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DAP with EQ and Qobuz?

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I've tried searching, but I can't find a definitive answer.

I would like to get a DAP - hopefully in the midrange price bracket $300-$1000 (max) that has:
1. 3.5 & 4.4 outputs.
2. Can do Qobuz streaming (and Spotify too).
3. Allows offline storage of Qobuz downloads.
4. Can apply EQ even to streamed audio (online and offline), not just ripped/purchased downloaded files.
5. Would be nice if it could also load BubbleUPnP to send to my hifi.

I don't want to have to root the device or anything like that.

And of course has to measure well enough for ASR to approve.
 

Jimbob54

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I've tried searching, but I can't find a definitive answer.

I would like to get a DAP - hopefully in the midrange price bracket $300-$1000 (max) that has:
1. 3.5 & 4.4 outputs.
2. Can do Qobuz streaming (and Spotify too).
3. Allows offline storage of Qobuz downloads.
4. Can apply EQ even to streamed audio (online and offline), not just ripped/purchased downloaded files.
5. Would be nice if it could also load BubbleUPnP to send to my hifi.

I don't want to have to root the device or anything like that.

And of course has to measure well enough for ASR to approve.

A cheap Android phone and a Qudelix 5k connected via either USB or Bluetooth. Not aware of a DAP that hits your brief (Though you would need a 2.5-4.4mm adapter
 
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A cheap Android phone and a Qudelix 5k connected via either USB or Bluetooth. Not aware of a DAP that hits your brief (Though you would need a 2.5-4.4mm adapter

Thanks, but I already have the FiiO BTR5 & Xduoo XD-05 + BT adapter. Both are nice in their way.

I am looking for something that doesn't require a phone.
 

Jimbob54

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Thanks, but I already have the FiiO BTR5 & Xduoo XD-05 + BT adapter. Both are nice in their way.

I am looking for something that doesn't require a phone.

Good luck.And please do feed back if you find one.
 

cursive

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I like the Hiby lineup. They always seem to be a bit better priced than the competition, and have some unique features. Keep in mind, I have no idea if they measure well, in fact I haven't seen a single DAP measured on ASR that measures well. But perhaps DAPs have made progress in this area.

I had the original R6 back in the day when it first came out on crowdfunding site. They always had a great hand feel, very well built, and had their system wide audio architecture that other products didn't have at the time. I like android based DAPs cause it's easy and familiar vs some sluggish weird interface. They have a New R6 (or r6 2020) which is the updated version of what I had. Now I just use an LG phone, but I do miss it.

Some of the unique features on Hiby - system wide tuning and eq - bypasses normal android audio stack for bit perfect streaming - custom android rom geared toward audio - 4gb ram for snappy interface - line out mode that detects connection to amplifier vs connecting direct to headphones.
As far as I know it has full access to the android store, so no need to sideload apps, or anything like that. I'm not sure about Qobuz offline though, couldn't find any info on that.

Anyways, if your heart is set on a DAP, they're lineup is worth checking out. They have devices at pretty much all price points if you're looking for something smaller too.

EDIT: link to product I'm rambling about https://store.hiby.com/products/hiby-r6-2020
 

Rottmannash

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I've tried searching, but I can't find a definitive answer.

I would like to get a DAP - hopefully in the midrange price bracket $300-$1000 (max) that has:
1. 3.5 & 4.4 outputs.
2. Can do Qobuz streaming (and Spotify too).
3. Allows offline storage of Qobuz downloads.
4. Can apply EQ even to streamed audio (online and offline), not just ripped/purchased downloaded files.
5. Would be nice if it could also load BubbleUPnP to send to my hifi.

I don't want to have to root the device or anything like that.

And of course has to measure well enough for ASR to approve.
Hiby R5 with UAPP.
 

Sukie

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Thanks but I think UAPP doesn't work with Qobuz/Spotify offline downloads. Am I wrong?
You're correct. No local playback of Qobuz with UAPP.

Like others have said, I'm not sure that the product you're looking for exists! No problem to equalise streamed Qobuz (UAPP), but equalising offline Qobuz sounds more problematic. Even if the Hiby products do this, the equalisation doesn't appear to be as comprehensive as UAPP.

Interesting to know if you do find a solution.
 

deafenears

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Maybe an Android device and @IVX's PowerDAC? The associated HPToy app allows PEQ, IIUC.
 
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I like the Hiby lineup. They always seem to be a bit better priced than the competition, and have some unique features. Keep in mind, I have no idea if they measure well, in fact I haven't seen a single DAP measured on ASR that measures well. But perhaps DAPs have made progress in this area.

I had the original R6 back in the day when it first came out on crowdfunding site. They always had a great hand feel, very well built, and had their system wide audio architecture that other products didn't have at the time. I like android based DAPs cause it's easy and familiar vs some sluggish weird interface. They have a New R6 (or r6 2020) which is the updated version of what I had. Now I just use an LG phone, but I do miss it.

Some of the unique features on Hiby - system wide tuning and eq - bypasses normal android audio stack for bit perfect streaming - custom android rom geared toward audio - 4gb ram for snappy interface - line out mode that detects connection to amplifier vs connecting direct to headphones.
As far as I know it has full access to the android store, so no need to sideload apps, or anything like that. I'm not sure about Qobuz offline though, couldn't find any info on that.

Anyways, if your heart is set on a DAP, they're lineup is worth checking out. They have devices at pretty much all price points if you're looking for something smaller too.

EDIT: link to product I'm rambling about https://store.hiby.com/products/hiby-r6-2020

Thanks I'll have a look.
 
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I like the Hiby lineup. Now I just use an LG phone, but I do miss it.

I still have a V30, but in the UK it was hard to get LG phones, and now of course it will be impossible anywhere. Its battery life is now very poor. Phones aren't really made to last more than 2-3 years.

It seems crazy that there is no real solution to this in 2021.

I have now got a Sony Xperia 1 MK2, but it has the Sony EU volume limiter on it which means it is only really suitable for very sensitive IEMs. Even moderate volumes are hard to achieve with most headphones and even a lot of IEMs.

As we are coming out of lockdown now I will soon be back to my London commute. So I need offline playback.

Bluetooth is not a solution I'm happy with either, it's fine at home or in low EM environments, but in stations or even on the trains sometimes there is so much wifi and BT interference from literally hundreds of other devices in range, and sometimes some big EM signals from trains or large & poorly shielded equipment, that connections are often lost. BT 5 is much better, but it's still fairly common to lose connection or have very limited bandwidth. This experience is across multiple phones and headphones over many years, it's better than it was, but still pretty bad.

I think perhaps the solution is to perhaps get a very sensitive set of IEMs that doesn't need EQ and just use my phone, or possibly a DAP. I also use a set of NC headphones over the top just to reduce background noise. There are parts of the underground where the screech of the trains can go up to 110dB.

So perhaps I should be asking for a recommendation for a very sensitive IEM that has a great frequency curve that doesn't need EQ. That would take care of that element, but I was also hoping to be able to use the player with my headphones - and there of course EQ is often more essential as well as extra power to drive them.
 
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Jimbob54

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I still have a V30, but in the UK it was hard to get LG phones, and now of course it will be impossible anywhere. It's battery life is now very poor. Phones aren't really made to last more than 2-3 years.

It seems crazy that there is no real solution to this in 2021.

I have now got a Sony Xperia 1 MK2, but it has the Sony EU volume limiter on it which means it is only really suitable for very sensitive IEMs if you want to ever play even at moderate volumes with most headphones and even a lot of IEMs.

As we are coming out of lockdown now I will soon be back to my London commute. So I need offline playback.

Bluetooth is not a solution I'm happy with either, it's fine at home or in low EM environments, but in stations or even on the trains sometimes there is so much wifi and BT interference from literally hundreds of other devices in range, and sometimes some big EM signals from trains or large & poorly shielded equipment, that connections are often lost. BT 5 is much better, but it's still fairly common to lose connection or have very limited bandwidth. This experience is across multiple phones and headphones over many years, it's better than it was, but still pretty bad.

I think perhaps the solution is to perhaps get a very sensitive set of IEMs that doesn't need EQ and just use my phone, or possibly a DAP. I also use a set of NC headphones over the top just to reduce background noise. There are parts of the underground where the screech of the trains can go up to 110dB.

So perhaps I should be asking for a recommendation for a very sensitive IEM that has a great frequency curve that doesn't need EQ. That would take care of that element, but I was also hoping to be able to use the player with my headphones - and there of course EQ is often more essential as well as extra power to drive them.

Moondrop Starfield.
 

Rottmannash

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Thanks but I think UAPP doesn't work with Qobuz/Spotify offline downloads. Am I wrong?
You're correct. But it will work with their native apps which is what I do. I just like UAPP's interface. Shouldn't have brought that up-my bad. And it has the 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm pentacon outputs.
 
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You're correct. But it will work with their native apps which is what I do. I just like UAPP's interface. Shouldn't have brought that up-my bad. And it has the 3.5 mm and 4.4 mm pentacon outputs.

Not at all. I appreciate the ideas. Unfortunately when commuting on the London Underground you need the offline downloads as you are offline most of the time.
 

Rottmannash

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Not at all. I appreciate the ideas. Unfortunately when commuting on the London Underground you need the offline downloads as you are offline most of the time.
Gotcha. The R5 with an external micro SD card would fit all your needs and it sounds great and has very high power available balanced on hi gain. I don't think you could go wrong.
 

radambe

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The Sony ZX507 Walkman fits your requirements. I am literally using mine right now - listening to Qobuz offline - with the built in Sony graphic EQ applied to the 4.4mm balanced output set to high gain mode (currently driving my IER-M9’s).

I’ve been down this path, looking for something with maybe a slightly bigger screen and hopefully better battery life that can also do the things you’re looking to do - streaming apps with offline caching + tone control + 4.4mm output etc.

The ZX507 is the only product I’ve found that fits this bill, outside of perhaps some A&K models with specific firmware versions? Not sure but I’ve read some things...

The next closest contender would be the Hiby devices - R5, R5 Sabre, R6 2020, R8 - but the tone control is going to be limited to their MSEB processor.

The Sony graphic eq is really very good. I’ve found it impossible to cause audible clipping with and it also does NOT require you to constantly balance negative pre-gain. It sorts out the gain staging somehow internally and just continues to sound good no matter how far you push it. It is very very usable and I certainly enjoy using it on a fairly regular basis in my ZX507.

The device also happens to have an incredible level of fit and finish. It looks and feels like a proper japanese high end / luxury Hifi product from Sony.

My only real complaints with the device are the battery life and the somewhat restricted output power. For IEM’s it will never be a problem. For hard to drive full size headphones, expect to be riding the volume near max in high gain, but it can still do it and still sounds awesome.

The ZX507 is, in my opinion, a highly underrated and often forgotten about DAP which does things most other DAP’s can’t and delivers that sort of TOTL look and feel with a price tag that’s not insane.
 

radambe

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One additional thought - I’m not 100% certain about this, but I suspect that Sony may actually be using hardware DSP to process the EQ in the ZX507, rather than just doing it in software like almost every other DAP does with the EQ’s included in most of the built in player apps (like Hiby music, FiiO, etc).

I suspect that the EQ in the 507 may be a proper hardware DSP based process for a couple of reasons. Firstly, it works on all audio output - doesn’t care which app is generating the audio. You can literally EQ Tidal’s unfolded MQA output if you’d like. Secondly, when you engage the EQ, the analog output abruptly cuts out and then fades back in inconsistently between the left and right channels - as if the caps in the output path are having their analog inputs abruptly cut and reconnected, or like the signal being cut briefly while a DSP is electrically switched into the digital signal path just upstream from the dac/amp circuits (keeping in mind that the 507 is using a Sony proprietary “digital amplifier” / dac for its output).
 

Rottmannash

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One additional thought - I’m not 100% certain about this, but I suspect that Sony may actually be using hardware DSP to process the EQ in the ZX507, rather than just doing it in software like almost every other DAP does with the EQ’s included in most of the built in player apps (like Hiby music, FiiO, etc).

I suspect that the EQ in the 507 may be a proper hardware DSP based process for a couple of reasons. Firstly, it works on all audio output - doesn’t care which app is generating the audio. You can literally EQ Tidal’s unfolded MQA output if you’d like. Secondly, when you engage the EQ, the analog output abruptly cuts out and then fades back in inconsistently between the left and right channels - as if the caps in the output path are having their analog inputs abruptly cut and reconnected, or like the signal being cut briefly while a DSP is electrically switched into the digital signal path just upstream from the dac/amp circuits (keeping in mind that the 507 is using a Sony proprietary “digital amplifier” / dac for its output).
The Hiby DAPs are also capable of allowing MSEB to be used with any app. Also if one downloads UAPP one can purchase their eq and use that as well. One is only limited by which app or eq one wishes to download from the Play Store.
 
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The Sony ZX507 Walkman fits your requirements. I am literally using mine right now - listening to Qobuz offline - with the built in Sony graphic EQ applied to the 4.4mm balanced output set to high gain mode (currently driving my IER-M9’s).

The device also happens to have an incredible level of fit and finish. It looks and feels like a proper japanese high end / luxury Hifi product from Sony.

My only real complaints with the device are the battery life and the somewhat restricted output power. For IEM’s it will never be a problem. For hard to drive full size headphones, expect to be riding the volume near max in high gain, but it can still do it and still sounds awesome.

The ZX507 is, in my opinion, a highly underrated and often forgotten about DAP which does things most other DAP’s can’t and delivers that sort of TOTL look and feel with a price tag that’s not insane.

It does look nice - are you EU-based or US-based? I ask because the EU version is reportedly crippled with its volume output, and it's not that high even in the JP version.

I certainly have this problem with my Sony Xperia phone - the volume is okay for high-sensitivity IEMs, but for headphones it's useless - I have to use an external DAC/AMP.
 
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