Best turntable for my system

[FilipNone]

Hello everyone.

I live in Italy and I am thinking of buying some turntables to listen to such as Concerto grosso for the New Trolls. I usually listen to progressive or classical music but I am not satisfied with some CD recordings.

I am looking for a turntable that works well with my current system: I mainly use a Topping DX3 Pro+ which I use together with some HifiMan Edition XS. Sometimes I also use the Topping connected to a vintage amplifier combined with The New Advent Loudspeakers when I'm with friends.

My budget is no more than 500 euros, I'm also fine with vintage or used turntables. Maybe even something I can upgrade in the future.
This would be my first turntable so I don't know much about it beyond what I've read online, but if possible I'd like it to have as little noise as possible.
The pre-amp is not included in the price.

If you can recommend me and maybe even teach me something, thank you very much indeed

 

[JeremyFife]

Hi, there are some decent turntables in your budget: Audio Technica make a range, including some direct drive models with built in phono amp and the option to upgrade cartridge later - like the AT-LP120XUSB. Rega or Pro-ject have a different aesthetic that you may also prefer and are fine too. Just accept the stock cartridges for now.

Before you go shopping though, think about what you are trying to achieve. You absolutely will not get better sound quality from vinyl compared to CDs, it just doesn't happen.
There is a small exception, when the mastering of the CD recording is poor and the mastering of the vinyl equivalent is good. That's pretty rare though, and it is extremely difficult to research and find out. Classical recordings especially are almost always very good on CD.

I don't think a turntable will give you what you want, and finding that out is expensive (new vinyl is 20-30 eur .... doesn't take long to build up a large bill).

Your Topping is good and your headphones are not bad: https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hifiman-edition-xs.50219/
The headphones would benefit from some adjustment - PEQ - and that would be a good place to start.

What is your source for music? A CD player into the Topping, or do you stream music (including ripped CDs) from something like a PC?
If you use a PC then there is plenty of good, free, software that can help.
You can try a Qudelix headphone amp: https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/qudelix-5k-bluetooth-dac-headphone-amp.17386/

Otherwise it's a bit trickier, but something like a WiiM Pro Plus and a Headphone amp (Topping L30ii or a JDS Atom) will still be in your budget.

Have a proper think about what you want to achieve. Good luck

 

[FilipNone]

Hi, there are some decent turntables in your budget: Audio Technica make a range, including some direct drive models with built in phono amp and the option to upgrade cartridge later - like the AT-LP120XUSB. Rega or Pro-ject have a different aesthetic that you may also prefer and are fine too. Just accept the stock cartridges for now.

Before you go shopping though, think about what you are trying to achieve. You absolutely will not get better sound quality from vinyl compared to CDs, it just doesn't happen.
There is a small exception, when the mastering of the CD recording is poor and the mastering of the vinyl equivalent is good. That's pretty rare though, and it is extremely difficult to research and find out. Classical recordings especially are almost always very good on CD.

I don't think a turntable will give you what you want, and finding that out is expensive (new vinyl is 20-30 eur .... doesn't take long to build up a large bill).

Your Topping is good and your headphones are not bad: https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/hifiman-edition-xs.50219/
The headphones would benefit from some adjustment - PEQ - and that would be a good place to start.

What is your source for music? A CD player into the Topping, or do you stream music (including ripped CDs) from something like a PC?
If you use a PC then there is plenty of good, free, software that can help.
You can try a Qudelix headphone amp: https://audiosciencereview.com/forum/index.php?threads/qudelix-5k-bluetooth-dac-headphone-amp.17386/

Otherwise it's a bit trickier, but something like a WiiM Pro Plus and a Headphone amp (Topping L30ii or a JDS Atom) will still be in your budget.

Have a proper think about what you want to achieve. Good luck

Hi, thanks for the help.
As I mentioned before, "Concerto grosso for the New Trolls" has a CD recording, but compared to a recording I found on the internet of a vinyl, it sounds better recorded to me and I can hear more details. the problem is that the recording has background noise, so I wanted to re-record it so I can enjoy it in the future. in addition I would like to make a small collection of my favourite albums just to have them on vinyl and see the record spinning
My main method of listening to music is by buying it from Qobuz, they have great recordings there, then I stream them from my computer via USB. I use Equalizer APO to tune my headphones with a Convolution EQ.

 

[Ste_S]

the problem is that the recording has background noise

That's vinyl!

I don't think vinyl is the way forward, if you want a quiet, well mastered version of the record. Looking at Discogs, there's 10 different CD versions of that recording. The Italian version, if you have that one, may not be tat good, and trying one of the Japanese pressings may be the way to go, if you haven't already https://www.discogs.com/master/10420-New-Trolls-Concerto-Grosso-Per-I-New-Trolls?format=CD

If you simply want to buy vinyl to collect and see the record spinning, then by all means do that.

 

[JeremyFife]

Hi, thanks for the help.
As I mentioned before, "Concerto grosso for the New Trolls" has a CD recording, but compared to a recording I found on the internet of a vinyl, it sounds better recorded to me and I can hear more details. the problem is that the recording has background noise, so I wanted to re-record it so I can enjoy it in the future. in addition I would like to make a small collection of my favourite albums just to have them on vinyl and see the record spinning
My main method of listening to music is by buying it from Qobuz, they have great recordings there, then I stream them from my computer via USB. I use Equalizer APO to tune my headphones with a Convolution EQ.

Sounds like you are well sorted for EQ

Vinyl is a choice, and it's your choice. I do agree that you should explore other CD versions for your Trolls album too.

 

[FilipNone]

That's vinyl!

I don't think vinyl is the way forward, if you want a quiet, well mastered version of the record. Looking at Discogs, there's 10 different CD versions of that recording. The Italian version, if you have that one, may not be tat good, and trying one of the Japanese pressings may be the way to go, if you haven't already https://www.discogs.com/master/10420-New-Trolls-Concerto-Grosso-Per-I-New-Trolls?format=CD

If you simply want to buy vinyl to collect and see the record spinning, then by all means do that.

I didn't thought about that at all.
Thank you very much, I will check if I had a bad recording year. Do you have any suggestion on which one should I try?

 

[DVDdoug]

I'm going to pile-on and also recommend against vinyl...

But if I was buying a turntable I would also consider the AT-LP120. It's direct drive so there are no belts or pulleys to wear out, and it comes ready-to-play with a cartridge and phono preamp, plus it has USB for digitizing records and the current version has Bluetooth).

Your budget seems about right to me. Unlike, say a CD player, there is a correlation between price and sound quality so I wouldn't go too-cheap, but on the other hand, you could spend $10,000 on a turntable, cartridge and preamp, and it still not going to sound as good as a cheap CD/DVD player or other digital source.

I have a 40-year old Technics direct drive and I've never had any trouble with it. Although it hasn't had a lot of use for that last few decades because I only use it to occasionally digitize a record that's not available digitally.

Traditionally, turntables came without a cartridge, and the (required) phono preamp was built-into the receiver. Not every modern receiver has one.

the problem is that the recording has background noise,

Noise is the biggest problem with vinyl. There are other limitations/weaknesses too but I grew-up with vinyl and the "snap", "crackle", and "pop" always annoyed me, even though most people didn't seem to be bothered by it. Some people, including some "audiophiles" still don't mind the noise. I could "live with" the other lower-level background noise, the occasional distortion, and frequency response variations, but with digital we don't have to!

If you digitize records there is specialized software to clean-up vinyl noise and it can do a pretty good job but the results usually don't sound as clean as a CD (or MP3).

There is a phono preamp with bult-in digital noise reduction but it's not cheap. I haven't heard it but if the CD (or other digital sources) had never been invented I'd probably buy one!

 

[Joe Smith]

If you do decide to try vinyl, the AT-120 mentioned above is a great choice IMO. Simple, non muss, no fuss, decent cartridge. Upgrade the stock stylus to 95 microline version for about $150 more. I have a lot of tables, mostly vintage, but the 120 is in my main nearfield system and performs beautifully there.

As mentioned above, sound is certainly variable in LPs but I have a large collection amassed over 55 years and I still enjoy using the medium a lot.

 

[Multicore]

Classical recordings especially are almost always very good on CD.

@JeremyFife is right here. You can get away with listening to bebop-ear jazz on vinyl. But for classical it's just not on.

I'd also suggest AT-LP120 if you want to get into The Vinyl Fashion Revival for its own sake. You might enjoy that. Just don't expect better sounding classical music.

 

[rank]

AT 120, largely sufficient. There are plenty of cheap second-hand ones like the Gründig PS 1010, Sony PS T15 or the Fisher series (made by Sanyo) of linear motors sold under many other brands like Thomson, Pathé Marconi. But you have to know how to troubleshoot them a little.

 

[Wolf11Man]

If you want vinyl to improve the sound, compared to CD, get a good used one for 150€ and spend the rest of your budged on a new pickup.
You will not hear any difference between a 200€ player and a 600€ one, but instandly notice what a 150€ cartride sounds like compared to a 350€ one.
Also, record player age well. The worst thing after 20 years may be the need for a new belt and a drop of oil for the main bearing. Most of the low cost (500€ for a new one is loco) new record player are cheap junk. If you buy used, but wise, like a basic Thorens, you will get many times the value of this new China plastic stuff.

 

[akamatsu]

Have a listen to the Rega P1. I believe it is within your budget. I know nothing about the rest of your system, but in the end, you would also need a phono preamp.

 

[Mikig]

I would go without hesitation on a Technics SL, you can find 1200 or 1210 starting from 400 euros used! They work great, easy to set up and whenever you want, you can resell them in 5 minutes. Otherwise Audio-Technica on the new you should be able to get by with that amount.

 

[mike70]

you don't need to listen to "pops and crackle" ... a decent manual cleaning or with a record cleaning machine is the way to go.

I use 50% vinyl and 50% digital and from my seat position i don´t listen to any noises with vinyl (background / crackle / whatever), unless a bad copy, of course.
You need to work for that? obviously, but it can be achieved.

 

[FilipNone]

I'm going to pile-on and also recommend against vinyl...

But if I was buying a turntable I would also consider the AT-LP120. It's direct drive so there are no belts or pulleys to wear out, and it comes ready-to-play with a cartridge and phono preamp, plus it has USB for digitizing records and the current version has Bluetooth).

Your budget seems about right to me. Unlike, say a CD player, there is a correlation between price and sound quality so I wouldn't go too-cheap, but on the other hand, you could spend $10,000 on a turntable, cartridge and preamp, and it still not going to sound as good as a cheap CD/DVD player or other digital source.

I have a 40-year old Technics direct drive and I've never had any trouble with it. Although it hasn't had a lot of use for that last few decades because I only use it to occasionally digitize a record that's not available digitally.

Traditionally, turntables came without a cartridge, and the (required) phono preamp was built-into the receiver. Not every modern receiver has one.


Noise is the biggest problem with vinyl. There are other limitations/weaknesses too but I grew-up with vinyl and the "snap", "crackle", and "pop" always annoyed me, even though most people didn't seem to be bothered by it. Some people, including some "audiophiles" still don't mind the noise. I could "live with" the other lower-level background noise, the occasional distortion, and frequency response variations, but with digital we don't have to!

If you digitize records there is specialized software to clean-up vinyl noise and it can do a pretty good job but the results usually don't sound as clean as a CD (or MP3).

There is a phono preamp with bult-in digital noise reduction but it's not cheap. I haven't heard it but if the CD (or other digital sources) had never been invented I'd probably buy one!

So I checked the CD I have of the New Trolls and it seems to be already a good Japanese record.

I don't think I'm going to buy a turntable for it, as it would only be for estetich in the end and I will stick just to the CD.

I don't agree with the MP3 factor, even if it has the maximum resolution I can clearly hear the lack of detail in the format compared to FLAC.

 

[FilipNone]

Thank you all for your help. I now have a clearer view of the world of turntables, but I think I will stick to CDs. Also on the journey of discovery I also finding out about SACD, I will try to stick to them when they are available, they sound so good