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Curious about this forum regarding my cable journey

dwcda said:
, it's just difficult to switch back and forth quickly enough to retain one sound to compare with another.
Click to expand...
Test in mono using your 2 speakers side by side, different cable on each and use A/B speaker switch or pan pot. If you cant hear a difference you won't in stereo. (First try with the same cable to make sure your speakers match enough).
And Im in the "you won't hear a difference club" but the above is a way to prove it to yourself.
Power cords are a total scam.
 
dwcda said:
I'm new here, just registered today although I've read it for awhile. I have a new system and was considering the cables that I owned so where better to get advice than a forum that supports the idea that cables make a difference.

So I commented on the issues with ABX testing...

forum.audiogon.com

Audiogon Discussion Forum

I’ve followed many of the cable discussions over the years with interest. I’ve never tested cables & compared the sound other than when I bought an ...
forum.audiogon.com forum.audiogon.com

And then my experience with AQ Dragon power cords...

forum.audiogon.com

Audiogon Discussion Forum

I was talking to my dealer about how good the system sounds that he sold me. I mentioned that I had tried some new speaker/interconnect cables from a lo...
forum.audiogon.com forum.audiogon.com

It was quite a journey and I realize that there is no room for me in that cult. But while I appreciate the scientific approach here I have heard some variations with cables that leads me to believe that they can sound differently, it's just difficult to switch back and forth quickly enough to retain one sound to compare with another. Plus, the differences are very slight while the cost can be huge. So I'm not sure that these beliefs fit in here as well.

For those who say "is there a question there?", not really, just hoping to get some discussion and learn from a different pov.
Click to expand...
Long ago a friend and I compared cheap RCA cables to some that were quite a bit more expensive (I don't remember the brands). We didn't hear a difference.

Another friend and I compared cheap, supposedly oxygen free, 12 AWG speaker wire to expensive high end speaker wire (Litz if I remember correctly, but it was over 35 years ago and my memory may not be completely accurate). Again, we did not hear a difference.
 
My perspective:
1. do cables matter? definitely!
2. are the differences audible? probably not!
3. My conclusion: buy quality brands like Mogami, Belden, Canare, etc. no need to buy exotic stuff.
4. As for power cords, getting shielded PC is worth it… though a tad expensive.
 
There are things that are measurably different, yet the difference is exceedingly difficult to hear. You can add a surprising amount of 2nd order harmonic distortion, or compare a high bitrate MP3 to WAV, or even the best DAC vs. the worst DAC in Amir's rankings. I have no doubt that some people might be able to pass a blind test, but most people would fail. And that is even before comparing cables, which have measurable differences but they are so miniscule that they are of no consequence.

Cables only need two things: the right connectors, and the right length. That is it.
 
im_gumby said:
Yeah think you'd call it ABX...
A bunch of the YT personalities took part.
Totally blind. I'll have to find it...
It was during a recent audio show in Malaysia.
Found it...
Click to expand...

What ... a ... farce!

Just critiquing this on testing protocols .... the time lag from cable changes - by itself - invalidates any accuracy to the test. Then the fact that there can be sounds from the hooking-up-and-unhooking of two grossly different-sized cables means that there was a possibility of another "tell". A true test would use a switcher.
Another thing; the person who did the switching had a dog in the fight. He manufactured the more expensive cable. Even if he were completely honest, his body language could easily give the choices away. The body language of the other (visible) listeners would be a giveaway, too.
Not only that, but there were no measurements to show that his boutique cable was within standard specs. I don't really doubt that it was, but my point is that we have no assurance of that.

This was not a test. This was a sham and a farce. These people either didn't know or didn't care what "rigorous controls" means.

Jim
 
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Anyone spending time testing the sound of USB cables lacks respect for themselves, their audience, or both. It's like testing the look of HDMI cables. You'd think it was all a big prank but apparently they're dead serious.
 
There is always a difference... If you replaced a cable with nothing, you don't hear any music.

Logic tells us that between the point of "I can hear sound" and "I cannot hear sound" there has to be a point in-between which is "I can hear some sound". And in majority of applications, that point is around $0.20

People like to focus on the $200 vs $1000 price point when they should be testing at the $0.20 vs $1 price point to make sure their test equipment (their ears) can pick up those differences to begin with
 
Jim Taylor said:
What ... a ... farce!

Time lag from cable changes - by itself - invalidates any accuracy to the test. Then the fact that there can be sounds from the hooking-up-and-unhooking of two grossly different-sized cables means that there was a possibility of another "tell". A true test would use a switcher.
Another thing; the person who did the switching had a dog in the fight. He manufactured the more expensive cable. Even if he were completely honest, his body language could easily give the choices away. The body language of the other (visible) listeners would be a giveaway, too.
Not only that, but there were no measurements to show that his boutique cable was within standard specs. I don't really doubt that it was, but my point is that we have no assurance of that.

This was not a test. This was a sham and a farce. These people either didn't know or didn't care what "rigorous controls" means.

Jim
Click to expand...
Justdafactsmaam said:
Definitely not an ABX test
Click to expand...
Ok, I was going from memory and forgot how they were switching the cables.

And I forgot these were USB cables and not speaker cables.

The point I was making is that when you look at these 'audiophiles', their choices were no better than random guesses.

The point being that you couldn't tell and any difference would be in the noise and most likely not audible.

The same would be true of speaker cables.
 
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Cbdb2 said:
Test in mono using your 2 speakers side by side, different cable on each and use A/B speaker switch or pan pot. If you cant hear a difference you won't in stereo. (First try with the same cable to make sure your speakers match enough).
And Im in the "you won't hear a difference club" but the above is a way to prove it to yourself.
Power cords are a total scam.
Click to expand...
Not a brilliant way though, because the two speakers are in different places in the room. The way they interact then with the room is actually quite likely to create a difference in the sound, that is nothing to do with the cable.
 
antcollinet said:
Not a brilliant way though, because the two speakers are in different places in the room. The way they interact then with the room is actually quite likely to create a difference in the sound, that is nothing to do with the cable.
Click to expand...

And many people can't hear even that, or they would have started caring about room correction.
 
dwcda said:
I was prepared to be happy to hear some improvement from the cables that I tested. But confirmation bias was somewhere else that day.

And I get the motivation that some people have for buying these cables... they've spent a lot of money already and are told that they can get that last X% if they just get some expensive cables. The dealer who sold me my gear said there was no way I should consider using my Mogami cables on this new equipment. When I returned the cables the he sent to try he said that no one had ever returned cables in his 40 years of experience, unless it was to get more expensive cables.
Click to expand...
If a dealer told me that that would be the last dollar spent there.
 
Jim Taylor said:
What ... a ... farce!

Just critiquing this on testing protocols .... the time lag from cable changes - by itself - invalidates any accuracy to the test. Then the fact that there can be sounds from the hooking-up-and-unhooking of two grossly different-sized cables means that there was a possibility of another "tell". A true test would use a switcher.
Another thing; the person who did the switching had a dog in the fight. He manufactured the more expensive cable. Even if he were completely honest, his body language could easily give the choices away. The body language of the other (visible) listeners would be a giveaway, too.
Not only that, but there were no measurements to show that his boutique cable was within standard specs. I don't really doubt that it was, but my point is that we have no assurance of that.

This was not a test. This was a sham and a farce. These people either didn't know or didn't care what "rigorous controls" means.

Jim
Click to expand...
Even with all those flaws, he still went 16/32 overall, which is the same as flipping a coin.
 
There is no cable journey to be had. Basic cables of quality construction (and for speaker cables, sufficient cross sectional area) is all you need. No amount of fancy construction, materials, vast price or flowery lies can make a cable perform better.

The flowery lies might make it sound better - but that process is only going on in your head, not in the real sound, and it will fade.
 
‘I’m tired of travelling I want to be somewhere’
It seems to me subjectivists enjoy a journey.
Keith
 
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