Bought no vinyl for 10 years. Where to (re)start now?

[Gorgonzola]

More like WHY restart now. I haven't bought an LP since around1995; the vinyl I bought after get my first CDP in about 1984-85 was because it wasn't then available on CD.

The first CDP owned didn't sound great: harsh and glassy on the top end. Still I saved from hassles of wrangling the awkward vinyl disks.

My first CDP, Yamaha CD-X1 ...

 

[Timmy]

looking at LPs in a 45-rpm format

I have to admit that the idea of 45-rpm-LPs looks quite intriguing to me. Is there any overview about what’s on the market of those?

 

[dualazmak]

I still keep my large and heavy CDP DENON DCD-3500RG (22.0 kg!) in my audio rig (ref. Fig.23 and Fig.24 in my post #931 on my project thread), but nowadays I seldom power-on it... It nicely works, however, together with the stacked ACCUPHASE integrated amplifier E-460 (24.4 kg), as heavy and solid "base" for my TT DENON DP-57L.

I always use dBpoweramp CD Ripper to rip newly purchased CD into non-compressed 44.1 kHz 16 bit AIFF format and save the ripped tracks in my SSD digital music library.

 

[dualazmak]

Just for your possible interest, SONY recently fully revived their vinyl LP production factory (ref. my post here).

Spoiler: Sony's revived vinyl LP production factory

Sony's revived vinyl LP production factory

Even though I assume we have many similar articles/reports on recently opened renovated and/or revived vinyl LP production facilities, let me share with you the following two reports just for reference; I do hope your web browser would properly translate these interesting (at least for me) reports into English;

"I saw the revived Sony record production site. 'How to make with the equipment of the 70's and the latest technology?"
https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/series/dal/1087493.html

"I saw Sony's revived record production factory for the first time in 29 years. What kind of analog can be made now?"
https://av.watch.impress.co.jp/docs/news/1122226.html

You would please note, however, I myself have little intention of bringing many vinyl LPs onto the recently revived DENON TT DP-57L + DL-301II (MC) in my software DSP-based multichannel multi-driver multi-amplifier fully active stereo system, as I wrote here on my project thread.

 

[MaxwellsEq]

or simply you can have a bad mastering / recording in your CD

Mastering is completely separate from the medium. A bad master used on LP or CD will be bad. Vinyl's limited quality may cover up some of this.

but we need to live outside "theory land" ... science is also facts

What does this mean?

think about the compression you can apply in a digital master (and the engineers do, oh yes),

Do you think compression is NOT added to vinyl masters.

Recording / mastering is the most important aspect in the final sound, much more than the format.

A transparent medium such as Red Book does not add its own character to the sound so you hear the music and the choices of the mastering engineer, meanwhile a medium such as vinyl which ADDS coloration may cover up some of the mastering engineer's choices.

 

[JeremyFife]

This site is interesting: detailed comparisons of vinyl/digital/streaming formats and some discussion on vinyl production. Huge amount of work. @Jean.Francois is a member here and posts occasionally.

Magic of Analog, Vinyl, Digital and Spatial Sound

What is the best edition of an album, vinyl, cassette, digital (CD, SACD, Streaming), in stereo, 5.1, Dolby Atmos or Sony 360 RA? Who has never asked this question?

magicvinyldigital.net

 

[mike70]

Mastering is completely separate from the medium. A bad master used on LP or CD will be bad. Vinyl's limited quality may cover up some of this.

What does this mean?

Do you think compression is NOT added to vinyl masters.

A transparent medium such as Red Book does not add its own character to the sound so you hear the music and the choices of the mastering engineer, meanwhile a medium such as vinyl which ADDS coloration may cover up some of the mastering engineer's choices.

the mastering for vinyl MUST be totally different, really different ... you cannot use the same mastering for both media.
and ... in a general way, in the last years, digital mastering is really awful ... as an example, you can check public databases about compression in produced music.

cds CAN sound better, but not as a "mantra", that's "theory land" (only the theory about the matter) ... what's the point of 90dB DR capability if the recording have 60?
i won't talk anymore about it, if someone have the curiosity and wants to check / search for more ... the information exists.
meantime i'll be listening to my analog system with SQ that rivals my digital system

 

[Joe Smith]

I have to admit that the idea of 45-rpm-LPs looks quite intriguing to me. Is there any overview about what’s on the market of those?

I'm not aware of a database per se. I know that the "Angel" label did many of them. I have "Scheherazade" and it sounds good. The short sides kind of drive me crazy, though.

For those of us used to about 30 minutes a side for LPs in the old days, the quality modern pressings of only 10-15 minutes a side, whether 33 or 45, can be annoying.

I have Pink Floyd's "Endless River" on both CD and LP, the LP version a Christmas gift from sons many years ago. But when I play it, I use the CD, frankly, even though the LP sounds great. But the sides are very, very short.

Looks like Acoustic Sounds also has a version of Scheherazade...you should peruse their catalog...they have a wide range of stuff, at checkbook-bleeding prices...

 

[Robin L]

I'm not aware of a database per se. I know that the "Angel" label did many of them. I have "Scheherazade" and it sounds good. The short sides kind of drive me crazy, though.

For those of us used to about 30 minutes a side for LPs in the old days, the quality modern pressings of only 10-15 minutes a side, whether 33 or 45, can be annoying.

I have Pink Floyd's "Endless River" on both CD and LP, the LP version a Christmas gift from sons many years ago. But when I play it, I use the CD, frankly, even though the LP sounds great. But the sides are very, very short.

Looks like Acoustic Sounds also has a version of Scheherazade...you should peruse their catalog...they have a wide range of stuff, at checkbook-bleeding prices...

Stereophile, Analog Planet and HiFi News regularly post articles concerning 45 rpm and other audiophile LP reissues (at checkbook bleeding prices):

Pat Metheny’s 1976 Debut LP, Bright Size Life, Sounds as Fantastic, Fresh, and Futuristic as Ever on Its Truly Outstanding ECM Luminessence Series Vinyl Reissue

Pat Metheny burst onto the scene in the mid-1970s as basically a fully formed, guitar-slinging compositional prodigy. While his first two albums bubbled under mainstream attention, his eponymously titled January 1978 Pat Metheny Group LP release on ECM Records — where I boarded the bus, after...

www.analogplanet.com

Audiophile: Vinyl, May 2024

Miles Davis Milestones Mobile Fidelity MSV1-528 (180g SuperVinyl)

www.hifinews.com

Revinylization #56: Sonny Rollins, A Night at the Village Vanguard, Made New

As one of the first live albums to be recorded in the hallowed space that is New York City's Village Vanguard, Sonny Rollins's A Night at the Village Vanguard (recorded November 3, 1957, released in 1958) set the template, proving that recording in the odd, triangular club could not only work...

www.stereophile.com

 

[Tom C]

I bought a few Acoustics Sounds 45 RPM. Mostly because the 33-1/3 versions, which were cheaper, were sold out. While in theory 45 should allow for better sound than 33-1/3, I personally couldn’t tell the difference. And the music that fits on a single 33-1/3 disc will require 2 discs in 45, so like one or two songs, then you flip. PITA, if you ask me. I much prefer 33 and rather resent having to pay extra for 45.
I think it’s kinda cool to have an all analog pressing. Even a CD or file can’t be better than the mastering tape. I can’t see the point in vinyl made from a piece of music that was originally digitally recorded. But a well crafted all analog vinyl LP will sound not very much worse than a well crafted CD made from the tape. Because, in that case, it’s the tape that’s the major limitation. The differences are mostly in how much care, time and effort was put into transferring from the tape to the CD, file, or LP.

 

[Robin L]

Sony PS-X60 from around 1977 or so. With AT-VM 95 E.

The turntable looks good. The cartridge has easily replaceable styluses. If you are willing to buy new discs it probably would be a good idea to upgrade the stylus to either a VM 95 ML or a VM 95 SH. Either stylus would improve tracking and reduce inner groove distortion.

 

[Timcognito]

Search results for All Products : ""

www.deepdiscount.com

 

[mike70]

I bought a few Acoustics Sounds 45 RPM. Mostly because the 33-1/3 versions, which were cheaper, were sold out. While in theory 45 should allow for better sound than 33-1/3, I personally couldn’t tell the difference. And the music that fits on a single 33-1/3 disc will require 2 discs in 45, so like one or two songs, then you flip. PITA, if you ask me. I much prefer 33 and rather resent having to pay extra for 45.
I think it’s kinda cool to have an all analog pressing. Even a CD or file can’t be better than the mastering tape. I can’t see the point in vinyl made from a piece of music that was originally digitally recorded. But a well crafted all analog vinyl LP will sound not very much worse than a well crafted CD made from the tape. Because, in that case, it’s the tape that’s the major limitation. The differences are mostly in how much care, time and effort was put into transferring from the tape to the CD, file, or LP.

I have many 33 LPs and maxi singles from that LPs in 45 ... normally they sound the same unless gain differences.
With adjusted levels normally they sound the same.

This forum teaches me many things about bull**** in audio... and with the formats (vinyl, CDs, mqa, hires, .. etc) I finded many others.

 

[pderousse]

And it is in the "wondering" that scientific enquiry starts!

Maybe, for some. Others are glad that that there are engineers, industry professionals and academics producing peer-reviewed research, who do scientific enquiry and they come here to learn something and benefit from their work.

Given Red Book has better signal to noise ratio: better low frequency behaviour; lower noise; lower distortion; better crosstalk; lower timing errors; no high frequency resonance: consistent performance (even at the end of an album) than vinyl, you have to decide what is it that you are enjoying. Perhaps it's distortion; noise; wow and flutter; crosstalk; high frequency resonance: end-of-side distortion; limited-mono bass, or perhaps a combination of all of these.

Most of those are all variables that have to do with the theoretical potential of one playback medium compared to another, the "absolutes" of which I wrote above. However, there are other variables of which you and I can have little to no knowledge, not the least of which is the question of whether the entire recording process in fact took advantage of Red Book's superior potential. I strongly suspect and others who lurk in that 400 page Vinyl Renaissance thread (where this diversion from the OP probably belongs) do too, that some specific recordings produced on CD fail in light of its potential. Add to the pile of unknowns my room v. your room, my treatments v. yours, my DSP v. yours, my 50 year old ears v. your 20 year old ones, etc, all of which make positivists on both sides sound silly.

At some point a person involved in this hobby could turn it into a profession and listen for the sake of science, i.e. for other people. But, most people do not have the time or energy unless they are getting paid for it, to research why their favorite recording sounds better in one medium but not another. They listen for themselves because music playback is ultimately about enjoyment, not science.

 

[Tom C]

I have many 33 LPs and maxi singles from that LPs in 45 ... normally they sound the same unless gain differences.
With adjusted levels normally they sound the same.

This forum teaches me many things about bull**** in audio... and with the formats (vinyl, CDs, mqa, hires, .. etc) I finded many others.

You are so right!

 

[MaxwellsEq]

They listen for themselves because music playback is ultimately about enjoyment, not science

Check the title of this forum

At some point a person involved in this hobby could turn it into a profession and listen for the sake of science, i.e. for other people

Or they use scientific instruments and measure:

Introducing the Phono Cartridge Measurement Library

Skip to the index. After years of development we are finally launching our phono cartridge measurement library. These measurements were created using the brilliant cartridge response python script written by @scott wurcer and @JP. Information about its origins can be found in the following...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[Paffi]

Check the title of this forum

Or they use scientific instruments and measure:

Introducing the Phono Cartridge Measurement Library

Skip to the index. After years of development we are finally launching our phono cartridge measurement library. These measurements were created using the brilliant cartridge response python script written by @scott wurcer and @JP. Information about its origins can be found in the following...

audiosciencereview.com

It's a fact, that digital media are technically far superior to vinyl. It's also a fact, that there are many music albums, which are much better on vinyl when it comes to (measured) dynamic range although the medium is technically inferior. So theory is simple black and white. But the result not - it's depending on every single album.The reason are the people in the studio. That's why I use also vinyl, besides streaming. Why this discussion over and over again....

 

[GoFaster]

It's a fact, that digital media are technically far superior to vinyl. It's also a fact, that there are many music albums, which are much better on vinyl when it comes to (measured) dynamic range although the medium is technically inferior. So theory is simple black and white. But the result not - it's depending on every single album. The reason are the people in the studio. Why this discussion over and over again....

 

[Balle Clorin]

Can you be a bit more specific?
Is not Digital superior techically on every possible parameter?
But often compressed so loud that the life is squeezed out if the music ?

 

[Paffi]

Can you be a bit more specific?
Is not Digital superior techically on every possible parameter?
But often compressed so loud that the life is squeezed out if the music ?

That's a point - digitally (remastered) is often very compressed. Again, yes, digitall is on every parameter superior, but that translates only to a superior result when the studio engineer does it right. It's not all about the playback device / medium but depending on what is mastered.

Album list - Dynamic Range DB

That's a big database where many albums are already included in digital as well as vinyl - just search for your favourite albums, maybe you get surprised.