Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

[deweydm]

WTF indeed, you are way off point and making false accusations that should be retracted.

Gotta keep this a safe space to belittle the youngsters, maybe even question their literacy. I suggest you use the ignore function. I will be.

 

[antcollinet]

Good spot. It's easy to lose sight of just how little these 'revivals' are really about the music or literature itself. Even the participants don't seem to realise it. Your article, at least for now, contains a sidebar link to another article called 'Reading is so sexy': gen Z turns to physical books and libraries. Sexy, cool, hip: call this aspect what you will. And at the bottom of the 'sexy' article, we find the following:

View attachment 398105

That's right: don't forget to get the T-shirt and baseball cap for your book or vinyl fetish. Not so many of the vinyl guys will go for the tote bag, I'm guessing, but I don't want to judge. Maybe for you we have the coloured vinyl set of Taylor Swift's latest album? Or the 50th anniversary remaster of whatever was hot in 1974? Merch merch merch, it's all merch and we're all marks.

cheers

While you're both sneering at gan-z and their physical books, perhaps you'd like to think about the relative fidelity between digital and physical book delivery. Is there a difference? Perhaps think about images in the books - on paper, compared with kindle.

BTW I am a dedicated kindle user. Can't stand the page turning and heft and needing-a-light-on and having to live with whatever print size is involved with physical books. But that's just me. (And Mrs AC when it comes to the light ) I'd like to like physical books. I love the romance of them. But I don't.

 

[drmevo]

And here we go again. A bookstore resurgence story in Guardian:

‘I love the whole atmosphere and can spend hours browsing’: how did bookshops suddenly become cool?

A new survey suggests that young people are shunning AI algorithms and online retailers to experience the joy of visiting bookshops

www.theguardian.com

All the formulaic elements of vinyl or film photography revival story are firmly in place, only the wording has changed a little. Even crate digging is actually there:

Yes, Emily, but do you actually like reading?

And of course, you will find the obligatory "deeper connection" here, too:

Why do you find the article so worthy of mockery? Is it such a surprise people like to leave their homes, and, you know, do stuff out in the world? And that people like having physical collections of things and not just digital collections?

 

[Newman]

While you're both sneering at gan-z and their physical books,

Stop being ridiculous. Are you deliberately on a path to misrepresent my opinions and posts? I ask because I see a trend emerging where you totally misrepresent my views by selectively misunderstanding my use of terminology in a way that is entirely derogatory towards me and, I assure you, completely inaccurate.

For the record I have zero issues with Gen Z or any other 'gen', and I exclusively read physical books.

So take my advice and STOP IT. If you are left wondering from my posts what my underlying opinions are, check in with me and we can discuss it. It's not hard.

thank you

 

[Shiva]

No lateral offset angle on that cartridge?

Don't know the mechanics of that tonearm, but it is interesting.

 

[MattHooper]

And here we go again. A bookstore resurgence story in Guardian:

‘I love the whole atmosphere and can spend hours browsing’: how did bookshops suddenly become cool?

A new survey suggests that young people are shunning AI algorithms and online retailers to experience the joy of visiting bookshops

www.theguardian.com

All the formulaic elements of vinyl or film photography revival story are firmly in place, only the wording has changed a little. Even crate digging is actually there:

Yes, Emily, but do you actually like reading?

And of course, you will find the obligatory "deeper connection" here, too:

Good spot. It's easy to lose sight of just how little these 'revivals' are really about the music or literature itself. Even the participants don't seem to realise it. Your article, at least for now, contains a sidebar link to another article called 'Reading is so sexy': gen Z turns to physical books and libraries. Sexy, cool, hip: call this aspect what you will. And at the bottom of the 'sexy' article, we find the following:

View attachment 398105

That's right: don't forget to get the T-shirt and baseball cap for your book or vinyl fetish. Not so many of the vinyl guys will go for the tote bag, I'm guessing, but I don't want to judge. Maybe for you we have the coloured vinyl set of Taylor Swift's latest album? Or the 50th anniversary remaster of whatever was hot in 1974? Merch merch merch, it's all merch and we're all marks.

cheers

What is puzzling to me, and others as well clearly, is the obvious disdain that comes through as you discuss such stories.

There’s no obvious reason why.

I mean, it’s an obvious fact of human experience that our perception, experience, and engagement with something can be affected by any number of factors. Someone may find it a more profound experience to be actually holding and reading their grandfather’s war correspondence to his wife, holding the actual letters in their hand, rather than reading it in an email.

Many people may find all sorts of qualities about a real book more compelling or engaging than a digital version. (I just had the opportunity to order a book either on Kindle or hardcover, but I felt “ this one I want on hardcover, I want the actual book and the richer experience it will give me).

Many people like to get out of the house, and congregate and places with other people who share their interest, like bookstores (our record stores). The people in those articles are expressing things that really bring them value and engagement.

So the question is: why do you guys look upon this negatively as you clearly do?

“ obligatory” “ formulaic elements”.

The participants don’t realize what they are really doing in these revivals, but Newman does. “Merch merch merch, it's all merch and we're all marks.”

It’s just odd to see this disdainful take on the pleasures other people in such articles are getting out of going to bookstores, reading real books (or going to record stores, playing records).

 

[MattHooper]

WTF indeed, you are way off point and making false accusations that should be retracted.

If false claims about what somebody else wrote should be retracted, here is a wonderful chance to practice what you preach.

You could start by Retracting your lie discussed in this post.

Lead by example?

Cheers.

 

[restorer-john]

It’s just odd to see this disdainful take on the pleasures other people in such articles are getting out of going to bookstores, reading real books (or going to record stores, playing records).

It's grumpy old man syndrome.

 

[mppix]

Any effort that tempts gen-z with book reading is a probably worth pursuing. Likewise, anything that emphasizes consuming music outside of autogenerated spotify playlists is also good.

 

[KEM]

No lateral offset angle on that cartridge?

Yeah. I looked at the setup a bit closer. In my mind, I rotated the arm toward the spindle. It seems that there is negative or zero overhang, which rules out all of the traditional alignments. This alignment could work in a linear tracking tonearm setup, but that is not the case for this arm as it looks like an ordinary pivot for the arm.
Some of what I see may be from projecting a 2D image into 3D. But not the zero offset.
So yeah, the alignment shown is a puzzler.
Does anybody have any knowledge about the alignment shown in this video?

 

[MattHooper]

Any effort that tempts gen-z with book reading is a probably worth pursuing. Likewise, anything that emphasizes consuming music outside of autogenerated spotify playlists is also good.

And I think in general, positive engagement and passion - when someone discovers something new that adds delightful texture to their life - is a good thing. Whether it’s physical books, records, and new sport or hobby, discovering the world of high-performance accurate audio gear on ASR, or whatever.

Unfortunately, we humans can be a judgey lot, and belittling the passion of others can be our way of feeling superior. The more we listen to our better angels on this one the better I think. And I also think that ASR has actually “ improved” in this respect over time.
I think I see more openness to different viewpoints than I did when I first came here. (I could be wrong, but that’s how I’m perceiving it).

Personally, one of the reasons I get a kick out of the vinyl revival is the amount of passion I see associated with it. I’ve always enjoyed other peoples passion, because I think it’s one of the most important elements in the world. I had an acquaintance who was totally into wall clocks! It was sort of mind-boggling to me that any dude I encountered could be that into wall clocks. But his passion for it, the pleasure he got out of it, was wonderful to see, and it was fun learning a bit about different wall clocks when we would visit.

 

[Newman]

anything that emphasizes consuming music outside of autogenerated spotify playlists is also good.

Note that those self-same 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' contain quick links to the whole album from which each song came.

Hence one could argue that 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' are themselves actually one of the primary things that emphasise consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists'. They are a fabulous segue into exploring whole albums. Quickly. Immediately. And at no extra cost.

The implied notion that vinyl (of all things) and its renaissance, is good because it emphasises consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists', is way off-track:-

• it costs a fortune per song, compared to zero for using streaming services to explore whole albums
• CDs also provide access to music without 'autogenerated Spotify playlists', and at a fraction of the cost per song and free from quality control issues that distract from the music
• Instead of widening one's music horizons, vinyl arguably narrows them and channels them into (a) the latest releases (on vinyl, dominated by pop hits and old favourites) and (b) whatever is on the racks at your local record/vape shop where all the good stuff is snapped up in minutes and the dregs are insanely overpriced and/or damaged

It is impossible to escape the reality that the vinyl renaissance is not fundamentally about the music at all. It just looks that way at first glance.

cheers

 

[Axo1989]

F

Note that those self-same 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' contain quick links to the whole album from which each song came.

Hence one could argue that 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' are themselves actually one of the primary things that emphasise consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists'. They are a fabulous segue into exploring whole albums. Quickly. Immediately. And at no extra cost.

The implied notion that vinyl (of all things) and its renaissance, is good because it emphasises consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists', is way off-track:-

• it costs a fortune per song, compared to zero for using streaming services to explore whole albums
• CDs also provide access to music without 'autogenerated Spotify playlists', and at a fraction of the cost per song and free from quality control issues that distract from the music
• Instead of widening one's music horizons, vinyl arguably narrows them and channels them into (a) the latest releases (on vinyl, dominated by pop hits and old favourites) and (b) whatever is on the racks at your local record/vape shop where all the good stuff is snapped up in minutes and the dregs are insanely overpriced and/or damaged

It is impossible to escape the reality that the vinyl renaissance is not fundamentally about the music at all. It just looks that way at first glance.

cheers

You certainly pitch it as negatively as you can, but it’s certainly about enjoying the music, among other things, for many originalists and revivalists alike. You overstepped your own logic when you said “at all”. “The music” may not be the fundamental driver for everyone into vinyl records now, but it obviously is for a good number of them.

 

[MattHooper]

I think this is a very good post, giving us lots to chew on.

Note that those self-same 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' contain quick links to the whole album from which each song came.

Hence one could argue that 'autogenerated Spotify playlists' are themselves actually one of the primary things that emphasise consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists'. They are a fabulous segue into exploring whole albums. Quickly. Immediately. And at no extra cost.

Agreed. Streaming is obviously fantastic for exploring music. I explore music that way all the time. And in fact, articles on the vinyl revival have shown that people playing records, including the young people involved in the vinyl revival, often use streaming for musical exploration. And then when they find albums, they are particularly interested in, help guides their vinyl purchases.

I have found the algorithms on YouTube and elsewhere quite helpful this way.

The implied notion that vinyl (of all things) and its renaissance, is good because it emphasises consuming music outside of 'autogenerated Spotify playlists', is way off-track:-

I’m betting mppix will bring more clarity and nuance to his position if asked.

I don’t think vinyl is better or some absolute
“ good” in terms of being better for music exploration. But it certainly can be good, for many enthusiasts, as another form of music exploration.

A great many people quoted in articles about the vinyl revival, as well as Conversations, you can see every day and places like Reddit vinyl, show people saying how much they appreciated getting into vinyl in terms of music exploration. Whether it’s going to stores or record shows, crate digging, exploring their parents or someone else’s record collection, or whatever, you hear all the time “ I’m discovering so much music that I never would have if I hadn’t gotten into vinyl!”

These are often young people quite familiar with their Spotify algorithms, and they know they’ve gone off in surprising directions directions Via record collecting that weren’t showing up in their Spotify suggestions.

I myself have a large portion of my record collection taken up with a type of music, much of which is not even available on streaming or CD. And its music I absolutely treasure now.

Plus, since I like playing records so much, this leads me to looking to companies that specifically release records, especially those that seem to curate a high-quality of the type of music I love (including soundtracks, etc.)

So it is through a desire to hear music on vinyl that has led me to tons of purchases of music, I otherwise would not have heard about via my streaming algorithms. (and again I know that because I’m quite familiar with my streaming algorithms.)

So, yeah, vinyl isn’t some automatic “ better for music exploration” choice. But for many people, it is certainly opened up paths of music exploration beyond the algorithms, which may find to be a good thing. (which can include even giving greater financial support to artists in buying vinyl over streaming).

Instead of widening one's music horizons, vinyl arguably narrows them and channels them into (a) the latest releases (on vinyl, dominated by pop hits and old favourites) and (b) whatever is on the racks at your local record/vape shop where all the good stuff is snapped up in minutes and the dregs are insanely overpriced and/or damaged

Two points here:

1. Vinyl can widen peoples musical horizons. See above. (I’ve lost count as the amount of times I’ve seen vinyl newbies showing off the vinyl they got from their parents, grandparents or someone else they knew, and have been enthusiastic about having discovered music they love that they otherwise would not have)

2. It is certainly true in a sense that buying records has a “ narrowing quality.” Because of course few people can afford anything like the amount of music on records that is available on streaming. But this is far from being a negative necessarily. Given the expense and effort, buying vinyl often leads people to more closely curate their music collection. There is no inherent higher virtue in “ trying to listen to a different song or artist every single time” which is what is possible on Spotify. People have only so much time to give real attention to music, and buying records can be a way of curating that time and attention, so you end up possibly with a deeper connection, more replay, value, and higher familiarity with an album or artist.

That certainly is what a lot of vinyl enthusiasts report, and it’s been my experience too. The world of abundance in streaming can feel anything from fleeting to ubiquitous to overwhelming. I still use it, but I tend to connect more often to my highly curated record collection. Which has about 1000 records now is extremely varied.

Once again, in case it needs to be said, none of the above is stating some inherent superiority for vinyl or that anything like
“ everybody” feels the same way. It’s not about vinyl being superior: it’s about explaining why it appeals to some of us.

Cheers

 

[MattHooper]

I forgot this…

It is impossible to escape the reality that the vinyl renaissance is not fundamentally about the music at all. It just looks that way at first glance.

It would be a mistake to think that “ it’s not about the music at all.” People are generally selecting records based on the music they like or want to explore.

For most (and I’m talking about those who play records) it is about another way of connecting to music.

Just like your devotion to putting together an accurate audio system is one of your ways of connecting to music.

There are all sorts of things that influence the way different people experience and connect to music.

 

[Robin L]

Finally broke down and subscribed to Spotify Premium today. I wanted to hear the Blandine Verlet's François Couperin CDs that have become unobtanium. So, I have the chance to explore a lot of titles I otherwise would not have access to. Getting a turntable (which I don't have room for anyway) wouldn't help - most of what I want is otherwise only on CD anyway. Classical Music fans are not being well served by the vinyl revival. CD issues as of late aren't helping all that much either, though I have found a lot of interesting titles donated to the library. I'd like to think that, in my case, it really is all about the music.

 

[MattHooper]

Classical Music fans are not being well served by the vinyl revival.

True. For strictly classical music I only have a few recently released pressings, but I actually am a bit nuts and loving classical music music on vinyl.

Fortunately, I get my orchestral music on vinyl fix through my soundtrack collections.

And there’s no way I could give up the purity and sound quality of my ripped CDs either. Some of my favourite soundtracks sound mind blowing on CD (and haven’t been released on vinyl) and I luxuriate in the sound quality.

 

[Robin L]

True. For strictly classical music I only have a few recently released pressings, but I actually am a bit nuts and loving classical music music on vinyl.

Fortunately, I get my orchestral music on vinyl fix through my soundtrack collections.

And there’s no way I could give up the purity and sound quality of my ripped CDs either. Some of my favourite soundtracks sound mind blowing on CD (and haven’t been released on vinyl) and I luxuriate in the sound quality.

I can understand your definition of orchestral music, but my classical music taste is doubtless more severe. I must have listened to over five hours of music today, mostly solo keyboard including Igor Levit's Goldberg and Diabelli Variations, Paul Jacobs playing Debussy, Mitsuko Uchida playing Schubert's Impromptus and Blandine Verlet playing François Couperin. It appears that Spotify is not the first choice for sound quality, limited as it is to 320 Kbps. But I doubt I'd hear the difference at my age. Maybe after the trial period I'll switch to Tidal. Have had no problem so far finding the music I'm looking for.

 

[Palmer]

Don't know the mechanics of that tonearm, but it is interesting.

Yeah, the ViV Lab Rigid Float arm foregoes the offset, trades better outer groove tracking at the loss of inner groove tracking. I am intrigued about the long version
but I just spent my allowance at Sierra Sound, coincidentally.

 

[MattHooper]

I can understand your definition of orchestral music, but my classical music taste is doubtless more severe. I must have listened to over five hours of music today, mostly solo keyboard including Igor Levit's Goldberg and Diabelli Variations, Paul Jacobs playing Debussy, Mitsuko Uchida playing Schubert's Impromptus and Blandine Verlet playing François Couperin.

That’s quite a diet of classical music!

I used to be heavily in to classical music through my 20s 30s and 40s.
I never had much time for Baroque, I’d like some from the classical period, but once it hits the romantic period and onward I was all over it. This no doubt comes from the fact I got into classical music through a love of soundtracks. My brother and I loved Stravinsky, and since he worked for many years as an usher at the Toronto Symphony, I would go about once a week to the symphony for free.

(my brother is the indie musician and his music is essentially a across between The Beach Boys and Stravinsky)

It appears that Spotify is not the first choice for sound quality, limited as it is to 320 Kbps. But I doubt I'd hear the difference at my age. Maybe after the trial period I'll switch to Tidal. Have had no problem so far finding the music I'm looking for.

I use Tidal. We also have Apple Music but it sucks in terms of not playing on so many streaming systems.
I also stream Internet stations to my 2 channel system or surround system, especially for electronica and dance music typically 320 kbps, and it all sounds great to me!