Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

[welsh]

I think the default ASR member is actively irritated by the growth of LP sales, and there is an obvious excess of promotion of the format in mass media---films, TV, commercials. It's supposed to be a signifier of a closer attachment to music, though it usually devolves into hoarding. However, as a sensory experience it's got more going on than streaming the same stuff.

My current POV is that we are living in a very science-fictiony world these days. I remember Azimov's story about a computer network that grew so great, it became God. He positioned the sort of computing power we now have as happening 300 years later than it did in reality [kinda like how "Idiocracy" worked out in real time]. There's a good chance you've got the equivalent of a 1990 Cray in your pocket. Previously unimagined computational power is now commonplace, boring, a place for pictures of cats and irrational political screeds. It no longer has 'glamor', it is a common appliance.

Wouldn't it be nice to return to a time when Big Brother with a smiley face [Zuckerberg? Bezos?] wasn't ruling our lives? So a return to the sounds of the seventies can dial back the sense that the internet is creeping into every element of our lives. Listening to something that isn't hooked up to the internet is reward enough for many.

I posted a scene from the "Royal Tannenbaums" earlier in this thread, but I'm sure no one noticed. Brother and sister, in a tent, inside a house. There's a crappy little record player, the kind used in elementary school, tracks heavy, doesn't sound all that great. But it's a little thing in a little place, playing "Ruby Tuesday" in the background as the two speak of suicide attempts and secret love. It all seems so close and personal. It triggers emotions related to having this small voice in a cozy chamber.

Check out the turntable in the rich couple’s house raided by Alex and his droogs in A Clockwork Orange…

 

[welsh]

Right. I got rid of my LPs soon after getting a good guitar. Changed my relationship to music completely.

But… my LP IS a good guitar - are you one of those Gibson haters?

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

In addition to the many explanations layed down, and the many others sure to come, two things are infinite, as far as we know: the universe and human stupidity.

Then simply don't get into vinyl, and please don't imply that those who do are 'stupid'. Thank you and have a nice day.

 

[welsh]

You'll take QWERTY from my dead, cramped hands!

And yet QWERTY is not the most efficient possible keyboard format. It was originally designed to SLOW DOWN typists so that the keys wouldn’t jam so often. Look at an old Linotype machine for an alternative.

 

[F1308]

Then simply don't get into vinyl, and please don't imply that those who do are 'stupid'. Thank you and have a nice day.

I don't imply what you clearly stated.
I do say experts said human stupidity is one of the things out there being infinite for sure.
Now go using it as you wished.

 

[IPunchCholla]

I don't imply what you clearly stated.
I do say experts said human stupidity is one of the things out there being infinite for sure.
Now go using it as you wished.

Moron.

I’m not calling you one, just typing the word for no particular reason in a reply to you.

 

[levimax]

Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

In addition to the many explanations layed down, and the many others sure to come, two things are infinite, as far as we know: the universe and human stupidity.

Yea it is pretty stupid to have a system that is limited to only being able to play digital and say it is some how better than a system that can play both vinyl and digital.

 

[MakeMineVinyl]

Yea it is pretty stupid to have a system that is limited to only being able to play digital and say it is some how better than a system that can play both vinyl and digital.

"Everybody" knows that any system which cannot play analog tape is stupid. Stupid. Stupid. Stupid.

 

[JP]

And yet QWERTY is not the most efficient possible keyboard format. It was originally designed to SLOW DOWN typists so that the keys wouldn’t jam so often. Look at an old Linotype machine for an alternative.

"The myth of the intentionally awkward QWERTY has been repeated by authorities from The New York Timesto Encyclopedia Britannica, but there's really no evidence for it. As design writer Jimmy Stamp pointed out in Smithsonian in 2013, if you were trying to avoid jams from commonly paired letters, why would you leave E and R adjacent, since the "er" and "re" combinations are among the most common in English? "As" and "ed/de" have the same problem. Stamp cites a 2011 Japanese study finding that the QWERTY layout can't be explained as a response to typewriter mechanics at all. Instead, it's a relic of the keyboard's first use: transcribing Morse code. The Kyoto researchers argue that telegraph operators shaped our modern keyboard, by grouping the letters involved in commonly confused Morse signals and thereby resolving ambiguities more easily."

https://www.woot.com/blog/post/the-debunker-was-the-qwerty-keyboard-designed-to-slow-down-typists-1

 

[antcollinet]

Moron.

I’m not calling you one, just typing the word for no particular reason in a reply to you.

 

[egellings]

Nice birdie!

 

[atmasphere]

1) Clicks, pops and ‘vinyl roar’ from the plastic groove. Especially good fun when you know that the click/pop is about to happen.
2) The quality of information per second worsens as the stylus traverses the spiral groove. This makes vinyl the worst choice for what is loosely called ‘classical’ music, as climactic crescendoes are usually found next to the dead wax. There’s a reason that classic rock albums often have a ballad at the end of a side.
3) Almost no LPs have a spindle hole that is actually central. I cannot listen to piano music on vinyl, as I am sensitive to pitch wobble. Speed stability is dodgy even on super-expensive turntables.
4) Deep, powerful bass has to be summed to mono on LPs, lest the stylus jump out of the groove.
5) Both the record and your stylus wear with every play. Some stylus tips are significantly degraded after 500 hours.
6) Like a stopped clock, cartridge alignment can only be correct twice across the record surface. Linear-tracking arms have their own problems.
7) Pickup cartridges require huge amplification, resulting in noise.
8) Almost all LPs are warped to some degree (making a mockery of audiophools who like to adjust vertical tracking angle).
9) Terrible channel separation.
10) All pick-up cartridges have massively rising distortion above 10KHZ.
11) Many converts to vinyl are buying albums created from digital files, delivering the worst of both worlds. And at £20-30…
12) The only plus point is that 12” album art is big enough to be effective.

1) poorly designed phono sections can generate ticks and pops on their own due to poor high frequency overload margins. The overload is on account of electrical resonance above the audio band. This is an endemic problem- more often than not!
2) Variable groove spacing solved this issue back in the 1970s. If you have a decent pickup, no worries.
3) This sounds anecdotal. I can count on one hand the LPs I've encountered with this problem and wowing variable speed can give me nausea...
4) This is a non-issue. The fact is in nearly any room, bass below 80Hz is entirely reverberant, owing to the waveform being 14 feet long or more. I found that if you simply spent time with the project to sort out how to cut out of phase bass, no processing was needed- processing is used as a time saver.
5) Can't argue with this, although FWIW I have LPs that I played in my youth back in the 1970s that still play just fine.
6) If set up right distortion due to this issue is quite minimal, something no-one seems to hear or complain about.
7) Depends on the cartridge; strain gauge cartridges can be equalized and run into an Auxilary input, requiring no additional amplification. If you amplify MM or LOMC cartridges using differential gain stages, lower noise can be realized.
8) This sounds anecdotal as well. Anedotally, I rarely run into warped LPs; they tend to be years apart.
9) 35dB isn't bad- that means that one channel can be 1000x higher than the other.
10) This statement is false; likely the experience of someone who didn't do the setup right. It would be more correct to say that setup of a cartridge is its Achilles heel.
11) FWIW, when we would master an LP from a digital source we always requested a source file lacking the usual DSP, in particular compression. This results in a more lively sounding recording since most digital releases are compressed to get over road noise in a car. Its an industry thing; this means that LPs are often more dynamic.
12) It is indeed.

 

[clearnfc]

The Harman curve (& other suggestions) are a great starting point for adjustments because you have a base that is the starting point. It eliminates a lot of trial & error. Perhaps even a life time of trying different things to get the sound the way you perceive it should be.

Sometimes, the real fun is in the journey, not the destination. Of course, this depends on individual. Not everyone likes to explore and try out new and different things, some prefer to simply get right to the answer and be done with it.

I am just trying to say that there exist a group of people out there not trying to make the sound "sounded right". They just want to try different things and experience the differences themselves.

 

[pseudoid]

Sometimes, the real fun is in the journey, not the destination.

Some bearded old man at some tall mountain would reply: "Cancel the latter; if you can't have the former!"
But he don't get WiFi where he is...

 

[Newman]

Oh I just saw this thread.....

I say it many times, whats measures best (best in terms of score) need not sound best to the listener. Different pple have different preferences, just like some prefer neutral, flat FR, some wants more bass, some more mids etc etc....

Even when it comes to things like minute details, distortion etc... Some likes it more, some likes it less. So, some pple will like the way vinyl or tube sounds etc etc...

This is not about what is better or worse, its about personal preferences.

And I say it many times, in response, please buy and read Sound Reproduction by Dr Floyd E Toole. He addresses this assumption that we all have unique preferences in sound reproduction, and shows, through carefully controlled listening tests, that we actually don’t.

It’s a real eye-opener. Your assumptions, put to the test, don’t pass.

 

[aslan7]

I listen to a lot of classical music that was recorded from the 1950s through the 1970s. When this material was reissued on CD most of it had a rather unpleasant sound compared to the LPs. Mercury Living Presence recordings are a good example of this phenomenon. Of course the CD format was much more convenient in a multitude of ways. Later, and more modern digital recordings on labels like Channel Classics sound better than anything. So for me having a turntable is useful and also a great deal of fun. Also, I love those big booklets and jackets with LPs that you can actually sit down and read. I hate jewel cases also.

 

[Newman]

I listen to a lot of classical music that was recorded from the 1950s through the 1970s. When this material was reissued on CD most of it had a rather unpleasant sound compared to the LPs. Mercury Living Presence recordings are a good example of this phenomenon.

According to Wilma Cozart Fine, who made the original MLP recordings and LP masters, the CDs of her recordings “the CDs got closer to the master tape than the vinyl ever could”. link

So, your opinion is 100% the opposite of what seems to be fact.

 

[600_OHM]

Funny - a buddy of mine when CD's first came out I found him complaining of how hard it was to wipe his Discwasher over them.

I sold him my piezo static-gun to put some clicks back IN!

 

[levimax]

According to Wilma Cozart Fine, who made the original MLP recordings and LP masters, the CDs of her recordings “the CDs got closer to the master tape than the vinyl ever could”. link

So, your opinion is 100% the opposite of what seems to be fact.

If you are selling a new box set where you get royalties of course you are not going to say that the originals were better and you will say that the new box set is better. While what Wilma says may be true, self serving marketing oriented comments can't be take to be "proof" of anything.

 

[Chrispy]

If you are selling a new box set where you get royalties of course you are not going to say that the originals were better and you will say that the new box set is better. While what Wilma says may be true, self serving marketing oriented comments can't be take to be "proof" of anything.

Still, I'd take that over the usual "audiophile" opinion....