats the pants off a Rolex in accurately telling time. Nothin’ wrong with a Rolex.

 

[Justdafactsmaam]

They are selling something other than (just) performance. Nothing wrong with that at all.

They are “selling” performance. That is what they advertise. What you get for your money is the same performance with a bias effect booster

 

[pLudio]

You're wrong ! It's a problem any time there is upsampling or sample rate conversion to a higher sampling rate thus producing intermmediate samples that exceeds the internal word limit of the DAC or sample rate converter. This would not normally be a problem if the native sample rate was used and the converted samples were passed directly to an analog reconstruction filter

No, True Peak should not exceed 0 dBFS on a CD. Should we have a +3 dB headroom due to poor CDs anyway? Maybe, an option in the DAC would be nice. It will affect measured SINAD negatively.

 

[Mad_Economist]

No, True Peak should not exceed 0 dBFS on a CD. Should we have a +3 dB headroom due to poor CDs anyway? Maybe, an option in the DAC would be nice. It will affect measured SINAD negatively.

It is quite strange to me to imagine that we should accept a real risk of an audible problem (intersample clipping), rather than forgoing a difference in SNR which will be inaudible.

Indeed, it isn't even necessarily the case that the SINAD measured by APX555 would decrease - particularly for a "luxury" segment device, paralleling enough DAC chips to push the device noise meaningfully below the analyzer noise would be quite trivial, even with a 3-6dB pad.

 

[Brian Hall]

that will likely offer their customers a lifetime of enjoyment. That has a price some people are quite willing to pay. I'd take one of those DACs over a million other cheap-and-cheerful ASR chart toppers. It'll still be working perfectly in 25 years, unlike the others.

For that price, you could buy 75 $200 DACs that will be technologically superior to their overpriced box. I could easily afford to buy their DAC but I'm not dumb enough to even consider it. It is a DAC. No DAC is worth $15,000.

 

[Robin L]

For that price, you could buy 75 $200 DACs that will be technologically superior to their overpriced box. I could easily afford to buy their DAC but I'm not dumb enough to even consider it. It is a DAC. No DAC is worth $15,000.

And again, if you want a fancy box to display your audio gear, get something like an intricately carved wooden chest and stick a Smsl Su 10 in it. That box will never wear out, unless you hold wild, drunken parties at your digs.

 

[Nuni]

For that price, you could buy 75 $200 DACs that will be technologically superior to their overpriced box. I could easily afford to buy their DAC but I'm not dumb enough to even consider it. It is a DAC. No DAC is worth $15,000.

So you would want to buy 75 dacs and replace the Bartok with one of your 75 Toppings every month? Also I disagree that th $200 dacs are superior in any way or form.

 

[amirm]

It is quite strange to me to imagine that we should accept a real risk of an audible problem (intersample clipping), rather than forgoing a difference in SNR which will be inaudible.

Indeed, it isn't even necessarily the case that the SINAD measured by APX555 would decrease - particularly for a "luxury" segment device, paralleling enough DAC chips to push the device noise meaningfully below the analyzer noise would be quite trivial, even with a 3-6dB pad.

You would loose that much dynamic range permanently just in case there is a music track that has intersample overs. Do you have music that is hitting this? I don't and I have listened to tens of thousands of tracks. If you do, just reduce the volume a bit in your player upstream of the DAC.

Those of us using DSP to correct for headphone/rooms/speakers, are already in charge of headroom anyway and need all that there is in the DAC.

 

[sresener]

Certain products are tailored for specific individuals; not everyone is interested in driving a Honda Civic, for instance. When I purchased power cables and interconnects, I promptly informed the salesman to skip the aggressive sales tactics. I chose to buy them because I liked their appearance. We're lucky to live in a time where many DACs exceed the capabilities of our hearing.

 

[Galliardist]

I haven’t seen a dCS product since. The flesh but Cameron positively gushed about the build quality of the Bartok.

A $20 quartz watch beats the pants off a Rolex in accurately telling time. Nothin’ wrong with a Rolex.

There are tests around which suggest that the "best" Rolexes, properly calibrated, can perform equivalently to cheaper quartz models. Not that that's what you would buy one for, though.

 

[Billy Budapest]

Good recovery.

Cooler heads have prevailed.

 

[Robin L]

Also I disagree that th $200 dacs are superior in any way or form.

Some measure better. And by virtue of being much smaller, they can be more easily integrated with the rest of the electronics. By the standards of such low-end fare as the Topping E30 II, the measurements of the dCS DAC are found wanting. Mind you, folks have little chance of hearing any difference. But why spend $20,000 on a DAC when that money can go into better speakers?

 

[Brian Hall]

So you would want to buy 75 dacs and replace the Bartok with one of your 75 Toppings every month? Also I disagree that th $200 dacs are superior in any way or form.

Of course not. No need. I don't use Topping stuff. And there is not much need for separate DACs now anyway. I use the DACs in the Eversolo DMP-A6, the Wiim Pro Plus, and now also have a Loxjie A40 amp with a good DAC for other things that need it.

I have an Eversolo DAC-Z8 sitting on a shelf right now because I don't need it anywhere. It isn't any better than the other DACs. It does have a cool VU meter display.

 

[Blumlein 88]

There are tests around which suggest that the "best" Rolexes, properly calibrated, can perform equivalently to cheaper quartz models. Not that that's what you would buy one for, though.

How cheap do you have to go for that to be true? Less than $100. And on the other side of it you get that accuracy with $20 quartz watches.

 

[WalterW]

There are tests around which suggest that the "best" Rolexes, properly calibrated, can perform equivalently to cheaper quartz models. Not that that's what you would buy one for, though.

Surely not the best quartz watches, which are accurate about 1 second per year.
All these comparisons of hifi gear with either luxury watches or cars do not make much sense. With watches you pay for finishing and the like (see Philippe Dufour), with cars you get more performance or real luxury for your money (be it a fast Porsche or a comfortable and spacious Mercedes). In hifi, it is often just the name, marketing, bloomy words and a little design.

 

[Keith_W]

I am not sure that ingesting metal improves the culinary experience but it does come with bragging rights (vis a vi the cost).

Even if the steak is not covered in gold, you are still ingesting metal when you eat a steak. It's rich in iron. Not to mention the Sodium they put on it for seasoning, and the Calcium and Potassium in the meat.

 

[solderdude]

Good recovery.

Problem solved and damages paid to Cameron. (If they are sincere this time).

Damage to the reputation of dCS has been done and will stay on the web for people to read/watch and if there is something people love it is drama.
And all of that because a director does not (claim) to know what went on in his own company ... for years on end.

Good to read that Cameron can now breath normally again....

 

[ace_xp2]

Those who manage know this well. It's hard to find good middle management, and they can sink the whole ship very fast. Looks like DCS still has competency at the helm at least.

 

[Mad_Economist]

Do you have music that is hitting this?

That's a good question. I can't tell you with certainty, as I have used a deliberate digital negative preamp for many, many years at this point specifically so I don't have to worry about this issue. Sometime when I have a few days to kill, I'll look at the incidence of intersample overs in contemporary popular music and my own library (given how poorly produced most of my music is, I suspect it will have more).

Those of us using DSP to correct for headphone/rooms/speakers, are already in charge of headroom anyway and need all that there is in the DAC.

I'm sure that those 3dB are a life-altering difference in both peak output and usable SNR, so I fully understand you

 

[dlovesmusic]

You would loose that much dynamic range permanently just in case there is a music track that has intersample overs. Do you have music that is hitting this? I don't and I have listened to tens of thousands of tracks. If you do, just reduce the volume a bit in your player upstream of the DAC.

Those of us using DSP to correct for headphone/rooms/speakers, are already in charge of headroom anyway and need all that there is in the DAC.

It really depends on the genre of music you listen to, I listen to a lot of hard rock, and get intersample overs almost every time I listen to music. Some times even I set my player volume -3db it would still clip. Was listening to this album tonight, at least three to four tracks in the album would clip

Listening "Never Gonna Die" album by "Pennywise" on JPLAY app.