Sgt. Ear Ache
Major Contributor
Speaker manufacturers love to have people think speakers need hours and hours of burn in time. They understand how it works... give speakers time for people to adjust to them and watch the return-rate plummet.
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Danny Richie Audio Myths on “Electrical Burn In”
- Thread starter LDKTA
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Sgt. Ear Ache
Major Contributor
and furthermore, I certainly hope none of the burn in proponents ever do anything like re-position their speakers in their room or re-arrange the furniture or anything, because that is a factor that truly does dramatically affect the sound in significant ways. Given how tiny any measured burn in-related changes are, they could be totally dwarfed by moving the speakers a foot or two.
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I just did a test with my new Final Electrostatic Speaker Model 15.
( I know it behaves different than a standard woofer.. but at least is a proof of 'anything')
I measured the FR when it was delivered (after one day) and after 3 weeks:
So this a extension of almost 10Hz in the bass range and 4/5dB level change at 40Hz...
I have not tested if this is audible as I run these speakers with subs normally..
I really wonder if a normal driver would change like this also..
(Would be nice if Amir could do a break-in test measurement with his next speaker coming in...)
The foil will stretch a bit after some time of use..
D
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Your speaker seems to have developed a much less smooth response from 100-1000Hz.
There is a 10db rise in response from 150Hz to 400Hz.
Dave.
Why? I thought they get driven with the same force at each point? It's just a question i have no knowledge about es speaker.
indeed, I did some close mic measurements that explain this: this speaker is build by 3 vertical segments doing different parts of the spectrum.Your speaker seems to have developed a much less smooth response from 100-1000Hz.
Dave.
These less smooth parts are at points where segments crossover.
Hopefully this will develop further in the right direction..
Anyway I also run a room-compensation that takes care of these ripples to some extent.. (I must repeat that calibration at some point in time)
The foils are put at a specific tension when being assembled.
I asked the manufacturer of this speaker and he says this tension changes in the first months of use.
Ah ok thanks a lot!
Panel speakers, ESL or planar dynamic (less so ribbons IME), will typically pick up a little LF extension as the panels break in. I suspect the higher-frequency variations are due to other factors, like a slight change in mic placement or something else around the speaker or in the room. Very minor changes can have profound effects upon the frequency response.
SpyB
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That dude knows what he is talking about.
I agree,and I quote from the article
"Maybe it’s not the speakers doing the running in, it’s the ears and brains listening to them".
We become use to the sound,and then after a time we really become accustom to it, and are happy,
or we become bored and have the desire to change.
Alas the constant upgrade path of some audio hobbyist's
lol...wait, is he calling objectivists "flat earth guys?" Because that's sort of exactly the opposite of the way it is!
Art Dudley also uses this "flat earther" epithet for those who reject audiophile doctrine. It's about on the maturity level of "I know you are, but what am I?!"
xr100
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Initially higher rate of change? Probably quite similar to a U-shaped "failure rate" chart which shows an initially higher rate that settles down?
In all IMAX Digital cinema locations, once the system is fitted the sound is calibrated with manual intervention. Microphones that were permanently installed in fixed locations in the auditorium are used to measure the calibrated frequency response. Subsequently, the system goes through a daily auto-recalibration process (IMAX nXos -- technology licensed from Audyssey) to match the original calibrated response. (I suppose the stability of the microphone responses could be questioned?)
That would seem to be a reasonable approach?
BTW, how about changes to speaker behaviour caused by room temperature, air pressure and humidity fluctuations... not to mention voice coil heating?
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What would it be if you measured it twice in a row?
Sgt. Ear Ache
Major Contributor
I'd imagine the IMAX process is mostly about just making sure the system is all functioning properly rather than any sort of adjustment for burn in in the speakers.
I'd also say atmospheric conditions and other factors (such as the mood of the listener) could easily have more impact than anything relating to burn in...
xr100
Addicted to Fun and Learning
Changes over time are what IMAX claim.
US Patent #9648437: Systems and methods for monitoring cinema loudspeakers and compensating for quality problems (Assignee: IMAX Corporation.)
A few quotes (my emphasis):
"[Claim] 5. The method of claim 1, wherein the test signal comprises at least one of: an impulse signal; a chirp signal; a maximum length sequence signal; or a swept sine signal."
"[Claim] 7. The method of claim 1, further comprising: tuning a theatre sound system prior to determining the difference, the theatre sound system including the loudspeaker."
"[Claim] 10. A system comprising: […] an equalizer unit adapted to (i) store the signature response of the loudspeaker, (ii) correlate the signature response to the optimal response, the signature response indicating what the optimal response should be at the suboptimal location of the microphone for the loudspeaker (iii) determine a difference between the signature response and the subsequent response, the difference representing changes in the loudspeaker since capturing the signature response,(iv) compensate for changes to the loudspeaker by modifying an audio signal based on the difference to generate a compensated audio signal and providing the compensated audio signal for output by the loudspeaker such that a response to the compensated audio signal represents the desired response by the loudspeaker in the patron-seating area of the theatre."
As for testing whether the system is functioning, IMAX Digital systems (worldwide) are remotely monitored from IMAX's Network Operations Center in Mississauga, Ontario. In case of driver failure, where possible (e.g. a blown subwoofer driver) the system can be set to compensate for this (e.g. by increasing the output of the remaining subwoofer drivers,) and in all cases a field technician can be dispatched for the installation of replacement parts. Incidentally, the projection system is remotely monitored and automatically recalibrated every day, too.
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A few years ago I was at an audio show in Germany and had a chance to talk to one of Focal's engineers about speaker run-in (or break-in), and he told me that if run-in had any audible impact on speakers, then Focal will be the first to offer in-factory run-in by accelerated break-in process.
The only impact on long-hour run-in is the listener ears getting adjusted to the new speakers, and allowing the newish odor of the speakers to clear out... Nevertheless, Focal are still including run-in instructions in their speakers' owners manuals, simply because of some of their consumers are expecting this run-in voodoo ritual, so their golden ears could adjust...
The only impact on long-hour run-in is the listener ears getting adjusted to the new speakers, and allowing the newish odor of the speakers to clear out... Nevertheless, Focal are still including run-in instructions in their speakers' owners manuals, simply because of some of their consumers are expecting this run-in voodoo ritual, so their golden ears could adjust...
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