Can anyone explain the vinyl renaissance?

[IAtaman]

Swift's rerelease of 'Taylor's versions' of her previous albums are a special case, I think, and born of legal shenanigens. I imagine many of her fanbase are buying (and streaming) these deliberately in support.

Yes, indeed. And although I think it is fair to say vinyl is quite significant for the artists/studios, more reason why the comparison offered does not paint a fair picture as to how significant.

 

[MattHooper]

Here is the top 10 vinyl album sales list for 2022 in the US, where sales are biggest;

Top-selling vinyl albums in the U.S. 2023 | Statista

In 2023, the top-selling vinyl album in the United States was Taylor Swift's 1989 (Taylor’s Version) with 1.01 billion vinyl albums sold.

www.statista.com

Odd. Is Tyler the Creator’s presence - close to one in every hundred LPs sold - hipsters or hardcore audiophiles?

I’ll give an alternative. What we are seeing is a turntable in the living rooms of three or four percent of family homes. Different members of those families are buying vinyl albums based on individual trends that I can’t see all of as I live in a different country and don’t see enough US culture. The hipsters are growing up and have wives and teenage kids now, and this is their chart.

Anecdotally:

Before the revival, vinyl was not a "thing" that ever appeared in conversation, or anything else among anyone I know (except for one vinyl enthusiast audiophile friend, and that seemed odd to me).

Now...it seems to be "everywhere." For instance when my son's friends come over and see my turntable and displayed records, many have mentioned their family
also has a turntable now and they play records. Before the revival we had one dusty old record store around the corner, very rare. Now I have 5 stores selling records within a close walking distance, and about 14 within a 10 minute drive. I'm surrounded by them. And they are always busy. Not to mention how vinyl as we know is being sold by many of the big retailers. (Even in airports now!). There's news stories on the vinyl revival still...almost every day.

And a number of friends and acquaintances, non-audiophiles who, again, never mentioned vinyl before, have become record enthusiasts...some very fervent to say the least, doing deep bin diving and all the rest.

So, whether one quibbles about the size of sales, it seems to me surprisingly permeating the culture.

Sorry, can't follow what kind of conclusion can be derived from the comparison of streaming old albums vs the sales of vinyl new release.

These are newly re-recorded, newly released albums. And fans are fervently streaming. I'm amazed if you can not still see the cultural cache and the money generated by her recent vinyl sales as significant.

Or do you consider the original raise in vinyl sales back in 2010s as the renaissance?

Yes, 2007 is generally seen as the beginning of the vinyl revival, when sales began to rise and never stopped.

Maybe you'd agree that If she released her new album on CD only, CD sales would make more money as well, which brings the question what is it that is being revived exactly.

There is no question what is being revived; we can all see the vinyl revival. It would be blinkered to imagine it's just about Taylor Swift. These days artists huge and small often time their album releases based on when the vinyl can be released.

The revival is why Swift releases on vinyl. She released an elaborate set of CDs as well, yet Vinyl was about 58% of her physical media sales (the rest was CDs and cassettes).

Cheers.

 

[Sal1950]

Whatever the current fads are or general populace believe, vinyl hasn't been a relevant medium
as a High Fidelity source for over 30 years any more than a cassette or 8 track player.
Just a bunch of silliness and a waste of investment capital if top flight audio is your goal.
If what you really want is an expensive toy to play with, fine.
Otherwise you might as well throw your money down the toilet.
Those are the facts of the "vinyl revival".

 

[Robin L]

Whatever the current fads are or general populace believe, vinyl hasn't been a relevant medium
as a High Fidelity source for over 30 years any more than a cassette or 8 track player.
Just a bunch of silliness and a waste of investment capital if top flight audio is your goal.
If what you really want is an expensive toy to play with, fine.
Otherwise you might as well throw your money down the toilet.
Those are the facts of the "vinyl revival".
View attachment 324638

The fact of the vinyl revival is that it is happening. You keep coming back to complain about this reality as if your screeds will have an effect, and they won't. My taste in music runs to older recordings of classical music (listening to Toscanini conducting Brahms right now), but I have no desire to return to LPs whatsoever. The vinyl revival is happening anyway and I see no reason to bitch about it as someone else is obviously enjoying it. I know from experience that vinyl playback is usually bad but when it's done really well it's great. Rather pointless to attempt to damp down on someone else's joy when it has no effect on anything you're doing. It gets really tiresome, as those complaints always lead to exactly the same place.

 

[IPunchCholla]

I like playing records, sometimes. Sorry.

 

[jsrtheta]

The fact of the vinyl revival is that it is happening. You keep coming back to complain about this reality as if your screeds will have an effect, and they won't. My taste in music runs to older recordings of classical music (listening to Toscanini conducting Brahms right now), but I have no desire to return to LPs whatsoever. The vinyl revival is happening anyway and I see no reason to bitch about it as someone else is obviously enjoying it. I know from experience that vinyl playback is usually bad but when it's done really well it's great. Rather pointless to attempt to damp down on someone else's joy when it has no effect on anything you're doing. It gets really tiresome, as those complaints always lead to exactly the same place.

People bought Pet Rocks, too.

Color me unimpressed.

 

[thecheapseats]

if it wasn't for vinyl - I'd probably be an accountant... thank you vinyl...

 

[jsrtheta]

Whatever the current fads are or general populace believe, vinyl hasn't been a relevant medium
as a High Fidelity source for over 30 years any more than a cassette or 8 track player.
Just a bunch of silliness and a waste of investment capital if top flight audio is your goal.
If what you really want is an expensive toy to play with, fine.
Otherwise you might as well throw your money down the toilet.
Those are the facts of the "vinyl revival".
View attachment 324638

Maybe they'll resurrect the corpse of Clark Johnsen and announce that 78s are the true paragons of fidelity.

Next up: Cheap transistor AM radios!

 

[MattHooper]

The fact of the vinyl revival is that it is happening. You keep coming back to complain about this reality as if your screeds will have an effect, and they won't. My taste in music runs to older recordings of classical music (listening to Toscanini conducting Brahms right now), but I have no desire to return to LPs whatsoever. The vinyl revival is happening anyway and I see no reason to bitch about it as someone else is obviously enjoying it. I know from experience that vinyl playback is usually bad but when it's done really well it's great. Rather pointless to attempt to damp down on someone else's joy when it has no effect on anything you're doing. It gets really tiresome, as those complaints always lead to exactly the same place.

"There's a trend of people liking something I don't like, so I must decry people liking that thing!"

Reminds me somewhat of the anti-disco movement, a good new documentary on it on PBS:

American Experience | Chapter 1 |The War on Disco | Season 35 | Episode 9

Watch a preview of The War on Disco.

www.pbs.org

And of course the infamous culmination when a huge crowd gathered in a stadium to blow up records that other people liked. (Yet the disco influence
survived and remained incredibly strong, forming the basis of club music to this day).

Nobody is going around blowing up records these days, but it's interesting to see some who have a ferver against the vinyl revival. And it's not just a few in this forum - in many news articles on the revival, many of the positive comments will be mixed with truly disparaging reactions, usually in a way that casts the vinyl
consumer as a dupe, or motivated in some inferior, shallow way.

 

[deweydm]

Off topic, but I’m still doing my small part to try and jumpstart the CD revival. It’s not going well.

Me, at a used record store with my youngest daughter last weekend, “look how cheap the CDs are”.

So she picks out Bow + Arrows by The Walkmen.

<face palm>

”No, not that one. It’s brick walled garbage. You can have my copy on CD, though you might as well just stream it.”

 

[drewdawg999]

Sounds pretty sweet. Actually my copy has some surface noise but you can't hear it when the music is loud. It's historic and nostalgic to listen to this masterpiece in the format it was originally released on. The masters of the classics are stored on magnetic tape, which I understand at its best are around 75dB SNR. Not so far from vinyl's capabilities.

 

[jsrtheta]

"There's a trend of people liking something I don't like, so I must decry people liking that thing!"

Reminds me somewhat of the anti-disco movement, a good new documentary on it on PBS:

American Experience | Chapter 1 |The War on Disco | Season 35 | Episode 9

Watch a preview of The War on Disco.

www.pbs.org

And of course the infamous culmination when a huge crowd gathered in a stadium to blow up records that other people liked. (Yet the disco influence
survived and remained incredibly strong, forming the basis of club music to this day).

Nobody is going around blowing up records these days, but it's interesting to see some who have a ferver against the vinyl revival. And it's not just a few in this forum - in many news articles on the revival, many of the positive comments will be mixed with truly disparaging reactions, usually in a way that casts the vinyl
consumer as a dupe, or motivated in some inferior, shallow way.

I lived in Chicago when Steve Dahl led the Disco Demolition. You have to understand Dahl's influence there and, well, you have to understand Chicago.

But my sympathies remain with Dahl and the demolition. Having come of age in music during the 60s and early 70s, I loathed, and continue to loathe, disco.

 

[Robin L]

People bought Pet Rocks, too.

Color me unimpressed.

"The fad lasted about six months, ending after a short increase in sales during the Christmas season of December 1975."

The Rise and Fall of the Pet Rock: A Look Back at the 1975 Holiday Craze - Rare Historical Photos

The Pet Rock, a simple rock with googly eyes glued on and nestled in a cardboard box with a bed of straw, became an instant sensation and cultural phenomenon.

rarehistoricalphotos.com

The LP revival began around 2007 and has not slowed down, so these two phenomena don't compare in the slightest.

Regarding this discussion, Frazey Ford says it best:

My joy, my joy, my joy takes nothing from you
No, my joy, my joy, my joy takes nothing from you

 

[Sal1950]

"There's a trend of people liking something I don't like, so I must decry people liking that thing!"

That's not the point of it at all Matt, and you know it.
The "vinyl revival" was built by the media telling a crock of BS to their readers in order to built a advertising base income.
It's not one bit different than the lies they constantly being spread about cables, grounding boxes, widgets, and all the rest.
All the lies and BS myths have now spilled out to the general populace and it's just gone nuts.
The stuff that is written elsewhere would be a crime if examined as a fraud being hoisted on the public.
You want good Hi-Fi, spend your money on better speakers, room treatments, go multich, don't waste it on a crippled 1960 tech.
The market is also exploding with incredible sounding Atmos, 5&7.1 bluray music releases every day, streaming is now doing the same.
What do you want from your system, great sounding music or just some toy to constantly tweak and play with.
I won't tell people TT's and LP's are a worthwhile 2023 HiFi investment because they're not.
In the main, money spent on cables, etc at least does no audible harm. Money spent on dragging a rock thru a ditch is a big step backward in quality from the modern alternatives.
As long as you continue to come here and celebrate the fleesing of the uneducated, I and many others will be here to counter
with the facts & truth.

 

[MattHooper]

I lived in Chicago when Steve Dahl led the Disco Demolition. You have to understand Dahl's influence there and, well, you have to understand Chicago.

But my sympathies remain with Dahl and the demolition. Having come of age in music during the 60s and early 70s, I loathed, and continue to loathe, disco.

This recent NYT article was written just for you

Jeff Tweedy: I Thought I Hated Pop Music. ‘Dancing Queen’ Changed My Mind.​

Opinion | Think You Don’t Like Something? Try Listening Closer - The New York Times

Opinion | Jeff Tweedy: I Thought I Hated Pop Music. ‘Dancing Queen’ Changed My Mind. (Published 2023)

It feels good to come clean.

www.nytimes.com

(paywall bypass)

Opinion | Think You Don’t Like Something? Try Listening Closer - The …

archived 5 Nov 2023 11:42:35 UTC

archive.ph

5 Nov 2023 11:42
Opinion | Think You Don’t Like Something? Try Listening Closer - The New York Times

 

[MattHooper]

That's not the point of it at all Matt, and you know it.
The "vinyl revival" was built by the media telling a crock of BS to their readers in order to built a advertising base income.
It's not one bit different than the lies they constantly being spread about cables, grounding boxes, widgets, and all the rest.
All the lies and BS myths have now spilled out to the general populace and it's just gone nuts.
The stuff that is written elsewhere would be a crime if examined as a fraud being hoisted on the public.
You want good Hi-Fi, spend your money on better speakers, room treatments, go multich, don't waste it on a crippled 1960 tech.
The market is also exploding with incredible sounding Atmos, 5&7.1 bluray music releases every day, streaming is now doing the same.
What do you want from your system, great sounding music or just some toy to constantly tweak and play with.
I won't tell people TT's and LP's are a worthwhile 2023 HiFi investment because they're not.
In the main, money spent on cables, etc at least does no audible harm. Money spent on dragging a rock thru a ditch is a big step backward in quality from the modern alternatives.
As long as you continue to come here and celebrate the fleesing of the uneducated, I and many others will be here to counter
with the facts & truth.

There's nothing like the warm, natural sound of vinyl Sal.

You know it...deep within your heart.

 

[Anton D]

The real hipster trend these days seems to be how many 'channels' worth of stuff they buy into.

There's nothing like the warm, natural sound of vinyl Sal.

You know it...deep within your heart.

For some people, saying anything joyful about vinyl is like saying "Niagara Falls" to freaking Moe Howard.

But, surround sound, there's a timeless 'investment,' until 'they' start shoving the next higher number of channels down consumers' throats.

 

[Sal1950]

I lived in Chicago when Steve Dahl led the Disco Demolition. You have to understand Dahl's influence there and, well, you have to understand Chicago.

But my sympathies remain with Dahl and the demolition. Having come of age in music during the 60s and early 70s, I loathed, and continue to loathe, disco.

I was there too, not at the ball park but home only a couple miles away.
All in all it was a fun night, a tough one for LPs, and it signaled the end of the disco era. YEA.

 

[MattHooper]

I was there too, not at the ball park but home only a couple miles away.
All in all it was a fun night, a tough one for LPs, and it signaled the end of the disco era. YEA.

Ha, I was actually going to ask if you were at the disco demolition! I wasn't far off!

I'll have to spin some of my disco records in your honour tonight ...(I still love disco and funk...)

 

[Robin L]

The real hipster trend these days seems to be how many 'channels' worth of stuff they buy into.

For some people, saying anything joyful about vinyl is like saying "Niagara Falls" to freaking Moe Howard.

But, surround sound, there's a timeless 'investment,' until 'they' start shoving the next higher number of channels down consumers' throats.

I had a 5.1 surround system for about three years, around 2016 to 2019. Managed to get some Primus Infinity speakers at a thrift store, all five for $89, four floorstanders and a center speaker. Also got three powered subs at the same place for about $150. Got an Onkyo AVR, good for seven discreet channels. Also had an old receiver for a phono preamp, nothing special, and a Strathclyde turntable with a SME III tonearm for the 1000 LPs I still had. Had an OPPO DVD player until it broke, then a Sony Blu-Ray player with SACD capability that I'm still using.

I found most surround mixes somewhat gimmicky, often placing drumkits in the rear and sometimes panning elements in a full circle. I had a combination of SACDs and DVD-A discs, also some DVDs with Dolby surround. I'd also use some of the synthetic surround options with two channel sources. Can't claim any of these were better than just listening to stereo. There was the advantage of CDs having an obviously lower noise floor than the LPs, though many of the LPs in my collection were of folk/world music rarities that weren't available on CD. And a fair number of my LPs were for nostalgia's sake. Bought all of the (2014?) Beatles mono LP reissues, didn't find any sonic improvements over their corresponding CD equivalents, but didn't have much trouble getting a good rate of return when selling them back to my favorite LP shop. But I kept my surround discs, most of them being musically of value.

In any case, the LPs and LP playback gear had to go when I moved into a much smaller space. Three of the surround speakers ended up with my stepson along with the AVR. The turntables (I had three at the time, one a Technics direct drive that was more dependable than the Strathclyde and a cheap rim-drive Garrard good for 78s) were all sold off, mostly at a big garage sale. The LPs were mostly of the sort that were not worth all that much, so most wound up in a thrift store. Not to mention about 100 78s that fell into my lap. Classical LPs are not worth much, and you might notice that there's few of them selling now. I mostly listen to the CDs I kept---didn't have room for all the CDs I had then. And I miss some of those, though there's only so many hours in the day to listen to music anyway.

I will say there's something about holding the 12" x 12" package that holds the vinyl disc but that's simply not enough inducement for me anymore.