Can you hear a smartphone DAC? Well can you PUNK?

[Blumlein 88]

EDIT to ADD: I made available again the files for this. Thought maybe some newer members might want to try it. I'm not reopening the poll, but you can download these files and decide which of them is from a Smartphone. Yes recorded from a Nexus 6P headphone jack.


Simpler setup this time.

Download this zip file and it will open a folder with three 30 second snippets of a Fiona Apple song. Two are the original digital files and one is the recording of a Nexus 6P. So pick the odd man out. Once downloaded you could do this in 5 minutes or so.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/vitsuzsosick8o8/Fiona Apple smartphone.zip?dl=0

Here is the entire Fiona Apple song on youtube.

Alternatively you can download this Hyperion Knight solo piano playing a bit of Mussorgsky. Recorded by Wilson Audio using all Spectral electronics.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/kfbuem0xiy86gef/Hyperion%20Knight%20smartphone.zip?dl=0

You can purchase the hirez version of Pictures at an Exhibition by Knight here:
http://www.prostudiomasters.com/album/page/4691

 

[NorthSky]

It's a Clint Eastwood's line.

 

[Blumlein 88]

It's a Clint Eastwood's line.

I could have tried to use something from Play Misty for Me.

 

[NorthSky]

 

[Blumlein 88]

There was a mistake in the download files. If you have already down loaded them, do so again for the corrected versions.

 

[Blumlein 88]

So the poll closed without a single vote. Wow. Okay though of no interest to anyone on the forum:

Only click on the spoiler if you wish to see the answer to which file is the smartphone.

Spoiler

I will reveal that file B was the smartphone.

The phone has an SNR of about 75 db. A tiny response droop at the low end (which probably isn't meaningful with 99% of music). It has distortion around -90 db which is inaudible. It has an interesting frequency response. It is almost fully flat until right about 15 khz. It then rolls off to -10 db by 20 khz. Likely uses one of those half band reconstruction filters. This also is likely inaudible to the mostly middle-age clientele of the audiophile world.

 

[RayDunzl]

No Votes on two tests...

That's an interesting data point.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Yes I would call it an unintentional poll on polls. So the answer is no more polls.

Thanks for you helping me fix the original files Ray.

 

[Phelonious Ponk]

Yes I would call it an unintentional poll on polls. So the answer is no more polls.

Thanks for you helping me fix the original files Ray.

Or, like I said in the other poll, maybe people listened but didn't respond because they couldn't tell a difference.

Tim

 

[amirm]

OK, this is another tough comparison but can be passed:

It requires good high frequency hearing though. I had to keep blowing my congested ears open to distinguish. I could keep going but I ran out of breath doing that .

Thanks for doing these tests. I hope more people listen.

I am not voting because I don't know the identity of the files. The difference I heard was slightly different high frequency reproduction and soundstage depth/width. Very subtle but it is there.

 

[amirm]

So the poll closed without a single vote. Wow. Okay though of no interest to anyone on the forum:

Only click on the spoiler if you wish to see the answer to which file is the smartphone.

Spoiler

I will reveal that file B was the smartphone.

The phone has an SNR of about 75 db. A tiny response droop at the low end (which probably isn't meaningful with 99% of music). It has distortion around -90 db which is inaudible. It has an interesting frequency response. It is almost fully flat until right about 15 khz. It then rolls off to -10 db by 20 khz. Likely uses one of those half band reconstruction filters. This also is likely inaudible to the mostly middle-age clientele of the audiophile world.

Oh, I didn't notice you had already posted this.

 

[Blumlein 88]

Yes I am able to hear this one unsighted as well. But it is quite difficult. It is the only one of these files I posted which are reliably heard by me. And I don't think the differences are enough it would in any meaningful way impact my musical enjoyment. Were I younger it might a little bit.

So if a DAC with this poor a performance is barely an impediment when used with high quality gear it was never meant for how likely is it any of the competent though affordable DACs are any kind of an impediment versus any DAC you want to compare?

 

[amirm]

It is a pretty damning evidence that only high-end DACs sound good.

 

[RayDunzl]

Two are the original digital files and one is the recording of a Nexus 6P.

The difference I heard was slightly different high frequency reproduction and soundstage depth/width. Very subtle but it is there.

It is a pretty damning evidence that only high-end DACs sound good.

@amirm: I'm pretty dense sometimes, but what is the logical basis for that conclusion?

 

[amirm]

By audiophile rules, the phone should have sounded horrible, making the test trivial to pass. But it was not. The gap between the worst and best is quite small.

 

[Blumlein 88]

It is a pretty damning evidence that only high-end DACs sound good.

Maybe Ray is responding to what you posted when I think what you intended was "It is a pretty damning evidence against the idea that only high end DACs sound good".

 

[Blumlein 88]

I made the files to this available again. Thought maybe it would be of interest to people who weren't reading these forums back in 2016. Surely you can hear a smartphone headphone output vs the original, right?

Post your comments here and don't cheat by looking at the spoiler.

 

[BillG]

So if a DAC with this poor a performance is barely an impediment...

Except the 6P's DAC, while not spectacular, isn't really that poor of a performer:

https://www.gsmarena.com/huawei_nexus_6p-review-1355p7.php

 

[Blumlein 88]

Except the 6P's DAC, while not spectacular, isn't really that poor of a performer:

View attachment 38971

https://www.gsmarena.com/huawei_nexus_6p-review-1355p7.php

Those specs are optimistic versus what I measured.

 

[majingotan]

I don't have the "training" or "golden ears" but I know what sounds good to me or not subjectively. So without any critical listening training and just pretty much listening like a common guy would listen to good music, A and B are extremely, extremely hard to tell apart. A had an extremely tiny bit inflection that sets it apart from B. C sounds like A but if I quick A/B, between B and C, I can't tell them apart. In any case, even with my casual ears, I can't tell the difference with absolute certainty between A/B/C. If I put it to numbers the difference between A and B is 0.1% certainty meaning if I A/B A and B, I'd get 1/1000 chance that I'm not guessing. and B and C is 0% certainty that I can differentiate between the two. That just means that Nexus 6P's ADC is beyond my hearing capability to tell them apart.