D5PRO BC - inspired from Dartzeel NHB-108 - endgame amp or?

[Iluzun]

I’ve got one ‘clone’ and another coming. An Accuphase A60 that prior to tariffs cost <$500 b4 shipping. It’s my new favorite amp and I think has found its
permanent home driving a pair of Castle Conway III’s. They make beautiful music together paired with a couple Rel T9i’s. Better and more long lasting satisfaction
than matched w/Elac floorstanders, or Zu’s DWIIs, or several pair of small monitors. For me, it’s a great amp and bargain. First 20wpc class A, 200wpc after.
The ‘clone’ has a high enough input impedance to match up with a Muzishare R90 tube pre purchased because of its MM/MC tube phono stage. (Try finding
a nice pre/w/phono & tube rectification for a reasonable cost). Everything’s worked out so well I’ve went ahead and ordered the Goldmund Telos 600 ‘clone’.
Years ago I heard a ‘real’ Goldmund driving the big Tannoys and the ‘sound stuck w/me’, so we’ll see. I’ll simply note that after close to 30yrs in the ‘hobby’, I’ve
more than paid for my education, it’s all good, but subjectively (that word…(-; ) the ‘clones’ represent exceptional value. The Telos also has a high enough input
impedance that I could run it off the tube preamp or try it out w/a Denafrips Athena I have downstairs. In the futur I’d like to try the ‘Dart’ or perhaps the Burmeister
monster. Most digital amps I’ve tried seem ‘soulless’, with the exception of the little Technics GX70 I own w/the GaN, LAPC, & speaker room measurements &
eArc is a sweet little unit, having the best ‘over the net’ radio tuner I’ve ever heard, nice phono stage also, but most here may not care, but boy is it a nice little amp.
As always, horses 4 courses…

 

[Johannesen]

I picked up a BRZHifi A1s from Amazon and I’m listening to it right now. I am tempted to have one sent to Amir for measurements.

No doubt it would measure horribly, but it’s been an extremely fun and enjoyable amp so far.

I also own the integrated amp that this amp is supposedly based on - the idiosyncratic musical fidelity a1.

I see Elberoth posted some measurements of a restored A1 back in 2018 and it was far from perfect…

I have a purifi 1ET400A based amp and this sounds wildly different. Call the BRZHifi colored / euphonic - but the A1s does sound similar to the MF A1 it’s based on, if this amp is wrong, I don’t want it to be right.

​

 

[Whitestix]

My DarTzell clone amp has been in my system for a few months and it is by far the best ss amp I have ever owned, including my Wells Audio Innamorata ss amp and my Don Sachs KT88 amp. Hands down, the finest. It has more protection than the original DarTzell amp upon which it was cloned which now is off-patent. Very rarely a "deal" seems to be good to be true turns out to be such, but it certainly is wrt to excellence of this amp. In over 50 years of having myriad amps, this clone amp has no peers in my experience. It truly offers a clear window into the essence of music.

 

[Todd k]

somebody send one in please. I know I would find the results interesting.

 

[Richard G]

My DarTzell clone amp has been in my system for a few months and it is by far the best ss amp I have ever owned, including my Wells Audio Innamorata ss amp and my Don Sachs KT88 amp. Hands down, the finest. It has more protection than the original DarTzell amp upon which it was cloned which now is off-patent. Very rarely a "deal" seems to be good to be true turns out to be such, but it certainly is wrt to excellence of this amp. In over 50 years of having myriad amps, this clone amp has no peers in my experience. It truly offers a clear window into the essence of music.

Which model did you get, from which vendor?

 

[mhardy6647]

it is by far the best ss amp I have ever owned, including my Wells Audio Innamorata ss amp and my Don Sachs KT88 amp.

[emphasis added]
Ummm...?

 

[Soundscape]

Should anyone in Australia be interested, I have the Cary SLP-90 and Dartzeel clones, as recommended by HiFiZone for sale. Message me for details.

 

[fmdelight]

Guys, wait until you get the T9.4 Burmester monster clone at 36 kgs. It outperforms the D5PRO BC, I have both of them now. T9.4 takes only 130 watts from the grid at normal listening level and it doesn't get as hot as the D5PRO BC.

The sound is more powerful and superior in clarity.

It cost me 1100 euro with everything included (SE of Europe) about 3 months ago.

For 2 x 225 watt into 8 ohm, XLR connections, THD 0,000525%, and a SNR/dynamic range of 120,6, I say it is a pretty good deal!

Interesting to see how these Chifi gets more traction ...

 

[wushuliu]

Just so people understand:

1. The original Dartzeel design was discussed openly by its designer in Stereophile several decades ago in multiple articles.
2. It's been discussed at length including schematics over at diyaudio for some 10+ years w/ numerous builds and even mild praise for the Chinese versions.
3. Measurements were done by a German Youtuber last year. Just search 'Das Ist Ein Hammer'. He found his amp to perform exactly as specified. And no he is not a shill, he is a diy'er. YMMV.

These 'clone' amps are hardly money-raking enterprises. The people making them would certainly be better off selling and getting plenty of free exposure from yet another perfect measuring dac based off a datasheet than a 30-80lb amplifier w/ 800VA toroids. There are people in China who are audio fanatics, too and some of them show their appreciation by 'copying' (really taking inspiration from or heavily modifying) known designs with expired patents. The biggest issue isn't the 'cloning' it's the quality control from the factories and the low odds of being able to return the item if something goes wrong. That's where the 'there's no free lunch' kicks in.

 

[fmdelight]

That's true.

However, my D5PRO BC has already been operating for many hundreds of hours flawlessly.

I make sure it's got good ventilation and doesn't go over 50-55 Celsius, and I believe it will continue to work for many years to come. It is enough to take a look inside the machine and realize that the people building it mean business.

I have Chinese made power solar inverters that look way less impressive on the inside and they have been in operation for 10 years now, and I never had to fix them, and they operate at much higher power, between 1 and 5 kw, and we are talking about old technology here, from maybe 15 years ago (some of these power inverters were second hand).

So I am quite confident these pre-amps and amps will serve a long time.

At this price point and sound quality, getting one is a no-brainer in my opinion

 

[Richard G]

Just so people understand:

1. The original Dartzeel design was discussed openly by its designer in Stereophile several decades ago in multiple articles.
2. It's been discussed at length including schematics over at diyaudio for some 10+ years w/ numerous builds and even mild praise for the Chinese versions.
3. Measurements were done by a German Youtuber last year. Just search 'Das Ist Ein Hammer'. He found his amp to perform exactly as specified. And no he is not a shill, he is a diy'er. YMMV.

These 'clone' amps are hardly money-raking enterprises. The people making them would certainly be better off selling and getting plenty of free exposure from yet another perfect measuring dac based off a datasheet than a 30-80lb amplifier w/ 800VA toroids. There are people in China who are audio fanatics, too and some of them show their appreciation by 'copying' (really taking inspiration from or heavily modifying) known designs with expired patents. The biggest issue isn't the 'cloning' it's the quality control from the factories and the low odds of being able to return the item if something goes wrong. That's where the 'there's no free lunch' kicks in.

Ime that’s the most informed, objective summary of Chinese clones of upmarket amps I’ve ever come across

 

[Mordor]

Someone live in other galaxy....

My Pioneer A656 Mk II from final 90`s, doesnt sound the same as my new Fosi V3....

In fact, it sounds s*****, compare to Fosi.

Not even gonna talk about a D5 Pro, a Luxman ou something more exotic................

 

[mhardy6647]

No. All electronics sound the same.

'How can DAC's have a SOUND SIGNATURE if they measure as transparent?'

Oct 4, 2019

I know there are people out there that think cables affect sound, which is much worse, but there really is no response to something like that, but just to smile and nod. But what about people who talk about DACS as if they were headphone drivers or speakers, and talk about the SOUNDSTAGE, IMAGING, and MIDRANGE of a DAC? I actually don't know what to say to people to not be rude. If you try explaining that a DAC isn't something that actually changes the sound, they accuse you of having "a hard-on for measurements", as if it were the measurements themselves that tell you that DACs don't...

• Willhelm_Scream
• Replies: 10,921
• Forum: DACs, Streamers, Servers, Players, Audio Interface

• 

Indeed.

Power supplies, for example. Virtually all sound the same -- although some do hum, and some even buzz.
Computers, too, other than that fan/no fan thing.
Most digital multimeters are indistinguishable in properly controlled double-blind listening tests.

 

[RickS]

Trolling posts and responses have been culled from this thread. The main offender has been thread banned.

Unless OP objects, closing thread as appears to have met his need.