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Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

There is certainly a lot you can play around with in a record player with the cartridge setup being the biggest.
Changing the tracking weight within the working range should not really change the cartridge sound if it has a linear magnetic circuit but the traditional layout sensor layout does not have a linear magnetic circuit, so changing tracking force moves the sensing element into a slightly different location within this non-consistent magnetic circuit and changes the response. Big variations can cause bad non linearities, high distortion and record damage but around the "spec" range you are just adjusting the FR.

On top of that cartridges vary a huge amoun't, the ones with a flat and even frequency response, like the Shure V15 went out of fashion when reassuringly expensive hand made boutique offerings were all the rage.
I mentioned how rich Koetsus sound. They are very rolled off as are some others.
By chance I was at a birthday party on Saturday and one of my old mates told me he had just sent his Audio Technica ART something-or-other for service and fitted his old Koetsu Urushi and was was eulogising about having forgotten how gorgeous it was...

Not surprising there is a diffenence eh!?
I gather the Urushi was one of the 'flatter' ones as well..... I go back much further and the original 'Red' was basically a tamed 'loudness switch.' I was offered a low-hours original Onyx once and, rather than losing top, it smothered fine details as well as surface noise, almost as if there was a mechanical version of a noise-gate in operation. No idea on a practical level, but I can only share how I *perceived* its sonic abilities. I keep my Decca Gold Microscanner in the vain hope I'll have a tonearm worthy and able to carry it again, as back then, it was the closest I'd ever heard vinyl sound to master and CD (it committed suicide, or tried to, as Deccas do, even new ones apparently, but I had it properly repaired and last I used it, it was magic in my mostly digitally based system). Great decks, those Notts Analogue ones, largely ignored by the UK Linn/bling crowd, yet so much better if you *know* how a recording should sound... I had a wonderful single-bod's rig in the early 90s and basically gave it all up for a total life change and eventual fatherhood. I wouldn't change that, but do miss it, especially these days in retirement when the speakers I loved now sell for twenty four grand the pair and the current version of the deck and arm is ten grand or so without checking.

Thee Decca 06 2009 avatar.JPG
Thee Decca 1.JPG
 
Newman (IME) also has a long history of misprepresenting what others say (I'm sure he will disagree with me). It is one of the reasons I can't see his post above.
Nice, lol. Say a lie and cover your ears. I doubt that is what the mods call 'constructive dialogue'.
 
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I keep my Decca Gold Microscanner in the vain hope I'll have a tonearm worthy and able to carry it again, as back then, it was the closest I'd ever heard vinyl sound to master and CD (it committed suicide, or tried to, as Deccas do, even new ones apparently, but I had it properly repaired and last I used it, it was magic in my mostly digitally based system)
Now that's interesting. My current cartridge (sadly too many hours on the clock and no budget to refresh), is a VDH tipped Decca Gold. It's in a RB300 on a Townsend Rock. The combination sounds close to CD and master tape. It doesn't sound like the (I'm not scared to say it) overly "rich" Linn sound that was the fashion when I bought it. Exposure to music studios and analogue and digital mastertapes meant that I found most LP-based systems of the 80s and 90s too downward sloping compared to the real thing.
 
but sonically, I don't find valid reasons
If you were to re-read the post of mine you have just now quoted, you'd find we are in agreement..
If we were talking only about sound quality I'd agree. For many people here, that is not the only topic.

But that has nothing at all to do with digital or analogue mastering. Digital mastering is just a more accurate way of getting the produced master to the cutting lathe compared with analogue tape of old. Analogue tape masters bring nothing of benefit to the vinyl format, except where they are the only form of master that exists. And even then transporting the signal from wherever that tape is located via a digital recording to the cutting lathe - loses NOTHING of the 'analogue' quality of that analogue master - just to answer the post someone made about MOFI up there ^^^ somewhere.
 
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Nice, lol. Say a lie and cover your ears.

Except Antcollinet is correct. It’s no Strawman. Your history of
misrepresenting people is well documented throughout this and other threads.

HERE. For one of countless examples.

And in particular your strange compendium of
people mentioning “warmth” of vinyl is shown to be misleading if people actually go into the quotes. For instance, you’re misleading use of my comment here which you have never retracted

I doubt that is what the mods call 'constructive dialogue'.

If you are concerned about constructive dialogue, may I suggest you hold yourself to the same standard? That would be really helpful.

Example, Characterizing me as anti-science, Abusing logic, Smoking keyboards…

More declaring to the crowd that I’m a science denier:

The second applies to people with limited understanding and who have been sucked in by Kool-aid merchants, effectively becoming reality deniers aka science deniers, and who think they are educating people by endless argumentation and obfuscation. Hello Matt.

And everyone’s favourite, warning that I am a “ general menace.”

A good debating team captain never tires of his or her mission, and indeed draws greatest pleasure from being given the incorrect side of an assertion to argue, and using every trick of the trade to 'win at all costs', whether it be via smoking keyboards, verbosity, eloquence, indefatigability, insinuation, personableness and amicability, vast repetition...the true debating champion is admirable in a way, but a genuine menace when unleashed into discussions of fact, especially science.

I’m curious Newman does that look like
“ constructive dialogue” to you?

Wouldn’t, you know, actual dialogue… in which you communicate back-and-forth with somebody rather than produce reams of warning posts… be more constructive?

Just a thought.
 
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Now that's interesting. My current cartridge (sadly too many hours on the clock and no budget to refresh), is a VDH tipped Decca Gold. It's in a RB300 on a Townsend Rock. The combination sounds close to CD and master tape. It doesn't sound like the (I'm not scared to say it) overly "rich" Linn sound that was the fashion when I bought it. Exposure to music studios and analogue and digital mastertapes meant that I found most LP-based systems of the 80s and 90s too downward sloping compared to the real thing.
The Microscanner version, is a ruler flat response line to 16kHz or so, the resonances below 20kHz which plague lower Deccas seemingly lifted above 20kHz according to HiFi Choice tests done in the 80s (look them up). The reviewer was hugely in the mid 80s Linn 'Fruitbox with Ittok and Karma' camp and had at the time a Naim driven active Isobarik system, so the whole shebang would have been a very different tonal quality to the Decca.

Digital playback was the best thing that happened to vinyl reproduction I feel, as pickups started to lose the upper response dips, the turntables and especially knowledge of their siting requirements generally improved and the later Linn LP12 decks with expensive but fresh bearings, stronger sub-chassis' and beefed up plinths where it matters, 'sound' almost nothing like the phat fruity tones of yesteryear... the slight 'sexy' musical feel remains though, until the top plate is replaced by a solid one, upon which I'm going to suggest it almost certainly 'sounds' more like like a Technics or top Rega, which sell at a fraction of the new top spec LP12+arm price... - I've not done the comparison, but it wouldn't surprise me, the way things are :D
 
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Adding my two cents to almost five hundred pages about the vinyl renaissance:

Whenever I listen to music that I had (and still have) in vinyl, I exactly know at what moment the hiss, the tick, the scratch, the pop or whatever problem started on that vinyl record. When I hear music performed at a concert hall, I remember, and can even anticipate, the point where my LP-version had a problem.
I hear perfect quality digitally remastered audio and know exactly where there was this slight whining sound in my not-perfectly-flat LP.

Even after thirty years without listening to vinyl it haunts me.
The horror, the horror...

I used top-quality cartridges with specially designed elliptical 3rd party diamonds, a record player with a massive turntable, I experimented with wet playing (the LP, not me), I used special silicon-like materials to get dust out of the groove, carbon-fiber brushes for the LP and the diamond, and suffered having to turn my LP every twenty minutes rather than being able to listen to a whole concert.

Never ever again!
If I want to relive my vinyl experience I can light my fireplace while playing digital recordings.

The only aspect of vinyl that I miss are the large covers and insides with photos and stories, but there are several plugins to media players that are getting close.
 
Adding my two cents to almost five hundred pages about the vinyl renaissance:

Whenever I listen to music that I had (and still have) in vinyl, I exactly know at what moment the hiss, the tick, the scratch, the pop or whatever problem started on that vinyl record. When I hear music performed at a concert hall, I remember, and can even anticipate, the point where my LP-version had a problem.
I hear perfect quality digitally remastered audio and know exactly where there was this slight whining sound in my not-perfectly-flat LP.

Even after thirty years without listening to vinyl it haunts me.
The horror, the horror...

I used top-quality cartridges with specially designed elliptical 3rd party diamonds, a record player with a massive turntable, I experimented with wet playing (the LP, not me), I used special silicon-like materials to get dust out of the groove, carbon-fiber brushes for the LP and the diamond, and suffered having to turn my LP every twenty minutes rather than being able to listen to a whole concert.

Never ever again!
If I want to relive my vinyl experience I can light my fireplace while playing digital recordings.

The only aspect of vinyl that I miss are the large covers and insides with photos and stories, but there are several plugins to media players that are getting close.

Your aversion to vinyl seems 100% reasonable to me! I totally get it.

You’ve brought up memories of listening to records when I was young - favourite records that developed a skip or a very loud pop at one point or another, and those became engrained in my memory with the music. Listening to the record, always mentally anticipating that skip or pop, and first hearing it on CD, there was still some of that mental anticipation until it went away.

(which is one reason I’m not a fan of record noise in general, and so I try and buy records in as good condition as possible, and maintain that)
 
Which plugins do you like?
That's a complete new thread, Newman.
Great Question. Don't get me started on this highly frustrating topic...

I've tested dozens of media players to find one that does what I want, which is finding an album from a large series just based on the cover.
I've tried every possible way of restructuring the tags of my audio collection to make it fit the silly 'Album', 'Artist' etc structure that players use, and realized that they are less than useful. I want to select music from my library just like selecting a book from a bookshelf (that's also the fun of having beautiful cover art!).

Example: I have a bookshelf dedicated to architecture, and can immediate pick the book I want based on its cover (and position within the shelf), without needing to know that it was e.g. Lloyd Wright or Le Corbusier, and without having to figure out if I needed to look under 'C' or 'L' or 'W'.
In album-based book libraries, I would probably find the 'Corbusier album' near 'Christie, Agatha' which obviously have nothing to do with each other.
In the music library they'd be in a different Genre, but it would be up to me to figure out every time what type of filter I would need to find the right track.
Total waste of time.

My collection is modest: 20,000 tracks in 1,500 albums, but it is impossible to browse all these on a smartphone or tablet, so I have structured them into 250 top-level folders that I use for top-down browsing.

In e.g. a Frederic Chopin folder (under 'F' rather than 'C' because I want it that way) there is an Etudes folder that has a dozen different performers. With an Album/Artist filter approach I would never be able to find these performers together (unless doing a complete overhaul of my library by creating playlists for every folder, which will take weeks).

In my view, the library view should be able to follow the user preference, not the other way around.

I do not want to remember the name 'Kjartan Sveinsson' late in the evening after having had a beer.
I want to pick the black cover of his album within e.g. a 'Contemporary Music' folder that I could have immediately found in my CD-cabinet, above the 'Modern Jazz' shelf.
If I am looking for an Alberto Ginastera track I don't want to type it in or get albums with his piano music if I'm looking for ELPs Brain Salad Surgery album cover drawn by Swiss 'Alien' artist Giger.

After testing all these different players, even those I found with help from ChatGPT, I settled for the Music Folder structure of LMS on the Pi4. It doesn't allow the type of selection that I want, but it is fairly easy to select one of my 250 top-levels folders and do the cover art selection at the level below. I have eliminated all other selection options. There's a Material Skin on the LMS that looks better, but the developer told me he couldn't implement my artwork selection at the top level due to LMS limitations.

The only players that do a better job run on Windows and Apple: WMP, iTunes, and few others.
If you let WMP manage your folder structure it will stack the cover art it finds within that folder at the top level. That is a major step forward.
Adding that capability to the likes of Roon, Foobar, Volumio, Moode, Cantate, Strawberry, Clementine, or other funny fruit players would be a piece of cake for a software developer, but for whatever reason they have not seen the light or weren't born in a age where you still selected music yourself rather than having an algorithm do that for you.

In coming weeks I will add an i7 NUC (= boxed mini-PC) that is entirely designed for audio, and a 'to be decided' stand-alone DAC, to see if WMP actually does a better job.
If not, I will continue to harass challenge :) the designers of many other media players to create an user-oriented GUI rather than IDtag-oriented.
 

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Could it be that she knows that you have / listen to different music on vinyl than on digital sources and possibly what music that is? And it would have been the same if that (beautifull old Decca) records would have been digitalized?
Yes, Linda knows that I listen to digital and LPs and FM Radio. She can tell when I listen to FM, but she really does not know whether I'm listening to LPs or digital. Linda only listens to music as a backdrop for something else that she's doing at the time. She can hear my music as I play it while she sits reading a book in the living room about 10 meters away. Linda does not have critical listening skills.
These are the reasons why I was so very surprised.

I have digitized (using Audacity) some of the older Decca LPs I have, all classical or opera. The digital file sounds identical to to the LP. If I filter for pops and renormalize, I have a great digital album. However, if the CD or digital file was mastered by someone else, the CD or digital file inevitably sounds different, often worse (IMHO) than the LP. It all comes down to the mastering skills of the tech that cuts the master.
 
However, if the CD or digital file was mastered by someone else, the CD or digital file inevitably sounds different, often worse (IMHO) than the LP. It all comes down to the mastering skills of the tech that cuts the master.
Please can you use DeltaWave by @pkane to compare your needledrop file with the CD and/or digital file and share the results here?
 
I did not find this one yet in this thread:
A great way to enjoy the vinyl sound using a digital source is this Abbey Road Vinyl Plugin.
It allows you to add all the wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects that make vinyl so unique. :D
(You will need to add the Waves pro audio software first.)
 
I did not find this one yet in this thread:
A great way to enjoy the vinyl sound using a digital source is this Abbey Road Vinyl Plugin.
It allows you to add all the wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects that make vinyl so unique. :D
(You will need to add the Waves pro audio software first.)
You seem to think that for ASRs, using vinyl is about sound...

I have the full monty Waves package - not once I have used the vinyl or tape hiss plugins for anything. Spend most of my time with Arturia stuff (full monty package as well).
 
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I did not find this one yet in this thread:
A great way to enjoy the vinyl sound using a digital source is this Abbey Road Vinyl Plugin.
It allows you to add all the wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects that make vinyl so unique. :D
(You will need to add the Waves pro audio software first.)
The one thing that unites all of the vinyl users on ASR is a determination to avoid any audible wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects. :p
 
The one thing that unites all of the vinyl users on ASR is a determination to avoid any audible wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects. :p
...while also avoiding the obvious, cheap solution! :cool:
 
The one thing that unites all of the vinyl users on ASR is a determination to avoid any audible wow & flutter, hiss, clicks, pops, and turntable defects. :p
Made me smile!

But perhaps this is an ASR goal. Given that people still but vinyl and turntables, perhaps this thread should focus on what is the best practice for minimising the downsides. Examples include record cleanliness; ideal high-pass filter settings; minimum preamplifier overload margins; best stylus profiles; cartridge alignment; minimising wow and flutter; controlling resonances. Simply, everything that can be done to minimise vinyl's inherent limitations.
 
Made me smile!

But perhaps this is an ASR goal. Given that people still but vinyl and turntables, perhaps this thread should focus on what is the best practice for minimising the downsides. Examples include record cleanliness; ideal high-pass filter settings; minimum preamplifier overload margins; best stylus profiles; cartridge alignment; minimising wow and flutter; controlling resonances. Simply, everything that can be done to minimise vinyl's inherent limitations.
Taping a nickel on the tonearm cartridge headshell helped with skipping issues. /sarc
 
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