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Carver Raven 350 Review (Tube Amp)

Rate this amplifier:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 269 82.8%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 29 8.9%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 17 5.2%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 10 3.1%

  • Total voters
    325
OP
amirm

amirm

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Ok, thanks. I do not have the detailed knowledge about all of the details involved here, just wondering overall how much of the amplifier differences could be measured in the air after the speaker.
Frequency response difference can indeed be measured. Question is, what speaker do you pick? How would that be representative of your speaker?
 

mhardy6647

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Nah, that’s how high-end AV gear is supposed to look. Consider this laser disc player for example:

View attachment 226077
I'd buy one of those in a heartbeat!

FMmdZ26WQAAO4KQ.jpg
 

GXAlan

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Frequency response difference can indeed be measured. Question is, what speaker do you pick? How would that be representative of your speaker?
Different current feedback can be used to adjust damping factor.

Vintage P-20 let you switch between 1, 5, and 50.
They stopped adding that feature after the very first generation. Those are readily available on eBay for about $1000.

Makes me wonder how easy or hard it would be for Topping or other customer focused amplifier company to let users change damping factor in the future.
 

SIY

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Different current feedback can be used to adjust damping factor.

Vintage P-20 let you switch between 1, 5, and 50.
They stopped adding that feature after the very first generation. Those are readily available on eBay for about $1000.

Makes me wonder how easy or hard it would be for Topping or other customer focused amplifier company to let users change damping factor in the future.
You can do it for a 50 cent resistor.
 

Holmz

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I absolutely realize that. But small changes in behavior by many can make positive changes. The alternative is to burn fossil fuels and party like it's 1999, which is fun until oceans rise enough to flood your house. We are already seeing drought caused by climate change in the western US and even in Europe. Partying on like nothing's wrong is foolish and unsustainable. I'm not saying we all have to hug trees, but burning through polluting energy when alternatives are available is too far in the wasteful direction.

Change your avatar to a Class-D amp then, to set a good example for us.

Most people use an amplifier mostly for amplifying music, and many people listen with around 1W of output.
I guess if one is using an amplifier for heating a house, then they should not care with the audio performance is.



What is the dinosaur equivalent of an ad hominem attack?
Ad deinós ?
 

DonH56

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Ok, thanks. I do not have the detailed knowledge about all of the details involved here, just wondering overall how much of the amplifier differences could be measured in the air after the speaker.
Here is a thread about damping factor (output impedance) and how it can change the frequency response of your speakers. At the terminals usually translates to in the air.


HTH - Don
 

Spocko

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One issue with DBT, whether technocrat or audiophool is that of perception or expectation bias. An audiophool may believe that everything makes a difference but a DBT causes too much stress, and anyway, it's an artificial way that's removed from the normal listening experience, so no point in taking a DBT, as I'll fail.

A 'Technocrat' (like me!) assumes that there is no difference unless the measurements indicate there should be, so my expectation bias is that I won't hear a difference, so I don't. Consequently, any DBT I take will come out as no more than guessing, as that's exactly what I would do.

A DBT works with a believer that's sufficiently open minded!

S.
And the best part of this audio gear journey is quite simply: your ears adapt so well that if 2 pieces of equipment are similar in a DBT that even if you could barely tell the difference 7 of 10 times, this is more than close enough that your ears really don't care so just buy the one that you'd be happy owning.
 

Mnyb

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Regarding high sensitivity speakers, the use case is somewhat of an oxymoron to me ? Let me explain .
In many cases high sensitivity speakers have a very ragged fr response and a bunch of other issues ( Klipsch, zu ?)
Distortion from your tube amp will be the least of your problems ?

I’ve read tread here where DIY projects seems to have high sensitivity speakers who mitigated those issues but they unsurprisingly includes active overs eq and possibly also class-D or solid state amps ?

The typical hifi speaker has not been developed with sensitivity as an priority for several decades ? When they where it was out of necessity .

You may like these speakers for sounding “dynamic” or “alive” and “interesting” I’ve heard some, but in the end prefered “normal” speakers.
 

Rottmannash

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Should be about the same. All these high power pentode tube amps were meant to be distortion generators so as to give them mellow character while being able to power most speaker loads. This is the classic kind of amp TAS reviewers (esp HP) went gaga over. The names roll off the tongue: VTL, CJ, Audio Research, Jadis, Line Magnetics, Mesa Boogie, Cary, Carver, Manley, and Convergent Audio Technology. Anything putting out over 200 WPC into 8 ohms and costing less than $10k was considered a bargain. I sincerely doubt even one of them could attain a SINAD over 60 which is something even my $160 Behringer A500 can handily surpass.

I made the plunge into tubes in the mid-late 80s in a smaller way, buying a CJ MV 50 to power my LS3/5as at the time. For a while I enjoyed it, but I began to notice it overlaid everything with a kind of honey like glaze while blurring details. In short, it made everything sound homogenized and sweeter than live which to me is the very definition of a colored component. I found my Hafler DH 200 was actually far more transparent. So eventually I traded in the CJ and haven't looked back since. Generally, I think, people who want their music to sound a certain way (and I literally mean all their music) might find a tube amp appealing. So if you're the kind of guy who wants Johnny Rotten to sound like Tony Bennett, Keith Richards to sound like Chet Atkins, Stravinsky to sound like Brahms, and Wendy O Williams to sound like Linda Ronstadt, then tubes may just be for you.
I know Carlos made Mesa Boogie guitar amps semi-famous but didn't know they made audio amps.
 

Jimster480

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I'm using this as the defacto statement on measurements versus pleasure !
Definitely makes sense since it is pleasure oriented.
That makes no sense whatever. And it gets worse from there.
Well a higher slew rate on the op-amp chips does tend to lead to better performance overall. However there is obviously a cap!
 

traderitch

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The planets must have aligned perfectly….
My plan was to revisit the review of the AIYIMA A07.
My unit was put to good use in my son’s dorm room last year and now resides in his sister’s dorm room at a different university.

…..Then I noticed this review and discussion.
I have zero interest in debating the “regulars” here and hope they can refrain from personal attacks this time…
I have been LISTENING to a pair of the Crimsons for several years.
The measurements are what they are…
It could be years of being exposed to the sound of my drum kits or dialing in the scope on my Weatherby 300 Mag…but these sound wonderful to me… just different than my MC275 VI, CF275 and the Proton D1200 I just restored….
 
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DonR

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The planets must have aligned perfectly….
My plan was to revisit the review of the AIYIMA A07.
My unit was put to good use in my son’s dorm room last year and now resides in his sister’s dorm room at a different university.

…..Then I noticed this review and discussion.
I have zero interest in debating the “regulars” here and hope they can refrain from personal attacks this time…
I have been LISTENING to a pair of the Crimsons for several years.
The measurements are what they are…
It could be years of being exposed to the sound of my drum kits or dialing in the scope on my Weatherby 300 Mag…but these sound wonderful to me… just different than my MC275 VI, CF275 and the Proton D1200 I just restored….
The Pope thinks that a god exists that listens to his prayers.
 

Holmz

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The planets must have aligned perfectly….
My plan was to revisit the review of the AIYIMA A07.
My unit was put to good use in my son’s dorm room last year and now resides in his sister’s dorm room at a different university.
….

What are they studying?



…..Then I noticed this review and discussion.
I have zero interest in debating the “regulars” here and hope they can refrain from personal attacks this time…
I have been LISTENING to a pair of the Crimsons for several years.
The measurements are what they are…
It could be years of being exposed to the sound of my drum kits or dialing in the scope on my Weatherby 300 Mag…but these sound wonderful to me… just different than my MC275 VI, CF275 and the Proton D1200 I just restored….

I liked the AIYAMA enough that I have another after the first one… as does eldest daughter.

Jez - what did you do to attract attacks?
I am not sure starting off with a martyr approach is helpful… Just do the review.
 

Holmz

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I noticed that the fellow look like he is prepared, and already has a boat.
index.php
 

anmpr1

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Are you sure that isn't an oven? With those handles, and the metal front with glass window, it looks like something for a trophy kitchen.
I first saw this sort of thing in China. A way to insert LED and graphics in glass. In bathroom mirrors, mostly. Maybe you can now get them at Home Depot and Lowe's... I don't follow the bathroom mirror scene that closely. I think you can pair your Android phone to the display. Read your messages along with the Sina Weibo blogs while you brush your teeth. Important time saving tasks from gadgets that make modern life worth living.

Surprised Mac hasn't gone this route. It's got to be cheaper than the real thing. Maybe their customers want and need the analog ballistics. Below is a pic. I know everyone likes visuals.
mirror.png
 

anmpr1

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I don’t think you can call it sailing, more like sinking.
I think that for some of us old timers, it's not a happy ending. But it is not an uncommon ending, for sure. I mean, there comes a time when we all have to say and admit that enough is enough. Like Ali or Tyson. Both interesting in their day, they didn't know when to say when, so each wound up embarrassing themselves. Ali with the rope-a-dope, because that's all he could do. Totally boring.

Mike was a bit different, and never boring. In the immortal words of Gordon Solie, he simply turned it into a spectacle, a 'Pier 6 brawl', with Holyfield wearing the 'crimson mask'. I guess an argument can be made for the cleverness of biting off an opponents ear--I don't think that had ever been done before. Although he probably should have waited until Mills had been unintentionally knocked out. In that case, when Mills woke up, Iron Mike would have stood a better chance for a win, or possibly a draw.

Bob? In the twilight of his autumn, he's simply decided on the the rope-a-dope.
 

GXAlan

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RammisFrammis

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Regarding high sensitivity speakers, the use case is somewhat of an oxymoron to me ? Let me explain .
In many cases high sensitivity speakers have a very ragged fr response and a bunch of other issues ( Klipsch, zu ?)
Distortion from your tube amp will be the least of your problems ?

I’ve read tread here where DIY projects seems to have high sensitivity speakers who mitigated those issues but they unsurprisingly includes active overs eq and possibly also class-D or solid state amps ?

The typical hifi speaker has not been developed with sensitivity as an priority for several decades ? When they where it was out of necessity .

You may like these speakers for sounding “dynamic” or “alive” and “interesting” I’ve heard some, but in the end prefered “normal” speakers.
High sensitivity speakers do tend to have more ragged frequency response especially if they are horns and they tend to trade low frequency extension for efficiency in the bass. Because of this, active crossovers are almost mandatory so that EQ can be inserted into the feed for individual drivers and subwoofers cure the low frequency limitation. Using EQ to tailor frequency response is not limited to high sensitivity speakers since many (most) speakers to this day which use passive crossovers and those that use DSP use EQ to tailor frequency response and voice the speaker to the house sound of the manufacturer.

There has been a shift in speaker sensitivity over the decades toward less efficiency and this was predominant in the 70s and beyond. This is because with solid state amplifiers, power was plentiful and relatively cheap compared to tubes.

High efficiency horn speakers do usually sound more dynamic and alive for reasons which people here debate endlessly. Whether they do sound more dynamic and alive or not at all is also debated here with no apparent resolution.

I have full range horns (Klipsch La Scala) and it is obvious to my ears that they sound more dynamic and alive than any conventional cone 'n dome speaker I have ever heard. People here will debate endlessly whether it is all in my mind or if I'm crazy or not but I have yet to see any of them in my listening room to hear for themselves. The high end audiophile tweakos will debate whether I'm using the correct speaker cables.
 
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