CD signal out vs transport interconnects. Why/which?

[Gio-G]

@Gio-G I may be missing something, but I only see one question in your post? In any case, asking about the speaker thing might be answered quicker in a speaker thread. Asking about the specific CD transport might be easier in that review thread.

Short answer about the speakers based on what I know: Speaker placement can have an effect on perceived sound stage, but I would not conclude that a single change (like moving them away from the wall) will always have the same effect. What creates the impression of a broader stage are the amount of reflections and their time differences relative to the direct path. So things like speaker directivity and placement, as well as room geometry and treatment (absorbers, carpets, etc.) can have an effect. Other members will probably know a bit more about this than me.

You are correct, I rambled the first question so I really didn't ask it. I was wondering if I'd gain or lose anything switching from RCA cables from CD to preamp to a coaxial cable. The current player is HDCD capable but I'm not sure I hear much difference between a standard, well recorded CD VS the HDCD. So to narrow this down, would I benefit from going with the coax over the current RCA cables?

My apologies for missing that first question. My wife was talking to me in the middle of all of that

Also, thank you for the explanation on speaker placement. I may or may not move them back toward the wall for a little bass loading. I may have them in the best spot for this particular room which is pretty audio friendly as is.

 

[roddo]

I may be hijacking this thread a little, but I've liked the answers I've seen here from the science oriented posters. Plus it is an older thread and the OP seems to have ceased posting on it.

I'm considering buying and using the Tascam CD200-BT as a transport only, recommended and reviewed by NTTY (Thanks for that review). I currently am using an old California Audio Labs CL-10 HDCD player I bought on E-Bay years ago for I believe $200. I bought the CL-5 in 1999 for almost a grand (US) and I still have both. I'd buy the Tascam because it is new and the review here on ASR was very favorable. I see it lasting to the end of my watch so to speak.

Here are my questions if anybody with a true objective set of answers can chime in and this can apply to my current CD player and the Tascam should I buy it.

I was thinking of using a Blue Jeans Cables RCA Coaxial to hook either player up to my Bryston BR-20 Preamp. I don't know that I'd lose much or anything by not having the CL-10's HDCD's properties. I have some duplicate HDCD's that I also have on standard CD and I don't know that I hear a difference and I have no measurable way to say one way or the other. I don't have the equipment and I'd have no clue what I'm doing.

Here is my second question and it is somewhat unrelated to the initial post here.

In regard to "soundstage", I saw the answer earlier in the thread that it is in relation to the source recording.

I have Perlisten S7T speakers and they seem to respond well to room placement when it comes to loading bass. I find the bass to favorably increase the closer I place them to the front wall.

I've read different opinions about having speakers pulled out further from the front wall that say "soundstage depth" is better when the speakers are further into the room. Supposedly the depth field increases behind the speakers if they are moved into the room a little more. Is that true or rubbish? I previously used NHT 3.3 speakers and I still have them. They were damn near flush with the front wall and the bass response was very, very good. The Perlisten speakers seem better in every way sans the bass.

Again, apologies for the semi hijack questions, but if anybody here has some objective insight to what I just rambled off, I'd appreciate it.

I'm really out of my depth on this board and often feel like a moron asking certain equations and even trying to convey proper terminology. I sometimes feel I use subjective phrasing even though I'm wanting objective answers.

Thank you to anybody that can answer these questions and apologies again to the O/P if I diverted this thread in an unfavorable direction.

My expirence with my CD transport connected to a approx $500/smsl dac:

Currently connected via decent quality (wbc) rca interconnects.

I've ab tested the above vs the same hi rez (qoboz) track connected via both rca, and USB, and I cannot detect any difference in soundstage, resolution, etc.

As far as speakers are concerned, I have a vintage setup (marantz 2325 driving a pair of 4 ohm AR11 speakers), and my view us you just have to expirement with placement. There are no hard and fast rules, the type of speaker, the room, the track, and your ear all play a factor.

Some speakers are designed to sit close to the back wall, others don't.

I have an L shaped room, in theory absolutely terrible for acoustics, but (IMO), my setup sounds fantastic with wide staging. Because of the asymmetric nature, i use soft room correction via a wiim pro. Balances things out nicely.

 

[RandomEar]

You are correct, I rambled the first question so I really didn't ask it. I was wondering if I'd gain or lose anything switching from RCA cables from CD to preamp to a coaxial cable. The current player is HDCD capable but I'm not sure I hear much difference between a standard, well recorded CD VS the HDCD. So to narrow this down, would I benefit from going with the coax over the current RCA cables?

My apologies for missing that first question. My wife was talking to me in the middle of all of that

In general: No. Unless you have some obvious problem in your current setup, there is nothing to gain from "better" cables. Since you would also be switching from analog output to digital output, your pre-amp become the DAC. In most cases, there is no audible difference between DACs anyway, so this would also be a moot point. However, if you currently do have any problem with audible noise, mains hum or anything like that, it won't hurt to buy a cheap coax cable and check out whether that cures it.

Concerning CD vs. HDCD, I don't really know what the HDCD encoding does. I've read that it's supposed to increase the bith depth to 20 bits, but uses a regular 16 bit CD-compatible encoding and modulates the lowest bit. So technically, this would destroy a tiny fraction of information in the default CD format. Meh

Also, thank you for the explanation on speaker placement. I may or may not move them back toward the wall for a little bass loading. I may have them in the best spot for this particular room which is pretty audio friendly as is.

You can simply arrange it how it sounds best to you. If you want to tackle room modes and have the option to run a parametric EQ somewhere in your signal chain, acquiring a measurement mic (e.g. UMIK-1, can be a used copy) would be an option.

 

[antcollinet]

I'm considering buying and using the Tascam CD200-BT as a transport only, recommended and reviewed by NTTY (Thanks for that review).

Nothing wrong with getting something new "just because"

But take a step backwards and think for a moment. What are you hopeing to get from the change? If it is compact design, or new features, or just "the new shiny" fine.


But if your motivation is sound quality, then you are exceptionally unlikely to get anything audible there. Regardless of how well the Tascam measures.

Blue Jeans Cables RCA Coaxial

same here. While blue jeans are not excessivley over priced, they will not perform better than the generic equivalent or amazon basics. If you get it, do it for looks, not sound quality.

 

[Gio-G]

Nothing wrong with getting something new "just because"

But take a step backwards and think for a moment. What are you hopeing to get from the change? If it is compact design, or new features, or just "the new shiny" fine.


But if your motivation is sound quality, then you are exceptionally unlikely to get anything audible there. Regardless of how well the Tascam measures.




same here. While blue jeans are not excessivley over priced, they will not perform better than the generic equivalent or amazon basics. If you get it, do it for looks, not sound quality.

I don't think my points/questions were conveyed properly on my end.

The cable question was regarding going from RCA (2 cables) from my CD down to one coaxial into the DAC on my preamp. Dropping a cable is always welcome and the Blue Jeans was not expensive. That decision seemed easy enough but, I was wondering if there would be any measurable improvement that is audible by doing that? Having less of a tangled mess behind the system is a plus but if I were to gain even a slight improvement in sound I'd call that a win-win.

So, RCA to Coax, any measurable sound improvements or just one less cable? I'm pretty sure the newer DAC on my preamp isn't any better than the DAC on the current CD player but maybe I'm wrong. RandomEar pretty much already answered that question so thanks again.

The CD player change, should I decide to do it, is because my current player is aging and the other day I had a new disc that failed to read the last two songs. It played all the way through when I first got it, the disc is unscratched and in mint condition. Maybe I wrongly assumed the player was showing almost 30 years of aging but I've never had an issue before with playback and everything ages after a lot of use.

As far as CD player improvements, from what I've read, the Tascam is built very well, has good internals and it reads imperfect discs better than other players. I don't expect any sound improvement from it, just more reliability.

If I do make that purchase it would simply be a preemptive buy so I'd have something ready to go should the Cal Audio Labs rig sputter and die. I have noticed prices on everything seem to climb almost yearly and I figured if I buy early, I'll potentially save a few $$.

Hopefully that clarifies my above post which I should go re-read. My wife was talking to me while I was typing it out and I was quite distracted so this should hopefully add a little clarity to the matter.

Thanks for the response!

 

[antcollinet]

So, RCA to Coax, any measurable sound improvements or just one less cable?

There may well be measureable improvements. But almost certainly not audible.

Nevertheless, fewer cables and a noise free digitial connection are real benefits. Personally I will always connect digitally if it's an option simple because it is the best way, regardless of audibility.

Maybe I wrongly assumed the player was showing almost 30 years of aging

Quite possible (A typical behaviour from old worn out lasers) and a very valid reason for buying something new.

 

[Gio-G]

There may well be measureable improvements. But almost certainly not audible.

Nevertheless, fewer cables and a noise free digitial connection are real benefits. Personally I will always connect digitally if it's an option simple because it is the best way, regardless of audibility.



Quite possible (A typical behaviour from old worn out lasers) and a very valid reason for buying something new.

Thanks for this response. I think you covered it all.

I'll likely wait on the CD player. I often forget I have the Cal Audio CL-5 here as well. So I have a backup and the only difference is, it doesn't read HDCDs. That won't matter if I hook up the CL-10 via coaxial. I'm not overly impressed with HDCD. I've found CDs recorded in Q-Sound,if mixed properly to sound better and XRCDs also are well recorded and mastered. That also goes for standard CDs that are done well from the source recording.

My next quest is eventually adding 2 subs to my system.

That may be a bit.