Commercial/pro amplifier audio quality experiences?

[Iceberg]

What are people's experience with picking thru what is the best sounding commercial / pro audio amplifiers out there?

I am curious what companies make the most well regarded equipment. I can gather up brand names but I can't really get a sense of much more other than power output figures and configuration possibilities. I wanted to look at these amps beyond the pure utility and into their more subtle traits.

 

[DVDdoug]

Most pro & home amplifiers are "fine" (as long as you have enough power) but of course if you want high power there are more high-power pro amps on the market, and in general you get more watts-per-dollar with pro amps.

One common issue with pro amps is that they often have a cooling fan that makes noise.

And, electrical noise is usually the only "spec" to worry about. (And power, of course.) Frequency response and distortion are usually better than human hearing with ANY decent amp, assuming you don't over-drive it into clipping. Noise can be below audibility too, and that als0 depends on how sensitive your speakers are, and how close you are to the speakers.

 

[Iceberg]

And, electrical noise is usually the only "spec" to worry about. (And power, of course.) Frequency response and distortion are usually better than human hearing with ANY decent amp, assuming you don't over-drive it into clipping. Noise can be below audibility too, and that als0 depends on how sensitive your speakers are, and how close you are to the speakers.

What do you mean by electrical noise?

 

[delta76]

What do you mean by electrical noise?

the electric you feed to speaker is not perfectly clean (i.e a perfect sin wave). there are noises in those waves, which will translate to noises from the speaker (if the speaker can produce those frequencies). however those noise are usually in much higher frequencies than human ear can listen to (in 100+ khz range, you are lucky to hear anything higher than 16 khz).

 

[Iceberg]

the electric you feed to speaker is not perfectly clean (i.e a perfect sin wave). there are noises in those waves, which will translate to noises from the speaker (if the speaker can produce those frequencies). however those noise are usually in much higher frequencies than human ear can listen to (in 100+ khz range, you are lucky to hear anything higher than 16 khz).

So why is this important to commercial amps? I am missing the link.

 

[sergeauckland]

So why is this important to commercial amps? I am missing the link.

It's important to amplifiers generally, regardless of whether Pro/commercial or for domestic use. The main issue is that with high power amps in a home environment, the Signal to noise ratio needs to be very high as the 'signal' part is high so if the power is higher, the noise will be higher and possibly audible at home where it matters much more than in, say, a venue where the background noise is higher.

Pro amps are designed for ruggedness and reliability rather than the ultimate in low noise. Having said that, I use three Behringer A500 amps in my three-way active 'speakers and have adequately low noise, so unless one's using especially sensitive loudspeakers, Pro amps can be fine at home.
S

 

[delta76]

So why is this important to commercial amps? I am missing the link.

oh my comment was a bit out of context. Generally, commercial/pro amps are used in much noisier and hotter environments than "consumer" amps. for that, they usually have fans, and they allow more noise than normal. both of those are usually not audible in their intended environment, but in your listening room, it can be a problem.

 

[Willem]

See here for a proper test of a sadly discontinued 2x350 watt Yamaha P3500s: https://www.homecinema-fr.com/forum...mpli-yamaha-p3500s-mise-a-jour-t30056383.html Those are excellent measurements. I bought the slightly less powerful 2x250 watt P2500s version for my son for only 300 euros, and it is as clean as a whistle. It has a variable speed fan that never comes on in normal domestic use. It also sports balanced inputs and an adjustable high pass filter, making it far more useful than most consumer amplifiers. Do I need to say that it is well made?

 

[ZolaIII]

For example:

Outlaw 2220 Review (Monoblock Amplifier)

This is a review and detailed measurements of the Outlaw 2220 single channel amplifier. It is on kind loan from a member and costs US $399. The look is simple but elegant in its slim form factor. I like that it is just heavy enough to give you confidence but not so much that you can't lift...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Serch the index for more.

 

[Schollaudio]

Old Ashly FTX2001 and Chevin A3000 are very good. Would love to see them measured but they're to heavy to ship.

 

[Iceberg]

It's important to amplifiers generally, regardless of whether Pro/commercial or for domestic use. The main issue is that with high power amps in a home environment, the Signal to noise ratio needs to be very high as the 'signal' part is high so if the power is higher, the noise will be higher and possibly audible at home where it matters much more than in, say, a venue where the background noise is higher.

Pro amps are designed for ruggedness and reliability rather than the ultimate in low noise. Having said that, I use three Behringer A500 amps in my three-way active 'speakers and have adequately low noise, so unless one's using especially sensitive loudspeakers, Pro amps can be fine at home.
S

That makes a lot of sense. It probably explains why home gamers like these amps for subwoofers. The ones with horn loaded drivers probably hear the hiss a bit.

I don't know the Behringer brand.

Old Ashly FTX2001 and Chevin A3000 are very good. Would love to see them measured but they're to heavy to ship.

Interesting, thanks. Are there any other brand names out there? Also the mention of that Yamaha amp, I had seen that one in photos a few times. It looks like Denon makes/made commercial amps. Funny when you look, brands like Kenwood even made multi-meters. I was reading up on Electro Voice, they have a long history which makes the build history patchy, any thoughts on them?

 

[sergeauckland]

That makes a lot of sense. It probably explains why home gamers like these amps for subwoofers. The ones with horn loaded drivers probably hear the hiss a bit.

I don't know the Behringer brand.




Interesting, thanks. Are there any other brand names out there? Also the mention of that Yamaha amp, I had seen that one in photos a few times. It looks like Denon makes/made commercial amps. Funny when you look, brands like Kenwood even made multi-meters. I was reading up on Electro Voice, they have a long history which makes the build history patchy, any thoughts on them?

Behringer are a German brand, part of the Music Tribe group (run by Uli Behringer) with their manufacturing in very extensive facilities in China. They are known for high value, low price equipment, of 'adequate' (in my opinion) quality. At home, I use their amplifiers, equaliser and crossover for my hifi, their microphones and mixers for live recording, and several of their 'fixit' boxes at the radio station I do the engineering for. Nothing stellar, but decent quality and sensible prices.

S.

 

[EJasonC]

I have a pair of Dali Euphonia MS5’s in the incredible Alpi finish. They are capable of sounding as good as they look; from exceptional to astounding with proper power amplification. Way back when, I remember hearing a pair of MS5’s at one of my favorite boutique audio brick & mortar places being driven by BAT tube mono-blocs. The musical bliss, very palpable dynamics, and incredible three dimensional sound stage stayed with me for a very long time.

Fast forward to today when I now have a pair of my own, albeit without the proper power amps. I had been toying with the idea of going with Manley Snapper Mono blocks to drive them. However, because I also have a lot of pro audio gear, I decided to try a pro audio amp instead. I was looking for non class D and no active/fan cooled when Avantone Pro announced the release of their CLA-400. I decided to place my order as soon as they became available.

I must say my MS5’s driven by this CLA-400 are breathing with life; alive and well with the very dynamics and soundstage width & depth I was searching for. Additionally, the bass quality is extremely good with the punch and timbre that had been so elusive for me. I was not prepared for it; but I am extremely pleased!

It stands to reason, at least in my mind, that since most music is produced with pro audio gear, why not playback that same music with the aforementioned pro audio gear. It is rather astonishing to my ears that a very affordable pro audio amp driving a very expensive pair of audiophile speakers sounds this incredible! It’s kind of mismatched but I am not complaining in the least bit!

Here is a link: https://www.avantonepro.com/en/products/cla-400

And here is a link to my speakers: https://www.dali-speakers.com/media/3290/euphonia-ms5-productpdf.pdf

 

[Geert]

Are there any other brand names out there?

Crown, Lab Gruppen and QSC are some well respected amps. Note that what the general public thinks are pro amps are actualy low budget types made for bedroom DJ's. You won't find amps from these product ranges in professional concert systems. The amp's being used there are in a total different price range. I just mention it because it's not clear what you're after.