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Dan Clark Aeon 2 Noire Amplifier?

JanesJr1

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The headband has two screws, which I tighten periodically and they just loosen up. I don't walk with them, headphones are for me a work (desk)/bed thing. If I'm outside I use Airpod-type objects.

I do not get sub bass when pressing the ear cups harder, I just tried it, being intrigued by your question. In fact it's the opposite, the bass gets worse and the highs get overpowering.

I tried all the pads they give (each for at least a month, just to try to get rid of habituation). Subjectively, my impression of bass improves if I use the most absorbent pads. Of course they cannot improve the bass, they just cut the highs, it's all in my head, but there you go. Still, I remain of the opinion that it cannot do very low bass, basically at all. There's like a cut-off there, it goes off a cliff.


Very tough question. I think all my other headphones do more satisfying bass, but in terms of "liking", I feel stumped. I guess the closest would be between the ATH50xBT (which is very strong but too much) and the ATH-DSR9BT (which is a little lean but very controlled). For sure, I "like" the bass of my Paradigm 95F speakers, through RoomPerfect. It's really good.

But look, to a large extent I'm sure it's my misshapen head. I don't fret it too much. Headphone nirvana is hard to get into.
I have used the Noire for a year now, and compared it carefully to several other headphones and IEM's. I can never reconcile the comments about bass somehow being limited with the DCA phones. It is always deep and undistorted for me. I can EQ to the point of gross error (beyond anyone's acceptable taste) without audible distortion, and it's easier to do with the Noire than any other headphone I've used. And the DCA Noire and Closed X are one of the very, very few headphones that are level down to 20 Hz, or very close to it, without EQ.

At least half my listening is with acoustic sources, so I especially appreciate a smooth integration of frequency response from sub-bass to treble. I could, but won't, go on about this, but the point is that the Noire does this with ease.

Finally, both I and a friend who uses the DCA closed X wear hornrim glasses and the glasses have absolutely no effect on the bass for either headphone for us.

I accept that others are reporting what they experienced, but I have had none of these problems with the bass with two sets of DCA headphones. It's confusing.

Finally, I periodically see comments about the 'slam' factor being less with the DCA's than with, say, Focals, some HiFiMan headphones or Audeze's. I have made any number of A/b comparisons with Sundara (mentioned as more 'macrodynamic' than the Noire), on a level-matched, EQ-matched (Oratory/Harman) and bidirectional basis (I know, sighted, but as controlled as I could make it at home). I found that when level- and EQ-matched, the dynamics sounded virtually identical between the Sundara and Noire on the majority of the dozens of dynamic reference tracks played.*

I haven't compared to the Audeze or Focal headphones, and accept that they may indeed have greater dynamics. That said, I don't understand how anyone would want greater dynamics, since a good number of my test tracks are so dynamic through the Noire that I can't find a satisfying volume setting, b/c either dynamic peaks are hurtfully loud, or the average SPL is too low.

What am I missing? I know, 'slam' is subjective and not subject to a common standard of measurement. And my A/B comparisons were at best quasi-controlled. But not the level of bass nor the dynamic range nor the seal of the earpads is even remotely a practical problem for me with the Noire, to the point where I wonder what's going on.

* With bass EQ'd up to Harman, the Sundara seems to have a little distortion in the mid-bass, and it seems to be euphonic, lending a nice resonance to, for example, bass guitar. This enhances some music; while I like the wonderfully tight and undistorted bass of the Noire on other music. With other phones, like HD650, the bass becomes excessively distorted when EQ'd up to Harman. Dan Clark has commented that planar bass can sound thinner because we are unused to hearing the undistorted bass of good planars if we're mostly familiar with resonant dynamic drivers. Maybe so.
 
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symphara

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I have used the Noire for a year now, and compared it carefully to several other headphones and IEM's. I can never reconcile the comments about bass somehow being limited with the DCA phones. It is always deep and undistorted for me. I can EQ to the point of gross error (beyond anyone's acceptable taste) without audible distortion, and it's easier to do with the Noire than any other headphone I've used. And the DCA Noire and Closed X are one of the very, very few headphones that are level down to 20 Hz, or very close to it, without EQ.

At least half my listening is with acoustic sources, so I especially appreciate a smooth integration of frequency response from sub-bass to treble. I could, but won't, go on about this, but the point is that the Noire does this with ease.

Finally, both I and a friend who uses the DCA closed X wear hornrim glasses and the glasses have absolutely no effect on the bass for either headphone for us.

I accept that others are reporting what they experienced, but I have had none of these problems with the bass with two sets of DCA headphones. It's confusing.

Finally, I periodically see comments about the 'slam' factor being less with the DCA's than with, say, Focals, some HiFiMan headphones or Audeze's. I have made any number of A/b comparisons with Sundara (mentioned as more 'macrodynamic' than the Noire), on a level-matched, EQ-matched (Oratory/Harman) and bidirectional basis (I know, sighted, but as controlled as I could make it at home). I found that when level- and EQ-matched, the dynamics sounded virtually identical between the Sundara and Noire on the majority of the dozens of dynamic reference tracks played.*

I haven't compared to the Audeze or Focal headphones, and accept that they may indeed have greater dynamics. That said, I don't understand how anyone would want greater dynamics, since a good number of my test tracks are so dynamic through the Noire that I can't find a satisfying volume setting, b/c either dynamic peaks are hurtfully loud, or the average SPL is too low.

What am I missing? I know, 'slam' is subjective and not subject to a common standard of measurement. And my A/B comparisons were at best quasi-controlled. But not the level of bass nor the dynamic range nor the seal of the earpads is even remotely a practical problem for me with the Noire, to the point where I wonder what's going on.

* With bass EQ'd up to Harman, the Sundara seems to have a little distortion in the mid-bass, and it seems to be euphonic, lending a nice resonance to, for example, bass guitar. This enhances some music; while I like the wonderfully tight and undistorted bass of the Noire on other music. With other phones, like HD650, the bass becomes excessively distorted when EQ'd up to Harman. Dan Clark has commented that planar bass can sound thinner because we are unused to hearing the undistorted bass of good planars if we're mostly familiar with resonant dynamic drivers. Maybe so.
I don't have your experience with high-end headphones so I cannot comment on those brands. I just did a quick comparison with the DSR9 (cannot level match, just "loud enough" by ear) and out of the box, with the ifi with no options enabled, there's no doubt that the DSR9 has better bass (without being overpowering, it's lean and controlled to me) compared to the Noire. I chose the DSR9 here because it's got a sound that's very similar to the planar magnetic sound and to the Noire. The difference is the bass and the spaciousness of the presentation, which is wider on the Noire (thus more pleasant).

I tried all the bass settings on the ifi (with Presence, no Presence, XSpace etc) and in the end just having XBass (alone or +Presence) improves the bass, the "Presence" and "XSpace" options add other colorations that I am relatively indifferent to.

But even so, the "slam" is not at the same level.

Strange, I don't think this is a problem of what you call "dynamics". The Noires seem plenty dynamic to me.

Another difference is that going very loud I think the Noires get distorted, the sound is a bit fuzzy. The DSR9 remain very clean, having their built-in amplification. It's probably the ifi at fault here, I imagine. Thankfully, I don't tend to listen at high volumes using headphones (I would like to retain some hearing ability) and at anything reasonable the Noires have no problem with the ifi.
 

BeeKay

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639407F5-EDAF-408F-8C1F-785E1101CECE.jpeg
E50 being used here. Perfect match, nothing to complain.
 

JanesJr1

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I don't have your experience with high-end headphones so I cannot comment on those brands. I just did a quick comparison with the DSR9 (cannot level match, just "loud enough" by ear) and out of the box, with the ifi with no options enabled, there's no doubt that the DSR9 has better bass (without being overpowering, it's lean and controlled to me) compared to the Noire. I chose the DSR9 here because it's got a sound that's very similar to the planar magnetic sound and to the Noire. The difference is the bass and the spaciousness of the presentation, which is wider on the Noire (thus more pleasant).

I tried all the bass settings on the ifi (with Presence, no Presence, XSpace etc) and in the end just having XBass (alone or +Presence) improves the bass, the "Presence" and "XSpace" options add other colorations that I am relatively indifferent to.

But even so, the "slam" is not at the same level.

Strange, I don't think this is a problem of what you call "dynamics". The Noires seem plenty dynamic to me.

Another difference is that going very loud I think the Noires get distorted, the sound is a bit fuzzy. The DSR9 remain very clean, having their built-in amplification. It's probably the ifi at fault here, I imagine. Thankfully, I don't tend to listen at high volumes using headphones (I would like to retain some hearing ability) and at anything reasonable the Noires have no problem with the ifi.
I believe what you're saying, but just to be sure, were the Noire's well-powered? I ask because I have used 6 different power sources with the Noire's and the only sources where I heard any distortion or fuzziness at all were over-rated AudioQuest Dragonfly dongles that were not up to powering the low-impedance, low-sensitivity DCA phones. (I also don't apply any processing to improve bass or spaciousness except EQ, so I don't know how that affects the subjective bass sound.)
 

symphara

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I believe what you're saying, but just to be sure, were the Noire's well-powered? I ask because I have used 6 different power sources with the Noire's and the only sources where I heard any distortion or fuzziness at all were over-rated AudioQuest Dragonfly dongles that were not up to powering the low-impedance, low-sensitivity DCA phones. (I also don't apply any processing to improve bass or spaciousness except EQ, so I don't know how that affects the subjective bass sound.)
iFi Gryphon - some have told me it's enough, some that's not quite enough. I think the latter group is closer to the truth.
 

paudio

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DCA added more 100-150hz+ to the Stealth for slam.

The Noire have a lot more headroom to crank the bass because of their inherit low distortion. You sure it's not pushing the amp too far when you are getting the fuzzy bass?

I do find it odd that they sound so thin? Have you tested a different cable? Or a different pair. I'm curious about what it is.
 

majingotan

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Have you tested a different cable?

No passive cables can ever do this unless it’s truly broken or soldered so poorly that sound distorts when you wiggle it

PS. I’m very surprised of how wide our HTRFs differ. Noire and Aeon Open X NEVER sounded thin to my ears UnEQed. I even hear them as “warm neutral” with lots of thick subbass and slam
 

paudio

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No passive cables can ever do this unless it’s truly broken or soldered so poorly that sound distorts when you wiggle it

PS. I’m very surprised of how wide our HTRFs differ. Noire and Aeon Open X NEVER sounded thin to my ears UnEQed. I even hear them as “warm neutral” with lots of thick subbass and slam
Yes I have had cables with bad connections/damage and they sound thin and wrong. Considering the difference in how we think they sound (I definitely haven't had +10db at 20hz either with XBass on) I wondered if it was possible that the cable is bad.

I would check the cables resistance from end to end with multimeter and see what the resistance was.

A year is a long time though for trying out some headphones with a bad cable though Likely not.
 
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stephanadams

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It was OK, plenty loud for me, but I don't listen at high volume (any more). It's been over a year since I used the DX3 Pro+, so I can only provide some vague memory of it. I would not say it has abundant power for the Aeon 2 Noire, but it was sufficient.
 

wowo101

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Excellent thank you. I'll do some number crunching in that case as I can get them domestically as well. Final one from me! Would I be equally served with using SE to the E30 L30 ii stack or is the balanaced option generally better for the Noire? (i think i've phrased that right!)
Listening to the Noires (which arrived yesterday) on the E30 II/L30 II combo right now, and I just can't stop! In track after track, they reveal details I've never heard before, and while they might not have the most "slam" (whatever that is), bass goes very deep and is very clean.

The L30 II in high gain mode has no problem driving them to (for me) insane levels – listening to Bowie's "Aladdin Sane" at the moment, and anything past 11am on the volume knob is just too loud for me. Zero audible distortion, though, so there's always the temptation to go just a little higher…

I've bought mine as b-stock from Thomann (£770 instead of £890), free shipping to the UK and no customs duty. You'll be stuck with the baseline SE cable, though – which (see above) is not a problem when driving it with the L30 II.

Next up: going mobile with the G5 – fingers crossed…
 

LordOishi

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Listening to the Noires (which arrived yesterday) on the E30 II/L30 II combo right now, and I just can't stop! In track after track, they reveal details I've never heard before, and while they might not have the most "slam" (whatever that is), bass goes very deep and is very clean.

The L30 II in high gain mode has no problem driving them to (for me) insane levels – listening to Bowie's "Aladdin Sane" at the moment, and anything past 11am on the volume knob is just too loud for me. Zero audible distortion, though, so there's always the temptation to go just a little higher…

I've bought mine as b-stock from Thomann (£770 instead of £890), free shipping to the UK and no customs duty. You'll be stuck with the baseline SE cable, though – which (see above) is not a problem when driving it with the L30 II.

Next up: going mobile with the G5 – fingers crossed…
Sounds very promising! Glad you've landed on your feet.

I actually tried the A2N at the nearest HP shop (still a 45 minute drive I wish there were more of these shops around Greater London) and something didn't click with me. I also tried the celestee and the LCD XC. They didn't have the radiance in unfortunately. The celestee grabbed my attention more and LCD XC really got me going but that weight isn't sustainable for me.

I was with my 4 yo son which didn't help obviously for concentration but I wanted a bit more of the 'slam' I think!

What I took away is I do want to go further in terms of the bass and much I want to feel it. I'm mainly EDM / House and Heavy Metal so I'm turning attention to the Denon 9200 and possibly a fostex. I've also looked at the 177x.

I really don't want to rule out the A2N though so I will go again and give it another listen, without my son though!

Do you listen to any of that type of music per chance and did you have a different experience?
Enjoy!
 

wowo101

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Sounds very promising! Glad you've landed on your feet.

I actually tried the A2N at the nearest HP shop (still a 45 minute drive I wish there were more of these shops around Greater London) and something didn't click with me. I also tried the celestee and the LCD XC. They didn't have the radiance in unfortunately. The celestee grabbed my attention more and LCD XC really got me going but that weight isn't sustainable for me.

I was with my 4 yo son which didn't help obviously for concentration but I wanted a bit more of the 'slam' I think!

What I took away is I do want to go further in terms of the bass and much I want to feel it. I'm mainly EDM / House and Heavy Metal so I'm turning attention to the Denon 9200 and possibly a fostex. I've also looked at the 177x.

I really don't want to rule out the A2N though so I will go again and give it another listen, without my son though!

Do you listen to any of that type of music per chance and did you have a different experience?
Enjoy!
Listening to "Along the Canal" by Tangerine Dream right now, which is the kind of EDM I'm listening to regularly, and it's super enjoyable – deep bass, enough impact to have my head bobbing, lots of clearly articulated structure. But it's EDM with a strong focus on exactly that: structure. (Other examples would be Nils Frahm and Neil Cowley, both rather brainy and very close to "serious" avantgarde music.) I tend to be a rather analytical listener in general, so the Noires are probably a particularly good fit for me.

Apart from the question of having enough power to make them shine, @Dan Clark points out that DCA headphones' lack of distortion might be perceived as a lack of attack by some. And in general I would be careful to not fall for the showroom effect – an accentuation of certain frequency ranges that suggests more detail or "slam", but in the long run is just that: an unrealistic coloration.

But of course YMMV, and the types of music you mention might call for more macrodynamics than the Noires have to offer.
 

LordOishi

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Listening to "Along the Canal" by Tangerine Dream right now, which is the kind of EDM I'm listening to regularly, and it's super enjoyable – deep bass, enough impact to have my head bobbing, lots of clearly articulated structure. But it's EDM with a strong focus on exactly that: structure. (Other examples would be Nils Frahm and Neil Cowley, both rather brainy and very close to "serious" avantgarde music.) I tend to be a rather analytical listener in general, so the Noires are probably a particularly good fit for me.

Apart from the question of having enough power to make them shine, @Dan Clark points out that DCA headphones' lack of distortion might be perceived as a lack of attack by some. And in general I would be careful to not fall for the showroom effect – an accentuation of certain frequency ranges that suggests more detail or "slam", but in the long run is just that: an unrealistic coloration.

But of course YMMV, and the types of music you mention might call for more macrodynamics than the Noires have to offer.
I'm going to give them one last try this weekend. Cosmetically and fit wise they're perfect for me. I listened via the RME previously so may ask to listen via a different driver.

BTW I just listened to "Along the Canal". I'd not heard of Tangerine Dream before but I'll be listening to them more now!
 

paudio

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DCA added a bump around 100hz on the Stealth for more slam if I remember correctly. Would a slower DAC filter add decay?
 

wowo101

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DCA added a bump around 100hz on the Stealth for more slam if I remember correctly. Would a slower DAC filter add decay?
The same bump is there on the Noire, but I think it’s less for slam and more for body. Don’t know about the filter, but from my limited understanding of digital signal processing I’d be rather sceptical about that…
 

vilnis

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Hello. I haven't learned English, Google translator helps me, don't judge too much. Then to the question - At my minimum level of knowledge, I understand that Fiio Btr7 balanced (3.4V max gain 5.5V 320mW@32 Ohm) DCA Aeon2 will drive loud enough, but the sound will be without dynamics, Not a good pair?. Correct my conclusions if I am wrong. Have a nice day! PS 350 mW power is controversial, Amirm measured 215 mW
 
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