Building HEOS-proof music collection

[LeftCoastTim]

I keep trying these music organization apps over the last twenty years. The only thing that reliably worked over that whole time is putting the albums in different directories/folders and browsing by folder.

 

[rgpit]

I keep trying these music organization apps over the last twenty years. The only thing that reliably worked over that whole time is putting the albums in different directories/folders and browsing by folder.

You can do that with LMS. There is a browse "Music Folder" option.

 

[sjeesjie]

I'm surprised folks haven't mentioned the free Logitech Media Server. It can be installed on a pc, Raspberry pi, or many NAS devices. With the "Material Skin" and "Music and Artist Information" plugins installed I'm much happier with LMS than with Roon. In addition Qobuz, Tidal, and many other apps can be easily installed. Currently I'm using it on a pc along with 2 Rasperry pi's, a microRendu, and multiple Squeezebox endpoints.

I think there’s an option for this on my nas also. And there’s a Squeezebox client plugin on Volumio which I happen to have installed on a Raspi. Here’s hoping!

 

[DuxServit]

Another thumbs up for Roon.

 

[Jimbob54]

I'm not (yet) enthusiastic about streaming. Maybe someone would recommend at service that (a) supports at least 16/44.1 resolution, (2) Classical music in a comprehensive manner, and (3) has low monthly subscription cost.

I tried Tidal, ($20/mo for 16/44.1), and I can't live with it for Classical music. You can't even search by composer. So if I search for, say, "Shostakovich" and what I get is 'Artist' = Shostakovich, i.e. Composer is conflated with Performer. If I then select 'See all Albums' (which presumably include albums with Shostakovich as either Composer OR Performer), I get what is a pathetically short list of albums. Of these, a high proportion are compilations that may includes one or two movements of compositions as tracks. Also, I get a remarkable number of "Shostakovich performs Shostakovich"-type albums: interesting but largely irrelevant -- Shostakovich wasn't a notable performer.

As a mainly Classical listener I buy CDs very selectively, rip them to computer files stored on NAS, and play the using Foobar2000 on a dedicated computer.

Can't comment on classical I'm afraid. I'd be amazed there isn't a specialist service but never heard of it.

For lossless, I'm aware of amazon HD, tidal, qobuz and I believe deezer but for classical libraries, no idea.

 

[FrantzM]

Western Classical music has eluded many of those software. It’s organization and performance are , when one comes to think of it, peculiar:

• The composer is seldom the performer
• The performer is often an orchestra
• Orchestras are lead by different conductors
• Conductors lead different orchestra
• Same conductor performs with different orchestras, on different albums, pieces from same composer
• Soloists/performers perform with different orchestras. Which can be lead by different conductors. At different times on different labels...
• Same album usually have different composers. Performed by different conductors
• Same label issues several different version a of same work with different conductors. Those different could or not be with same orchestras
• I could go on
• I won’t

it can make cataloging, arranging Western Classical music a challenge. It does make of it a challenge.

Later

 

[Kal Rubinson]

I'm not (yet) enthusiastic about streaming. Maybe someone would recommend at service that (a) supports at least 16/44.1 resolution, (2) Classical music in a comprehensive manner, and (3) has low monthly subscription cost.

I agree with you about this and my approach is similar to yours except for the use of JRMC instead of Foobar2000.

The closest I get (and I do use this often for finding new music) is to stream from Qobuz using Roon. This satisfies (a), is acceptable but not optimal for (b) and doesn't come close to satisfying (c). Consequently, if I find something I like, I rip or download it into my library.

 

[Chromatischism]

Some DLNA/UPnP implementations can be quite buggy. I see someone suggested BubbleUPnP, that might help as it has options for the type of server-side search algorithm to use.

Alternatively, you could install a different server package on your NAS as it might help as well. I like the following:

https://emby.media/nas-server.html

It supports streaming to DLNA/UPnP devices, and its client app is quite attractive and easy to use. I suspect it'll interface with your amp just fine. By the way, please don't let its seemingly video-centric focus dissuade you from assessing it. I use it almost exclusively for audio, and am quite happy with it:

https://emby.media/emby-for-android-mobile.html

I installed Minimserver and felt it was an upgrade in performance and album art quality over my default DiskStation.

 

[Chromatischism]

If your collection is mostly of classical music then, I ( and many other) would not have many solutions.
Else Roon is the best I have found so far. as for DLNA, I have avoided it, while researching it: My take, implementations often do not respect the standards, a bit difficult to implement correctly, etc. I wasn't encouraged. It could be much easier than I think but ...
Again Roon: The best for non classical music.

My views align completely with those of @Jimbob54 on this thread.. so far

I have used DLNA and UPNP with my NAS for the last 10 years and it's worked just fine. I mostly use BubbleUPNP as my player. Roon looks nice but there is a cost.

 

[Chromatischism]

I'm surprised folks haven't mentioned the free Logitech Media Server. It can be installed on a pc, Raspberry pi, or many NAS devices. With the "Material Skin" and "Music and Artist Information" plugins installed I'm much happier with LMS than with Roon. In addition Qobuz, Tidal, and many other apps can be easily installed. Currently I'm using it on a pc along with 2 Rasperry pi's, a microRendu, and multiple Squeezebox endpoints.

How does it compare to Foobar2000 + the controller app?

 

[FrantzM]

For those that are geeks/tech-savvy/software-tweakers ... etc.. it is an interesting challenge and a sense of accomplishment or joy when finally, everything works as it should . this after hours of forum discussions, reading , hai-pulling etc .. I tend to see DLNA/UPNP in that light. You can do it ou of DIY or Open SOurce solutions but this has a cost, perhaps not a monetary visible, cost but it costs something. OTOH, ROONs, installs and works with not much fuss and is a wonderful tool that merges smoothly and transparently your own library with those infinitely larger of Tidal or Qobuz while working silently in the background to organize your metadata, including album covers or your ripped CD, ROON can suggest and rather well music pieces, you may like or so often, have completely forgotten about and that were in your library .. Past 100 albums/CD, this does happen to anyone.
When it comes to suggesting music, IMO, SPOTIFY has no peer. It does also happen, that it is virtually transparent to 99.999999% of the world population, including audiophiles with SET amplifiers, idler-pulley turntable and single driver speakers . SPOTIFY, also, seems to work decently, as an ersatz multi-room "thing".

Peace.

 

[Jimbob54]

For those that are geeks/tech-savvy/software-tweakers ... etc.. it is an interesting challenge and a sense of accomplishment or joy when finally, everything works as it should . this after hours of forum discussions, reading , hai-pulling etc .. I tend to see DLNA/UPNP in that light. You can do it ou of DIY or Open SOurce solutions but this has a cost, perhaps not a monetary visible, cost but it costs something. OTOH, ROONs, installs and works with not much fuss and is a wonderful tool that merges smoothly and transparently your own library with those infinitely larger of Tidal or Qobuz while working silently in the background to organize your metadata, including album covers or your ripped CD, ROON can suggest and rather well music pieces, you may like or so often, have completely forgotten about and that were in your library .. Past 100 albums/CD, this does happen to anyone.
When it comes to suggesting music, IMO, SPOTIFY has no peer. It does also happen, that it is virtually transparent to 99.999999% of the world population, including audiophiles with SET amplifiers, idler-pulley turntable and single driver speakers . SPOTIFY, also, seems to work decently, as an ersatz multi-room "thing".

Peace.

Im new to spotify . Use Qobuz for playing on my main system but piggybacked on the Wife's Spotify (S) account for pennies. S knows my favourite albums, I have playlists on there of my music which I play in the car and when mobile. But please tell me what view/ section I need to look at to see what these magic algorithms think I will like !

I keep hearing S is brilliant for finding new music but honestly have no idea how to see it. I read the music review sites regularly and love finding things based on "sounds a bit like" - but I dont want to have to skim-listen a 30 track playlist S pulls up.

Qobuz has virtually no preference learning as far as I can tell, so anything is better than nothing. Tidal, which I used for a year or so, did a pretty good job of putting the week's releases in order of how much I'd be interested

 

[Alexanderc]

I hate when people talk about songs as “by” the singer. But all the streaming services do it that way out of convenience (it certainly isn’t actually accurate most of the time). I’d bet most people (maybe not here, but overall) couldn’t name the songwriters of their favorite songs. People are up in arms about the artists not getting paid for their work when thousands of cover bands are ripping off songwriters a hundred times a day. Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just sayin’…

 

[Jimbob54]

I hate when people talk about songs as “by” the singer. But all the streaming services do it that way out of convenience (it certainly isn’t actually accurate most of the time). I’d bet most people (maybe not here, but overall) couldn’t name the songwriters of their favorite songs. People are up in arms about the artists not getting paid for their work when thousands of cover bands are ripping off songwriters a hundred times a day. Maybe this is a bit off topic, but just sayin’…

But as a user, I want to find the new album/ single "by" Katy Perry*- so when I search thats what I hope to find.

Surely as long as the actual songwriters are in the credits section of the info about the music, and of course get their royalties, Im not sure whether that info is prominent is relevant to today's consumer.

Now , I agree that being able to search by actual songwriter(s) would / is be useful for many a genre,

Or have I missed your point?

* Example only of an artist who isnt the primary/sole writer of the songs she records

 

[Alexanderc]

But as a user, I want to find the new album/ single "by" Katy Perry*- so when I search thats what I hope to find.

Surely as long as the actual songwriters are in the credits section of the info about the music, and of course get their royalties, Im not sure whether that info is prominent is relevant to today's consumer.

Now , I agree that being able to search by actual songwriter(s) would / is be useful for many a genre,

Or have I missed your point?

No, you’ve got it. It screws up the classical music listeners though.

 

[sjeesjie]

Im new to spotify . Use Qobuz for playing on my main system but piggybacked on the Wife's Spotify (S) account for pennies. S knows my favourite albums, I have playlists on there of my music which I play in the car and when mobile. But please tell me what view/ section I need to look at to see what these magic algorithms think I will like !

I keep hearing S is brilliant for finding new music but honestly have no idea how to see it. I read the music review sites regularly and love finding things based on "sounds a bit like" - but I dont want to have to skim-listen a 30 track playlist S pulls up.

Qobuz has virtually no preference learning as far as I can tell, so anything is better than nothing. Tidal, which I used for a year or so, did a pretty good job of putting the week's releases in order of how much I'd be interested

Spotify creates weekly playlists especially for you based on your playing history I guess. I’ve discovered lots of great new music through this playlist. I live in the Netherlands so I’m not sure if it’s called the same everywhere but in my country it’s called “Discover Weekly”. It’s usually on my home screen but you can also access it by going to search and then Discover New Music.

 

[Jimbob54]

No, you’ve got it. It screws up the classical music listeners though.

Oh, that I can well imagine. I wondered earlier if there was a "proper" classical streaming service as surely there is a market. Sadly, Im now wondering if thats a false assumption. The market for high quality, well labelled classical recordings is probably quite high still. But in a streaming format? Maybe I'm being a tad narrow minded in who I picture as a 21st century classical consumer but maybe the scale just isnt there for either the existing players or a newbie to spend too much time or money on it?

BTW- take amazon as a retailer of CDs- how does their labelling and offer stack up?

 

[Jimbob54]

Spotify creates weekly playlists especially for you based on your playing history I guess. I’ve discovered lots of great new music through this playlist. I live in the Netherlands so I’m not sure if it’s called the same everywhere but in my country it’s called “Discover Weekly”. It’s usually on my home screen but you can also access it by going to search and then Discover New Music.

I've seen that- I should probably explore it. But what I dont want is 10 movie soundtrack songs on there because I played/ liked Son of a Preacher Man.

I liked Tidal's way of putting stuff I might well like at the top of the new release list. Or, maybe, I just like the more popular types of music so thats the view everyone gets!

 

[Alexanderc]

Oh, that I can well imagine. I wondered earlier if there was a "proper" classical streaming service as surely there is a market. Sadly, Im now wondering if thats a false assumption. The market for high quality, well labelled classical recordings is probably quite high still. But in a streaming format? Maybe I'm being a tad narrow minded in who I picture as a 21st century classical consumer but maybe the scale just isnt there for either the existing players or a newbie to spend too much time or money on it?

BTW- take amazon as a retailer of CDs- how does their labelling and offer stack up?

There are two classical-specific services, Primephonic and something else. In my case I share streaming with my family so I need something not classical specific.

 

[Jimbob54]

There are two classical-specific services, Primephonic and something else. In my case I share streaming with my family so I need something not classical specific.

I fear in your case and those in your shoes, you need to get behind the service that caters for you and let the family fend for themselves

(An aside that may help, depending on family size- Spotify introduced partner accounts- for £3 extra I get a separate account to my wife- so less than a family sub. Maybe the difference would make a classical specialist more palatable depending on family size)