DAC Upgrade for streaming from notebook

[Birdy]

I am using a Hifime UAE23HD USB DAC (ES9018K2M+SA9023) for 4+ years and in general i am satisfied with the sound but like many, i always keep an eye on improving my sound without breaking the bank. This usb DAC was $69. I use it only for streaming music from my notebook, mainly Tidal and some 88 and 96 KHz flac files with AIMP music player. Is there a simple DAC out there for about $ 150 that could be a step up over what i have?

Features​

• ESS Sabre ES9018k2m DAC chip and SABRE9601 headphone and line out driver, Savitech SA9023 USB receiver chip
• Works and sound great with most headphone (including low impedance IEM and high impedance headphones) and all line-level devices (preamps, amplifiers)
• Accepts 32kHz, 44.1kHz, 48kHz, 88.2kHz and 96kHz input files @16 and 24 bit.
• Volume controlled by computer vol +/- keys
• Ultra-low noise regulator LP5907 with added noise-reducing aluminum solid capacitors (NCC PSF series)
• Patented Time Domain Jitter Eliminator (by ESS Technologies)
• Optical output
• No drivers required! Optional Windows ASIO drivers available

Performance​

• 122dB SNR
• 110dB THD+N: 2V rms @ 600 ohm load
• 100dB THD+N: 30mW @ 32 ohm load
• No DC blocking capacitors on the output
• Power usage: 40-80 mA depending on sample rate and volume
• Dimensions:5.5 x 3.5 x 1.8 cm (without cable)
• Weight 30g

 

[MacCali]

I am using a Hifime UAE23HD USB DAC (ES9018K2M+SA9023) for 4+ years and in general i am satisfied with the sound but like many, i always keep an eye on improving my sound without breaking the bank. This usb DAC was $69. I use it only for streaming music from my notebook, mainly Tidal and some 88 and 96 KHz flac files with AIMP music player. Is there a simple DAC out there for about $ 150 that could be a step up over what i have?

Features​

• ESS Sabre ES9018k2m DAC chip and SABRE9601 headphone and line out driver, Savitech SA9023 USB receiver chip
• Works and sound great with most headphone (including low impedance IEM and high impedance headphones) and all line-level devices (preamps, amplifiers)
• Accepts 32kHz, 44.1kHz, 48kHz, 88.2kHz and 96kHz input files @16 and 24 bit.
• Volume controlled by computer vol +/- keys
• Ultra-low noise regulator LP5907 with added noise-reducing aluminum solid capacitors (NCC PSF series)
• Patented Time Domain Jitter Eliminator (by ESS Technologies)
• Optical output
• No drivers required! Optional Windows ASIO drivers available

Performance​

• 122dB SNR
• 110dB THD+N: 2V rms @ 600 ohm load
• 100dB THD+N: 30mW @ 32 ohm load
• No DC blocking capacitors on the output
• Power usage: 40-80 mA depending on sample rate and volume
• Dimensions:5.5 x 3.5 x 1.8 cm (without cable)
• Weight 30g

View attachment 258915

By notebook you mean laptop?

I would purchase SMSL PO100 regular or pro and a 100 dollar dac if you’re using a laptop computer.

Most people on here would say it’s probably not worth it with a 100 dollar dac but you must consider the pc is putting in a lot of bs

Same price and will future proof if you ever get something new.

Check out the review index and you can definitely find something. The new schiit dac and this would be good ~180 with tax

 

[Birdy]

By notebook you mean laptop?

I would purchase SMSL PO100 regular or pro and a 100 dollar dac if you’re using a laptop computer.

Most people on here would say it’s probably not worth it with a 100 dollar dac but you must consider the pc is putting in a lot of bs

Same price and will future proof if you ever get something new.

Check out the review index and you can definitely find something. The new schiit dac and this would be good ~180 with tax

Yes, by laptop. I have no noise issues with my DAC via USB. It is more that if possible, i would like a better separation and deeper sound stage of voices, instruments, without loosing the "warm" sound i have now with my UAE23HD USB DAC. The problem is that i can't hear them before buying, so the result is uncertain.

 

[HarmonicTHD]

Yes, by laptop. I have no noise issues with my DAC via USB. It is more that if possible, i would like a better separation and deeper sound stage of voices, instruments, without loosing the "warm" sound i have now with my UAE23HD USB DAC. The problem is that i can't hear them before buying, so the result is uncertain.

Soundstage and separation is not something which nowadays is influenced by well engineered DACs and neither is warmth as modern DACs are very linear. So keep what you have and enjoy (and resist the upgraditis).
Many storytellers out there which claim the opposite mainly driven by commercial interests and mainly without substantiated facts.

 

[Birdy]

Soundstage and separation is not something which nowadays is influenced by well engineered DACs and neither is warmth as modern DACs are very linear. So keep what you have and enjoy (and resist the upgraditis).
Many storytellers out there which claim the opposite mainly driven by commercial interests and mainly without substantiated facts.

Good advise, thanks! I was already preoccupied if it would be better. The "upgraditis" is sometimes hard to resist ;-) I made some upgrades in my Aiyima 07 and Tube 3 amp which gave me the "warmth" (or pleasant distortion) i was missing and upgrade some capacitors and resistors in my cross over which made a subtil difference. Will stay with my DAC.

 

[MacCali]

Yes, by laptop. I have no noise issues with my DAC via USB. It is more that if possible, i would like a better separation and deeper sound stage of voices, instruments, without loosing the "warm" sound i have now with my UAE23HD USB DAC. The problem is that i can't hear them before buying, so the result is uncertain.

Again most computers are very noisy and you would never know how much noise it has until you eliminate it.

If you don’t want to buy a new dac that’s fine, but would still suggest you get that digital to digital converter. At 70 dollars it’s not breaking the bank

 

[Birdy]

Again most computers are very noisy and you would never know how much noise it has until you eliminate it.

If you don’t want to buy a new dac that’s fine, but would still suggest you get that digital to digital converter. At 70 dollars it’s not breaking the bank

I am using a acer norebook and even with my ear against my tweeter (planar) i do not hear any noise. My ears are not that great (max. 10 KHz) so what would the diference be with a extra noise filter?

 

[MacCali]

I am using a acer norebook and even with my ear against my tweeter (planar) i do not hear any noise. My ears are not that great (max. 10 KHz) so what would the diference be with a extra noise filter?

it's more to it than that man. A laptop is not a good source, along with a PC. Your sound will definitely improve with this upgrade.

the computer isn't adding distortion for you to hear it through your tweeter. Many pc's including mine have optical out, optical is immune to all those things. Yet it is causing degradation to the sound even when those things are canceled it's suggested never to use a PC's optical out for audio

 

[AnalogSteph]

I made some upgrades in my Aiyima 07 and Tube 3 amp which gave me the "warmth" (or pleasant distortion) i was missing and upgrade some capacitors and resistors in my cross over which made a subtil difference. Will stay with my DAC.

That's probably for the best. If the UAE23HD is anywhere near its specs, it should be the least of your worries. If there's any weak point, it's probably the 3.5 mm jack... not the most mechanically rugged affair ever.

I would "un-flavor" the setup by running the UAE23HD directly into the A07 and get a measurement mic (and if it's just a UMIK-1). There is plenty you can do with freely available software like REW + Equalizer APO + PEACE. Way more powerful than fussing around with electronics.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

it's more to it than that man. A laptop is not a good source, along with a PC. Your sound will definitely improve with this upgrade.

the computer isn't adding distortion for you to hear it through your tweeter. Many pc's including mine have optical out, optical is immune to all those things. Yet it is causing degradation to the sound even when those things are canceled it's suggested never to use a PC's optical out for audio

I'm pretty confident that you're wrong, but not 100% (ignoring usb noise sensitive DACs like the Schiit Modi 2).

 

[Birdy]

That's probably for the best. If the UAE23HD is anywhere near its specs, it should be the least of your worries. If there's any weak point, it's probably the 3.5 mm jack... not the most mechanically rugged affair ever.

I would "un-flavor" the setup by running the UAE23HD directly into the A07 and get a measurement mic (and if it's just a UMIK-1). There is plenty you can do with freely available software like REW + Equalizer APO + PEACE. Way more powerful than fussing around with electronics.

I will upgrade the 3.5 mm jack for a better quality, thanks. I made some measurements with REM for adjusting the cross over. I used a simple sony condensator microphone (2 meters form the speakers), that probably explaines the drop of at 10 KHz and under 100 Hz for a part. The bass drop of is as the data sheet, more or less. I do not know how to read the distortion levels? I tried several times "unflavored"(without the tube buffer) it sounds good but less "engaging", little more in the face and less fine for long listening. With the op amp change i am close to a mixture of tube / transitor sound. Nice blend!

 

[Jimbob54]

I am using a acer norebook and even with my ear against my tweeter (planar) i do not hear any noise. My ears are not that great (max. 10 KHz) so what would the diference be with a extra noise filter?

You are right to be sceptical. A well designed DAC should filter all the crap out- rendering such as this moot- see this recent review but there are many more https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/ifi-ipurifier3-usb-filter-review.41389/

What I cant tell you is if the particular DAC you have is good at that filtering it out. But even if not, just get a better DAC for $100 rather than $80 on a DD converter into existing one.

 

[Birdy]

You are right to be sceptical. A well designed DAC should filter all the crap out- rendering such as this moot- see this recent review but there are many more https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/ifi-ipurifier3-usb-filter-review.41389/

What I cant tell you is if the particular DAC you have is good at that filtering it out. But even if not, just get a better DAC for $100 rather than $80 on a DD converter into existing one.

My DAC is dead silent, even with high volume, probably the Ultra-low noise regulator LP5907 does it's work well ;-) thanks

 

[MacCali]

I'm pretty confident that you're wrong, but not 100% (ignoring usb noise sensitive DACs like the Schiit Modi 2).

Yea it’s easy to be skeptical. But before ever seeing this video I bought a schiit eitr and it definitely improved my pc sound.

You can ask anyone here and for fact it’s never good to use the optical out from your motherboard of a pc. If it’s a barebones pc that’s different, people DIY audio computers as a roon core and streamer. But that pc is virtually empty and relies on cpu on board graphics. The gpu and other processes internally are creating degradation

According to golden sound and few other people providing the info that the Pi2AES is a killer streamer and steal which out performs anything under 1k or higher in some cases I purchased it.

Basically paid 250 and had to DIY it, nothing major. It’s the best improvement to my system thus far. Again it too is a barebones PC, pi based.

I just bought the PO100 pro and honest it has made improvements to my pc even when streaming from YouTube. By improvements I mean it’s far closer to my streamer than the PC alone or no ddc.

Again I’m not asking op to go out and spend 100’s of dollars for something which maybe imaginary but 70 dollars is nothing in the audio world.

As mentioned just a 30 dollar pi streamer will be an improvement. But clearly op wants to use his laptop as a source which is why I suggest this

 

[MacCali]

You are right to be sceptical. A well designed DAC should filter all the crap out- rendering such as this moot- see this recent review but there are many more https://www.audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/ifi-ipurifier3-usb-filter-review.41389/

What I cant tell you is if the particular DAC you have is good at that filtering it out. But even if not, just get a better DAC for $100 rather than $80 on a DD converter into existing one.

The ac power isn’t such a factor. Amir has a better review with the power supply which can produce clean or even more dirty AC. As shown and proven that even when you crank that thing up to extreme dirty power the unit itself is filtering.

However with a PC we are no longer using AC. The power supply is clearly using DC and the noise itself I am unsure is a byproduct of DC or simply just electronic processes going on. The graphics processing unit is definitely riddled with noise. Along with all the processes running and basically will jump via crosstalk to all the circuits.

My motherboard msrp’s for 600+ usd. The entire audio section is actually isolated from the main pcb to create less interaction and actually runs, I believe, duel ess’s chips for its on board dac. So the audio section was not really neglected and it sounds like crap vs a 100 dollar stand alone dac.

So I can only imagine what op and other people have. I never bought this board for audio only overclocking performance and actually I wasn’t even into audio when I built this pc

 

[MacCali]

Amir’s ifi purifi 3 review just posted @Birdy @Elitzur–Vaidman

“There was a ton of noise in the FFT spectrum with the noise floor jumping up and down every few seconds (no doubt due to activities in my PC). That in turn caused the SINAD to vary continuously between 84 and 91 dB. This variation is system specific and could be worse (or better) on other host computers.”

I’m not an audio expert, and still new to audio. I usually regurgitate what I am taught and stand by with my experience when incorporating the idea into my system and getting audible results, perceived or placebo I mention since anything is possible.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

Amir’s ifi purifi 3 review just posted @Birdy @Elitzur–Vaidman

“There was a ton of noise in the FFT spectrum with the noise floor jumping up and down every few seconds (no doubt due to activities in my PC). That in turn caused the SINAD to vary continuously between 84 and 91 dB. This variation is system specific and could be worse (or better) on other host computers.”

I’m not an audio expert, and still new to audio. I usually regurgitate what I am taught and stand by with my experience when incorporating the idea into my system and getting audible results, perceived or placebo I mention since anything is possible.

That's why I referenced the Schiit Modi 2 as a usb noise sensitive DAC.

 

[Birdy]

Amir’s ifi purifi 3 review just posted @Birdy @Elitzur–Vaidman

“There was a ton of noise in the FFT spectrum with the noise floor jumping up and down every few seconds (no doubt due to activities in my PC). That in turn caused the SINAD to vary continuously between 84 and 91 dB. This variation is system specific and could be worse (or better) on other host computers.”

I’m not an audio expert, and still new to audio. I usually regurgitate what I am taught and stand by with my experience when incorporating the idea into my system and getting audible results, perceived or placebo I mention since anything is possible.

"This variation is system specific and could be worse (or better) on other host computers.” I can imagem that a PC's where not much shielding is taking place induces a lot of HF noise, for sure with a in build sound card. I use a simpel notebook with a usb dongle DAC and do not hear anything.

 

[Elitzur–Vaidman]

I use a simpel notebook with a usb dongle DAC and do not hear anything.

When it comes down to it, that's what really matters. Honestly, if your laptop has a spare USB C port, you can just get a 9$ apple dongle.

 

[MacCali]

When it comes down to it, that's what really matters. Honestly, if your laptop has a spare USB C port, you can just get a 9$ apple dongle.

Does usb C make a difference? The PO100 is usb C based but currently using A to C, it comes with C to C as well

I didn’t notice he used a modi. But honestly still feel it’s an overall valid statement