Can 2 speakers measure the same but sound differently?

[Pearljam5000]

I take the KH120( which i owned) and 8030C for example
They are very similar from what i understand (measurements wise) but they sound completely different for me.
So basically my question is, is there anything beyond the science?
Nothing in the world will convince me they sound the same, the treble especially is very different.

 

[sergeauckland]

No two loudspeakers, even those of the same type will ever measure the same. Even two of a pair will struggle to be within 1dB of each other, and more usually even 2 or 3 dB at specific frequencies.

Consequently, the chances of two different model of loudspeakers measuring the same is practically nil.

Having said that, good loudspeakers with similar measurements will each sound acceptable, but never identical.

S

 

[Pio2001]

Who says the KH-120 and 8030C measure the same ? We should compare a complete set of measurements for both. The KH-120 sound power curve is very special and it is unlikely that the Genelec has an identical one.

 

[steve59]

ke reference along with other brands high q models market their speaker pairs to be within .5 db of the reference and within a single db of each matched pair that usually includes matching veneers. I believe these measurements are limited to 1 meter with 1 watt and probably take no account for component reaction and room interaction. I’m also skeptical about loudspeaker measurements explaining everything since most accurate speakers (I’ve used) sound like the life’s been sucked out of them.

 

[Senior NEET Engineer]

They do not measure the same

 

[napilopez]

As suggested by others, they are nowhere near what I'd consider "close" measurement wise.

Edit: more specifically, they are both "good," but they have different on-axis and different directivity properties and that alone will always make two speakers sound different.

 

[thewas]

ke reference along with other brands high q models market their speaker pairs to be within .5 db of the reference and within a single db of each matched pair that usually includes matching veneers.

You are talking about the same model of loudspeakers, which is not what the question was about.

I’m also skeptical about loudspeaker measurements explaining everything since most accurate speakers (I’ve used) sound like the life’s been sucked out of them.

Which model were they?

 

[steve59]

The R105/3 and R 107/2 kef.

 

[Kvalsvoll]

I’m also skeptical about loudspeaker measurements explaining everything since most accurate speakers (I’ve used) sound like the life’s been sucked out of them.

It is in the measurements, you just need to look further than just a simple frequency response graph.

But it is true that there is yet no one simple presentation of a measurement that gives us the full and complete answer to how it sounds. Some engineers are looking into that, trying to solve the puzzle, while others create magic power cables.

 

[Shazb0t]

As has been said, those two speakers don't measure the same.

If you were to acquire two sample speakers of the exact same model and had them measured to ensure that they are appreciably close to each other, say where all sound measurement properties are +-.5 dB, then I imagine they would sound the same to you in a normal listening environment. Once you throw in appreciable differences in frequency response, directivity, distortion, etc. sounding the same goes out the window.

 

[richard12511]

I take the KH120( which i owned) and 8030C for example
They are very similar from what i understand (measurements wise) but they sound completely different for me.
So basically my question is, is there anything beyond the science?
Nothing in the world will convince me they sound the same, the treble especially is very different.

I would say no. If two speakers measure the same in all ways, they will sound the same. That said, no speakers will measure the same .

Using Amir's measurements to compare the 8030c to the KH80, they measure similar, yet different, and I would expect them to sound different. Below are some color coded differences

I would expect the 8030c to sound brighter. Notice how much more grouped together the curves are at the top.

 

[escksu]

I take the KH120( which i owned) and 8030C for example
They are very similar from what i understand (measurements wise) but they sound completely different for me.
So basically my question is, is there anything beyond the science?
Nothing in the world will convince me they sound the same, the treble especially is very different.

No 2 speakers (identical model) sounds the same. Also, no amps sound the same too. Even the same amp, left and right channel will have minor differences. Applies to all other things manufactured by man. In the world of precision engineering, its all about tolerance but nothing is identical. When products are mass produced, its even worse.

It is entirely possible to manufacturer 2 speakers that is almost identical but its simply way too costly and not practical.

 

[Beave]

^Un, no.

 

[muad]

No 2 speakers (identical model) sounds the same. Also, no amps sound the same too. Even the same amp, left and right channel will have minor differences. Applies to all other things manufactured by man. In the world of precision engineering, its all about tolerance but nothing is identical. When products are mass produced, its even worse.

It is entirely possible to manufacturer 2 speakers that is almost identical but its simply way too costly and not practical.

Once level matched, two amps that exceed the audibilty threshold of human hearing and exceed the power delivery requirements for the given playback volume will sounds identical. If you think otherwise you may be on the wrong forum.

 

[escksu]

Once level matched, two amps that exceed the audibilty threshold of human hearing and exceed the power delivery requirements for the given playback volume will sounds identical. If you think otherwise you may be on the wrong forum.

Btw, the words "level matched" pretty much says they are different.....yes I know, its called calibration.

 

[Chrispy]

What two speakers measure exactly the same?

 

[Driedmango]

If two speakers have the same power response at the same location, they will sound exactly the same. Problem is people look at a single REW frequency response measurement and wonder why the speakers don’t sound the same. It’s because the graph is missing quite a bit of data.

 

[Chrispy]

Okay, and ? Identical speakers may not exist even in a sold pair, tho...

 

[Blaspheme]

Once level matched, two amps that exceed the audibilty threshold of human hearing and exceed the power delivery requirements for the given playback volume will sounds identical. If you think otherwise you may be on the wrong forum.

Yes, but if you properly consider the amp-speaker-room system, including wavy impedances that nice/traditional speakers often have and back pressure from room modes, you've ruled out a lot of amps that look good enough when you stop at paper watts.

 

[abdo123]

Yes, but if you properly consider the amp-speaker-room system, including wavy impedances that nice/traditional speakers often have and back pressure from room modes, you've ruled out a lot of amps that look good enough when you stop at paper watts.

he literally said the necessary power requirements, not watts. So that includes both current and voltage.