czt
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"Generator" toolbar button. (fig. 1)
The .wav loaded in "Measure", and after "Start" waiting for playback. (fig. 2)
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Comparison of DRCs: Dirac Live for Studio, IK Multimedia ARC System 3 and Sonarworks Reference 4 Studio edition
- Thread starter dominikz
- Start date
The .wav loaded in "Measure", and after "Start" waiting for playback. (fig. 2)
hi thanks
I'm having trouble with this.
I did not make it
This is my first time doing something like this
Maybe it's just possible to take a screenshot in OBS
the whole all the process and upload here or to YouTube
It was much, much easier for me
And I believe for other users too
obsproject.com
I'm having trouble with this.
I did not make it
This is my first time doing something like this
Maybe it's just possible to take a screenshot in OBS
the whole all the process and upload here or to YouTube
It was much, much easier for me
And I believe for other users too
Open Broadcaster Software | OBS
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landco
Active Member
Flat frequency response is not natural in a typical living space. Here it is better to use the "Harman Curve" and its varieties. I'm using a B&K 1974 Speaker target, this curve is ideal for a home environment.
Late to the party ... but want to add my experience to this topic. @dominikz THANKS for this great measurements and documentation!
I worked with Dirac, Sonarworks and Neumann MA-1 and my conclusion is similar. With Sonarworks it always sounded different and not bad - but also not really better as without. (Good speaker in good room, probably different with a bad speaker cause even rough linearisation can be a benefit). Seeing now your test data - I know why.
Dirac is a bit of a hassle to set up (Lexicon MC-10) but works well during the process. You can also work with big Atmos setups which is great. Result is for sure a benefit and a step in a more "realistic/neutral" directioin.
(e.g. my older way cheaper Yamaha amp also delivered a "different" sound with some benefits but no comparison to Dirac which is clearly a step forward)
And Neumann MA-1. Downside - only works with Neumann DSP speakers. But these are pretty good anyways ;-)
The software is still under development, maximum of 2.2 is suported. But the measurement itself is easy to do and stable. It's a little clunky to manage presets - but that's with Dirac too. The result ... is great! A clear step in the direction of "confidence". I used this with monitors for mixing, KH750 + KH80 for a friend in a relatively bad room, KH120ii in my strongly dampened room. And in both cases these setups reminded me to my main speakers - there was some "truth" in what you hear, you could reliably mix on these setups.
As far as I searched for comments it seems to bring better results as Genelecs system - but I never tested or compared it, so this is only silly hearsay, don't take it to serious
.
I worked with Dirac, Sonarworks and Neumann MA-1 and my conclusion is similar. With Sonarworks it always sounded different and not bad - but also not really better as without. (Good speaker in good room, probably different with a bad speaker cause even rough linearisation can be a benefit). Seeing now your test data - I know why.
Dirac is a bit of a hassle to set up (Lexicon MC-10) but works well during the process. You can also work with big Atmos setups which is great. Result is for sure a benefit and a step in a more "realistic/neutral" directioin.
(e.g. my older way cheaper Yamaha amp also delivered a "different" sound with some benefits but no comparison to Dirac which is clearly a step forward)
And Neumann MA-1. Downside - only works with Neumann DSP speakers. But these are pretty good anyways ;-)
The software is still under development, maximum of 2.2 is suported. But the measurement itself is easy to do and stable. It's a little clunky to manage presets - but that's with Dirac too. The result ... is great! A clear step in the direction of "confidence". I used this with monitors for mixing, KH750 + KH80 for a friend in a relatively bad room, KH120ii in my strongly dampened room. And in both cases these setups reminded me to my main speakers - there was some "truth" in what you hear, you could reliably mix on these setups.
As far as I searched for comments it seems to bring better results as Genelecs system - but I never tested or compared it, so this is only silly hearsay, don't take it to serious
.
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bennybbbx
Addicted to Fun and Learning
here is no test of the new arc 4. test it there is a 9 day free demo and i think it is the best of all speaker corrections when set correction type to broad(is less correction) and natural. it is possible to set it to linear but in both modes it have only 0.1 ms latency. so guess it work then in mixed mode. in sharp(much correction) mode linear sound better as in natural but all and all the natural and broad mode give the best results. to hear if a speaker correction is good, play a mono song and when it sound smallest then this is best correction between left and right speakers. I can with arc 4 also use diffrent correction for left and right speakers and sound better as combined.
when hear much bass i get no feeling that the reverb of bass come more from left side . I think it is a huge step forward in speaker correction that it use broad mode. before arc 4 i never get good souning automatic speakercorrection, but now it is good for me and asymetric room. see screenshot what it correct in broad mode. the bass also low bass is a little more in compare to headphone but sound good. this screenshot show only R channel before and after to see better that it not correct so much. maybe it can enhance even more when have more steps between sharp and broad
broad correction type
sharp correction type
when hear much bass i get no feeling that the reverb of bass come more from left side . I think it is a huge step forward in speaker correction that it use broad mode. before arc 4 i never get good souning automatic speakercorrection, but now it is good for me and asymetric room. see screenshot what it correct in broad mode. the bass also low bass is a little more in compare to headphone but sound good. this screenshot show only R channel before and after to see better that it not correct so much. maybe it can enhance even more when have more steps between sharp and broad
broad correction type
sharp correction type
Room symmetry is skewing things in favor of your right channel for room gain but things match up after 1.5kHz. Try limiting your correction to just 1.5kHz and things might sound better than what you're happy with now.
bennybbbx
Addicted to Fun and Learning
the screenshots i do show only right channel before and after correction, i write in text before that only R. my left speaker is louder in bass and the right speaker is more near wall. strange. but happen with all speakers can see in top of screesshot. grey L R text mean it is disable to show. i do this to show that it is better not correct too much. When show all 4 curves it can not see anything. here i show the before L and R curve. limit the correction range give no better results. it is not easy to hear best setting. it can happen that it sound great with lots of clarity(not thur boost high) but after longer hear(more than 5 minutes), ears get tired and strange feeling. this happen when correct full also with phase linear.
I use a desktop and the correction seem made for desktop. I choose this
here is before coreection both channels
after correction
this room config i use. i have keyboard on desktop, mixing i can do in DAW. I have also treatet my room with basstraps basotect and 5 cm plates . i do it with 7 measures . strange is in my room i always get a huge gap at 500 hz which sound not so nice. but boost sound also not good. i only can simulate such a gap on headphone which sound not so good. i thry with plates, but nothing help, also plate on desktop
EDIT: Another thing I noticed is that the latency display in studio one doesn't change when you switch from natural to linear. You have to turn the plugin off then on again then you can see it properly. In linear mode the arc 4 then has a latency of 42.7 ms. So full linear in the bass too. I still think it doesn't sound that good in lineaer mode. But it could also be because the level changes at 63 Hz and the valley that I have on the left becomes even larger. But it's amazing that the Arc 4 is the first automatic speaker calibration thing that sounds better than my hand-tuned one in the mini DSP.
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bennybbbx
Addicted to Fun and Learning
I think speaker correction compare need also do with same microphone.
Because i see never in my life a test of measure microphone i thought a 50$ microphone is good enough. I want know it and i buy a beyerdynamic MM1 which cost ~230 $ and use it in arc 4.
in arc 4 is suggest to use measure level you hear normally. I like hear 72-75 db and neighbours can not hear. with the arc microphone and sonarworks microphone(which cost ~80$) i get not good results at this level. i measure with 85 db or more. now with the beyer i can measure with 75 db and the strange bass that on left side sound as more reverb is less, also clarity and location is increase . brain try always correct that it sound good, but in compare what find before good sound now not so good when longer hear. In the FR the beyer record ~1 db more level from 150-900 hz. so the correction reduce this level in compare to other microphones i have.
I have do screenshot when run measure with speakers off so it measure FR of ambient noise. the arc mems microphone can see as a reference because such mems microphones have very few production deviations. because there is no FR correction for the mems microphone i do a correction that it is simular to the sonarworks long time ago. sonarworks have much more noise. but mems create noise at 50 hz. for rew it is best do calibration and add always the sensivity parameter, because every microphone have diffrent gain. beyer give 4 db more gain and reduced noise . that in bass is noise more is because my PC fans rotate with 700 rpm do some noise and the street too do noise in bass
and distortion of speaker get also lower with the beyer.
btw i buy now a esi unik05+ it have ribbon tweeter, have strong driver and a bass plug is attached to close the port, and distortion is not increase. it is smaller as the HS5 and have this valley in bass the HS5 have not. I can with the mm1 microphone strong correct and get good sound with much low bass. speakers are place same as hs5 on foam pads that are tilt. measure is with open bass port . my conclusion is . when use speaker correction a good measure microphone is very important . if the measure microphone for 300 or 800 $ get even more better sound, i did not verify. but i guess the mm1 is not much topable.
atteched is the calibrartion file i use for the arc mems . I get this together with the arc 2 and arc 4 i buy upgrade for 100 $ without microphone. if somebody also have a arc microphone he can use my cal file and compare his microphone to this. i have set the gain knob in middle of the scarlet focusrite 8i6o. then it is what in cal file stand
Sensitivity -22.0dbFS
Because i see never in my life a test of measure microphone i thought a 50$ microphone is good enough. I want know it and i buy a beyerdynamic MM1 which cost ~230 $ and use it in arc 4.
in arc 4 is suggest to use measure level you hear normally. I like hear 72-75 db and neighbours can not hear. with the arc microphone and sonarworks microphone(which cost ~80$) i get not good results at this level. i measure with 85 db or more. now with the beyer i can measure with 75 db and the strange bass that on left side sound as more reverb is less, also clarity and location is increase . brain try always correct that it sound good, but in compare what find before good sound now not so good when longer hear. In the FR the beyer record ~1 db more level from 150-900 hz. so the correction reduce this level in compare to other microphones i have.
I have do screenshot when run measure with speakers off so it measure FR of ambient noise. the arc mems microphone can see as a reference because such mems microphones have very few production deviations. because there is no FR correction for the mems microphone i do a correction that it is simular to the sonarworks long time ago. sonarworks have much more noise. but mems create noise at 50 hz. for rew it is best do calibration and add always the sensivity parameter, because every microphone have diffrent gain. beyer give 4 db more gain and reduced noise . that in bass is noise more is because my PC fans rotate with 700 rpm do some noise and the street too do noise in bass
and distortion of speaker get also lower with the beyer.
btw i buy now a esi unik05+ it have ribbon tweeter, have strong driver and a bass plug is attached to close the port, and distortion is not increase. it is smaller as the HS5 and have this valley in bass the HS5 have not. I can with the mm1 microphone strong correct and get good sound with much low bass. speakers are place same as hs5 on foam pads that are tilt. measure is with open bass port . my conclusion is . when use speaker correction a good measure microphone is very important . if the measure microphone for 300 or 800 $ get even more better sound, i did not verify. but i guess the mm1 is not much topable.
atteched is the calibrartion file i use for the arc mems . I get this together with the arc 2 and arc 4 i buy upgrade for 100 $ without microphone. if somebody also have a arc microphone he can use my cal file and compare his microphone to this. i have set the gain knob in middle of the scarlet focusrite 8i6o. then it is what in cal file stand
Sensitivity -22.0dbFS
Last edited:
Basilderat
Member
I approach DSP a little differently. I prefer to listen to DSD recordings, so software DSP won't work for me. For DSD I've measured the room with the MMM method, then use a Harman DBX231 31-band GEQ to flatten the response curve as best I can.
I also listen to FLAC files from time to time, so from there I also used REW to generate room curve filters which I apply in Foobar via the FabFilter Pro Q3 VST plugin.
I also listen to FLAC files from time to time, so from there I also used REW to generate room curve filters which I apply in Foobar via the FabFilter Pro Q3 VST plugin.
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