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Chord GroundARAY Review (Noise Filter?)

Rate this audio product:

  • 1. Waste of money (piggy bank panther)

    Votes: 273 97.2%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther

    Votes: 1 0.4%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 6 2.1%

  • Total voters
    281

DonR

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Good point.

As for any possible effect of a feed-trough turmaline filter (large-plate capacitor filled with turmaline powder), some guy**) in Germany made measurements that seem to show a bit of dampening effect at very high frequencies > 200MHz:
In the following post he writes he checked the filter also with some turmaline powder of dubious origin and found it doesn't have any effect at all --> fake turmaline.

As it looks to be the Chord stick are of different type, using only and only the GND/shield connection on sockets ona piece of gear, I hardly can image any effective noise reduction mechanism. Especially if they really are shield-connected to the GND they are supposed to clean.

**) basically a pretty serious engineer (whom I know personally) and long-time small-scale enthusiast manufacturer of speakers, cables and in the past, amplifiers, though with a bit esoteric views at times, from my POV at least.
Which is funny in this instance since an ethernet RJ45 has neither ground lines nor shield.
 

KSTR

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Which is funny in this instance since an ethernet RJ45 has neither ground lines nor shield.
Full Ack. Probably a tell that it was like the managers said "hey we need a RJ45 variant as well" and a poor tech guy with a remaing bit of engineering integrity replied "that makes no sense". The Manager then "Never mind, they'll sell anyway" ;-)
 

solderdude

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There are shielded RJ45 plugs and shield can be (and when present) usually is connected to the common/ground.
I often have to use shielded cables to pass EMC testing of various communication devices.
The Chord one clearly is using a screened connector.

That doesn't change the fact that these devices clearly do nothing useful in the electric realm but are very useful for putting money in the pockets of sellers and manufacturer and messing with the minds of owners.
So they are useful for that.
 
Last edited:

DSJR

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From <https://docs.linn.co.uk/wiki/images/9/9c/K20_info.PDF>

I read somewhere that Naim only produced the A5 cable because Linn struck a deal with the A4 supplier to sell it exclusively to them. Of course, in the whole Linn-Naim saga it is hard to know what is fact rather than fiction. :)
BICC made the bloody stuff from what I remember ;) It may have been upgraded but the stuff I sold was exactly the save innards as the A4 and it didn't look '4mm' to me. I used 2.5mm install cables and that's the 'size' of the K20/A4 conductors as I remember. A5 used less strands but each one thicker and a hopelessly non-bendy insulation...
 

audio_tony

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There are shielded RJ45 plugs and shield can be (and when present) usually is connected to the common/ground.
I have to use those kinds of cables (shielded) to pass EMC testing of various equipment.
The Chord one clearly is using a screened connector.

That doesn't change the fact that these devices clearly do nothing useful in the electric realm but are very useful for putting money in the pockets of sellers and manufacturer and messing with the minds of owners.
So they are useful for that.
I didn't notice the screened connector previously but you are indeed corrrect.

The question is; does a cheap Netgear / other brand switch support shielded connections?
 

DonR

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There are shielded RJ45 plugs and shield can be (and when present) usually is connected to the common/ground.
I often have to use shielded cables to pass EMC testing of various communication devices.
The Chord one clearly is using a screened connector.

That doesn't change the fact that these devices clearly do nothing useful in the electric realm but are very useful for putting money in the pockets of sellers and manufacturer and messing with the minds of owners.
So they are useful for that.
My mistake. This one does actually have a screened connector. I cannot tell if the data pins are present. If so, I would have to ask, why?
 

mansr

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I didn't notice the screened connector previously but you are indeed corrrect.

The question is; does a cheap Netgear / other brand switch support shielded connections?
I have never seen an Ethernet switch, regardless of brand or price, without shielded jacks. For some reason, though, on broadband routers, the jacks are usually unshielded.
 

DonR

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Does anyone sell plugs without pins? If so, why?
I would have thought that for this amount of money, and given their dubious premise, they would want to remove any chance of adding noise back in. Clearly, using GroundARAY logic, the pins act as tiny antennae absorbing RF noise and injecting it into the connected device. :eek:
 

solderdude

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The question is; does a cheap Netgear / other brand switch support shielded connections?

Yes, when the sockets look like this they are screened.

netgear.jpg
 

JDS

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Was that meant to sound like a condescending reply.?

What AVR has a SINAD of 52 db? NAD?? Okay in all fairness my AVRs are in the low 80s, you may have a point!!

My comparisons with equipment measuring over 100 SINAD, I could find no shortcomings was all I mean. Maybe in YOUR case......

Why am I here? Mostly to see measurements of Speakers to be honest.
I was in the tweako camp earlier in my audiophile journey. Back then I would have sworn I heard big differences between various interconnects. Thus I include myself in the "highly suggestible" class.

What AVR? This one:
1659910285733.png


I don't recall seeing Amir test ANY AVRs that delivered >100dB SINAD.
 

Axo1989

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I am actually pretty serious about that.

Amir and this site implies a "scientific" approach. It's not. What's being offered are basic measurements.
Empirical evidence gets neglected. As well as e.g. Audio Precision statements about its equipment limitations.
And as mentioned, there are procedural flaws.

Since years Amir generates measurements of audio devices, DACs in particular, showing flaws beyond
audible thresholds. If you'd follow Amirs (and his followers) logic: "all DuTs therefore sound the same",
it would basically imply there'd be no reason for having this forum at all anymore.

Yet. That's simply not the case. The devices do not sound the same. People keep buying new stuff.

All I am saying. You better be careful not to drift into an ideological direction.

If ten different people say there are, they hear, differences, as a scientist, you'd ask why is that!?!?
Even if one out of hundred says he experienced a difference it shouldn't be neglected. That's what science is all about.
Otherwise we'd still living in caves.

And you bet. Amir is well aware of it!

Enjoy.

There's already an ideology of sorts and an associated narrative: audio saviour Amir vs the Hi-Fi charlatans. It's a good story because there's a fair bit of truth in it. Products like these fit the narrative perfectly.

I've seen more than a few posts like @JDS directly above confessing past audiophilia and perhaps a road-to-Damascus conversion. I may find your post reasonable in parts because I can't recall being seduced by sonic differences between upstream sources and components, or held in thrall by tales of Hi-Fi mystique. So I'm less prone to PTSD twitches or inclined to declarations of ideological purity.

I do think the high-throughput business model of ASR and the somewhat cookie-cutter test suite can be charmless at times. I enjoy a good nuance. While the test suite isn't tailored I'd also be surprised if we are missing out on much with these accessories.
 

pkane

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I do think the high-throughput business model of ASR and the somewhat cookie-cutter test suite can be charmless at times. I enjoy a good nuance. While the test suite isn't tailored I'd also be surprised if we are missing out on much with these accessories.

Curiously, these accessories are available to anyone willing to pay for them, or to borrow them from others. Anything Amir misses in his testing can easily be filled in by others, but I've yet to see any objective evidence that these "ground filters" do anything useful. Not surprisingly so, considering their "unconventional" design that flies in the face of known science.
 

Axo1989

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Curiously, these accessories are available to anyone willing to pay for them, or to borrow them from others. Anything Amir misses in his testing can easily be filled in by others, but I've yet to see any objective evidence that these "ground filters" do anything useful. Not surprisingly so, considering their "unconventional" design that flies in the face of known science.

I don't think either of us expect metaphysical grounding accessories (as opposed to actual grounding, or dealing with ground loops and so on) to have audible consequences.

If someone (meaning someone with both expertise and a way with words, like Archimago for example) decided to do more specifically tailored investigation, I'd likely find it a good read regardless. I doubt there's enough of an angle or potential payoff to warrant it though. Perhaps side-tracks into geology and alchemy would add colour?
 

audio_tony

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Yes, when the sockets look like this they are screened.

View attachment 222955

Screened but not grounded, as that switch (and many like it) are powered from a 'wall wart' mains adapter. So to achieve proper grounding one would need to connect the metal body of the switch to a mains ground somewhere.

Most PCs are grounded are course, so in theory the ground would be derived from any connected PC (if using a screened network cable) which of course opens up the possibility of ground loops!
 

Ken Tajalli

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Curiously, these accessories are available to anyone willing to pay for them, or to borrow them from others. Anything Amir misses in his testing can easily be filled in by others, but I've yet to see any objective evidence that these "ground filters" do anything useful. Not surprisingly so, considering their "unconventional" design that flies in the face of known science.
From what I understand from the "design!" , they act like a faraday-cage on unused inputs, so RF can not be picked up like an antenna. Filter implies two connections.
Basically one could wrap some kitchen foil on unused ports making sure it also touches the ground or casing.
Unless you have your mobile phone stuck to the port, I doubt anyone could measure anything, or hear anything.
These are just toys to accessorize one's hifi.
 

audio_tony

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Does that make any difference if you use the usual UTP (Unshielded) cables? Even though the sockets are shielded from one another, the cables directly outside are not.

Unshielded cables are still twisted pair, and have quite good immunity to noise anyway.

Despite it being ill advised to do so, I have run cables alongside mains cables for several metres (no other route so had to do this) and there were no interference problems at all, on a 1 gigabit network, with full speed being attained.

A higher speed (10 gigabit) network may well be a different story though, but since I have been retired from IT for a few years, I've had no exposure to 10gb so can't offer any anecdotal experience.
 

MaxBuck

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A bit O/T, but are trademark laws more lax in the UK? I think if two companies in the USA made similar products under fundamentally identical names, legal action would compel one of them to change its name.
 

mansr

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A bit O/T, but are trademark laws more lax in the UK? I think if two companies in the USA made similar products under fundamentally identical names, legal action would compel one of them to change its name.
Both companies have registered the word CHORD as a trademark. The registration for The Chord Company covers "Cables, lines, wires and interconnectors; parts and fittings for all the aforesaid goods." The one for Chord Electronics applies to "Audio equipment and devices; multimedia equipment and devices; accessories for the aforesaid goods; application software for mobile devices; electronic signal receiving equipment; electronic signal transmission equipment; electronic signal processing equipment; electronic storage devices; power supplies; power storage and distribution equipment and devices; none of the aforesaid goods being audio and video leads, cables, wires and connectors." Note the bolded (by me) part.
 
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