DAC, DAC ..goose!

[w00ds153]

In what way? Do you have measurements to back it up? I'm sure that the CD player is "good enough" but better than the D10?

This can kind of be tied into what I said/asked a few message above - The pioneer CD player (it's really a universal player) I'm using is highly sought after and has quite the following or at least did. I think it retailed for $1,499.00 when new in early 2000's, but is that even relative to a inexpensive DAC today with advances in the tech? I guess it all comes down to testing, which is why I like this place, but generally speaking ..to be able to sleep at night, can we be safe just using the most modern DAC in our system?

 

[jsrtheta]

So true! Blindness first affects the eyes. Either way it's same line of amps. only differ in power output.

Not quite. The AS701 has the "CD Direct" feature in addition to "Pure Direct". The AS301 and the AS501 have only the "Pure Direct".

 

[jsrtheta]

In what way? Do you have measurements to back it up? I'm sure that the CD player is "good enough" but better than the D10?

I thought he has a D30.

 

[jasonq997]

This can kind of be tied into what I said/asked a few message above - The pioneer CD player (it's really a universal player) I'm using is highly sought after and has quite the following or at least did. I think it retailed for $1,499.00 when new in early 2000's, but is that even relative to a inexpensive DAC today with advances in the tech? I guess it all comes down to testing, which is why I like this place, but generally speaking ..to be able to sleep at night, can we be safe just using the most modern DAC in our system?

Yes.

 

[jsrtheta]

This can kind of be tied into what I said/asked a few message above - The pioneer CD player (it's really a universal player) I'm using is highly sought after and has quite the following or at least did. I think it retailed for $1,499.00 when new in early 2000's, but is that even relative to a inexpensive DAC today with advances in the tech? I guess it all comes down to testing, which is why I like this place, but generally speaking ..to be able to sleep at night, can we be safe just using the most modern DAC in our system?

Not to be too cranky, but it would help if you included the model numbers of components when discussing them. I have no idea which Pioneer you're talking about. (I can see the picture, but I can't decipher any model number.)

As it is, you now have three "DACs": The one in the Pioneer, the one in the Yamaha, and the Topping. Oh, and another one in that Denon Whatever-It-Is.

 

[w00ds153]

Not to be too cranky, but it would help if you included the model numbers of components when discussing them. I have no idea which Pioneer you're talking about. (I can see the picture, but I can't decipher any model number.)

As it is, you now have three "DACs": The one in the Pioneer, the one in the Yamaha, and the Topping. Oh, and another one in that Denon Whatever-It-Is.

I was kind of speaking in general terms, but ..pioneer dv-79avi , denon dvd-2900 , Yamaha a-s501. One ..two ..yup, three DACs I have. I'm gonna put that in my Tinder profile to get more girls. Thanks for pointing that out!

 

[ishmeister]

In what way? Do you have measurements to back it up? I'm sure that the CD player is "good enough" but better than the D10?

Ken Rockwell measured a Sony CDP-X303ES.

 

[M00ndancer]

I thought he has a D30.

You're correct, doesn't really change things.

 

[jsrtheta]

I was kind of speaking in general terms, but ..pioneer dv-79avi , denon dvd-2900 , Yamaha a-s501. One ..two ..yup, three DACs I have. I'm gonna put that in my Tinder profile to get more girls. Thanks for pointing that out!

Don't forget the Topping.

 

[VintageFlanker]

This can kind of be tied into what I said/asked a few message above - The pioneer CD player (it's really a universal player) I'm using is highly sought after and has quite the following or at least did. I think it retailed for $1,499.00 when new in early 2000's, but is that even relative to a inexpensive DAC today with advances in the tech? I guess it all comes down to testing, which is why I like this place, but generally speaking ..to be able to sleep at night, can we be safe just using the most modern DAC in our system?

I don't have any "proof" measurements-wise, but your D30 should perform better than older digital designs from late 90's or early 2000's (whatever their original prices). I don't have a clue if it is audible or not.

 

[M00ndancer]

This can kind of be tied into what I said/asked a few message above - The pioneer CD player (it's really a universal player) I'm using is highly sought after and has quite the following or at least did. I think it retailed for $1,499.00 when new in early 2000's, but is that even relative to a inexpensive DAC today with advances in the tech? I guess it all comes down to testing, which is why I like this place, but generally speaking ..to be able to sleep at night, can we be safe just using the most modern DAC in our system?

You have to remember that price have little to do with the performance. On the other hand, is the better performance audible? Hard to say, that depends on the other components in your system. As VintageFlanker states above, the D30 is a high performance DAC. I wouldn't worry about it at all. Use the most convenient DAC.

 

[sonci]

Probably not correct from a purely technical point of view, but I doubt anyone can hear a difference.

Why? I had that dac and probably that sacd player, and there are not even close..
From the technical point is much easier to build a cd player with dac and the clock on the transport, than an outside dac that have to follow the transport clock.
In fact that vintage Sony cd player measure better than the Benchmark Dac2, in the Ken Rockwell site,

 

[jasonq997]

Why? I had that dac and probably that sacd player, and there are not even close..
From the technical point is much easier to build a cd player with dac and the clock on the transport, than an outside dac that have to follow the transport clock.
In fact that vintage Sony cd player measure better than the Benchmark Dac2, in the Ken Rockwell site,

Not even close? It is likely to be so close that you wouldn't be able to distinguish the two DACs in a blind test. It also likely that the newer tech in the D30 is measurably superior.

 

[sonci]

Not even close? It is likely to be so close that you wouldn't be able to distinguish the two DACs in a blind test. It also likely that the newer tech in the D30 is measurably superior.

What new tech? It has an ancient Dac, and fake capacitors..
and believe me it sounds like shcitt..

 

[w00ds153]

Just a thought - so what makes a $10,000 audiophile CD player better (in terms of things you can measure) than playing Spotify out of your xbox via optical into a $100 DAC? If you can't distinguish the sound of different DACs by ear then what are you actually paying for? I'm sure build quality is better, maybe more user options for tweaking, better power supply for cleaner power and things of that sort? ..but what else? Is there a real 'Ohhh, I get it now, that's why it costs $10,000 ..totally makes sense!' factor?

 

[jasonq997]

What new tech? It has an ancient Dac, and fake capacitors..
and believe me it sounds like shcitt..

Fake capacitors? I have one, and I can assure you that it sounds very good. As good as any other competently designed DAC. Audiophile superstitions are unhealthy both for one's mind and one's wallet.

 

[JJB70]

Just a thought - so what makes a $10,000 audiophile CD player better (in terms of things you can measure) than playing Spotify out of your xbox via optical into a $100 DAC? If you can't distinguish the sound of different DACs by ear then what are you actually paying for? I'm sure build quality is better, maybe more user options for tweaking, better power supply for cleaner power and things of that sort? ..but what else? Is there a real 'Ohhh, I get it now, that's why it costs $10,000 ..totally makes sense!' factor?

Trying to find a rational reason for the cost of high end hifi is like tying to find a rational reason for the cost of fashion, cosmetics, expensive watches etc. Price has nothing to do with cost of manufacture nor performance in many cases. I've seen expensive hifi that was very shoddily made with poor fit ad finish, components that were hardly top drawer and rather mediocre internal layout and construction. Measurement indicates that you're not paying for great measured performance in many cases. You're generally paying for expensive case work, design and buying into a brand image. A few years ago Mark Levinson bought in amplifiers from China which cost $200, put his Red Rose name on them and charged $2000 a pop. Needless to say they got glowing magazine reviews and sold well, and when the truth came out it was a case of shoot the messenger. Any competently designed DAC will be audibly transparent and DACs attained technical maturity probably 25 years ago or more.

 

[M00ndancer]

Just a thought - so what makes a $10,000 audiophile CD player better (in terms of things you can measure) than playing Spotify out of your xbox via optical into a $100 DAC? If you can't distinguish the sound of different DACs by ear then what are you actually paying for? I'm sure build quality is better, maybe more user options for tweaking, better power supply for cleaner power and things of that sort? ..but what else? Is there a real 'Ohhh, I get it now, that's why it costs $10,000 ..totally makes sense!' factor?

This is a good example: Streaming Google Music.
Old system: Chromecast Audio connected directly to headphone
New system: Swissonic HAD-1 with the CCA as a transport only using optical in on the HAD-1
Sonic difference, can't tell
Though, the HAD-1 have lot better features. USB sound from computer, optical in/out, RCA Line in with 0/-6/-12dB gain, a RCA pre-out, headphone amp and a volume knob! (And it uses ICs that's 7-8 years old)

 

[w00ds153]

Are there any benefits in using USB vs. 3.5mm stereo jack output on a laptop?? I guess USB is digital and 3.5mm stereo jack would be analog ..is that correct?

 

[VintageFlanker]

Are there any benefits in using USB vs. 3.5mm stereo jack output on a laptop?? I guess USB is digital and 3.5mm stereo jack would be analog ..is that correct?

Correct. USB (digital) will be converted by the external DAC while jack output (analog) will use the (usually not great) internal DAC of the laptop.