Best speakers in the world?

[andreasmaaan]

By the way, a guy on this forum just proved my point on another thread.
He has the 8351B and Focal Trio 6, he wrote that when you stand in front of them they are practically identical sounding,( even though they measure completely different)
How is this possible?

Your standard of "proof" is extremely low cf. scientific standards.

 

[Helicopter]

There are lots of problems with a sighted test. I won't elaborate right now. In a blind test, it is much easier for two devices that measure differently to sound the same than the other way around. That is possible because we don't actually hear very well.

Edit: If they measure the same, they are not going to sound differently in a blind test conducted properly.

 

[carnagymelton]

By the way, a guy on this forum just proved my point on another thread.
He has the 8351B and Focal Trio 6, he wrote that when you stand in front of them they are practically identical sounding,( even though they measure completely different)
How is this possible?

Oh that's simple, he believes that 2+2=5.

 

[richard12511]

FYI, that's not actually a setting that's available in the commercial product. It's just a demonstration from B&O of what the speaker's polar response would be if beamwidth control were (could be) switched off

Yeah I read that. Not sure why it was linked here, but good to see the operation modes are very effective.

 

[EchoChamber]

The 8351B or 8361A are my dream monitors.
Do you have a sub or do you feel they enough bass without?

Plenty of bass for my needs, really, it shakes my 1935 suburban house... And I have to watch the volume levels. Low distortion makes it easy to listen to them louder than I should. Play some Doja Cat or Trentemoller and you’ll see what I mean. Even my smaller 8030C’s sound very powerful and deep in my smaller attic room (It’s quite impressive). I don’t feel a need for subs, room reinforcement is plenty...

I did consider the larger 8361A’s (about 2K more), but I felt they would be overkill, and, call me vain, they are not supported by the Genelec Design stands which I really like. That speaker hanging look is very Cabasse like... And, they hide all the cables inside for a minimal, low clutter, look. Nice functional design that’s refreshing.

I’m a big fanboy, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. But yeah, best speakers ever!! :-D

Picture here (before better floor cable management).

 

[carnagymelton]

Mine...
View attachment 89656

Just an aesthetic pointer: cut each strip of blue tape into 3 small dots the size of an ant. Space them out in place of where the strip used to be.

 

[richard12511]

No, because they could be worth their price tag and then they'll probably be the best speakers in the world.
No ones saying they're as good as $10K speakers

Personally, I doubt the Focal's are as good as the Beolabs. Not only do the Focals not have 3 different modes of operation, but I would bet that 2 of the 3 Beolab 90 modes would be preferred by most over the Focals under blind conditions. Then you add that the B&O has a third mode that is better for parties/background music. Not a sure thing that the Beolab would be preferred, of course, but that's the speaker I'd have my money on.

The Utopias are far more overpriced than the Beloab 90, imo. I wouldn't pay $260,000 for the B&O, but I do think they're closer to being worth that than the Focals are.

 

[EchoChamber]

The price is pretty insane, why are you choosing them over other speakers at that price?
Also I would never buy a refurbished product especially at that price so you chose wisely.

Dealer markup is a big factor on the price and they are branded as a luxury product. Those 2 Manhattan stores cost real money... Fit an finish is also premium. These don’t affect sound quality AFAIK. That being said, I do like their modern outrageous look and would probably be tempted to buy them if I didn’t have anything better to do with my money... But are they better than my Genelec’s??...

 

[Helicopter]

Personally, I doubt the Focal's are as good as the Beolabs. Not only do the Focals not have 3 different modes of operation, but I would bet that 2 of the 3 Beolab 90 modes would be preferred by most over the Focals under blind conditions. Then you add that the B&O has a third mode that is better for parties/background music. Not a sure thing that the Beolab would be preferred, of course, but that's the speaker I'd have my money on.

The Utopias are far more overpriced than the Beloab 90, imo. I wouldn't pay $260,000 for the B&O, but I do think they're closer to being worth that than the Focals are.

I wouldn't be surprised if Focal Kanta No 3s with 16 inch powered DSP subs sound a lot like the big utopias.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

FYI, that's not actually a setting that's available in the commercial product. It's just a demonstration from B&O of what the speaker's polar response would be if beamwidth control were (could be) switched off

As I recall, there are three settings of the beam-width control available to users: Narrow, Wide, or Omni. Would not the Omni setting be the equivalent of switching off Beam Width Control?

 

[Helicopter]

Dealer markup is a big factor on the price and they are branded as a luxury product. Those 2 Manhattan stores cost real money... Fit an finish is also premium. These don’t affect sound quality AFAIK. That being said, I do like their modern outrageous look and would probably be tempted to buy them if I didn’t have anything better to do with my money... But are they better than my Genelec’s??...

The big Focal Utopias have hinges in the front of the cabinet and a popup camper crank in the back, so you can focus the drivers to fit your room and listening position. And they are perfectly finished by hand in France. I wouldn't de surprised if the cost of the cabinets alone is well into four figures. I'm sure the markup is is much higher too. It has to be to support everything like the shows and videos and research and stuff. I wouldn't think of putting them in a room under 1000 sq. ft.

 

[andreasmaaan]

As I recall, there are three settings of the beam-width control available to users: Narrow, Wide, or Omni. Would not the Omni setting be the equivalent of switching off Beam Width Control?

No doubt, yes. Or with some combination of drivers on/off (e.g. I suspect only one of the tweeters in the cluster of three is engaged in omni mode).

But the graph @richard12511 and I were discussing showed the speaker's polar response with only the front-firing units engaged. I think the fact they called this "Beam Width Control: Off" is what causes the confusion.

From the article:

Figures 2 and 3 show the directivity of the BeoLab 90 if you were to disable the Beam Width Control function entirely and just use the front woofer, midrange and tweeter by themselves (and therefore turn off the 15 other loudspeaker drivers in the system. It’s important to note that this is not possible in a production model loudspeaker – we did it as part of the initial measurements of the loudspeaker during the development process.

 

[EchoChamber]

The big Focal Utopias have hinges in the front of the cabinet and a popup camper crank in the back, so you can focus the drivers to fit your room and listening position. And they are perfectly finished by hand in France. I wouldn't de surprised if the cost of the cabinets alone is well into four figures. I'm sure the markup is is much higher too. It has to be to support everything like the shows and videos and research and stuff. I wouldn't think of putting them in a room under 1000 sq. ft.

They are huge though... And lack modern technologies such as optimized amplification and room correction. I’m sure they sound amazing as passive speakers, but we can do better.

 

[TankTop]

I wouldn't be surprised if Focal Kanta No 3s with 16 inch powered DSP subs sound a lot like the big utopias.

I listened to Kanta No 2’s with a Rel 812 being used to reinforce the bass rather than as a sub in medium room. They were jaw dropping and visceral, I’ve heard louder and deeper bass but nothing compared to the speed and accuracy, it was almost nauseating. The room was probably under 800 ft.² with the speakers about 1/3 of the way in and the listening position about 8’ away, nothing like your wife would let you do in your own home.

 

[Helicopter]

They are huge though... And lack modern technologies such as optimized amplification and room correction. I’m sure they sound amazing as passive speakers, but we can do better.

Oh I agree. I wouldn't get them for $30k if I had to keep them.

 

[Helicopter]

Kantas with the plastic baffles look like the best to me. The 2 hour factory tour video indicated they are going to be making more complex shapes from MDF soon, and I suspect the higher models will be more like them in the coming years.

 

[Pearljam5000]

Plenty of bass for my needs, really, it shakes my 1935 suburban house... And I have to watch the volume levels. Low distortion makes it easy to listen to them louder than I should. Play some Doja Cat or Trentemoller and you’ll see what I mean. Even my smaller 8030C’s sound very powerful and deep in my smaller attic room (It’s quite impressive). I don’t feel a need for subs, room reinforcement is plenty...

I did consider the larger 8361A’s (about 2K more), but I felt they would be overkill, and, call me vain, they are not supported by the Genelec Design stands which I really like. That speaker hanging look is very Cabasse like... And, they hide all the cables inside for a minimal, low clutter, look. Nice functional design that’s refreshing.

I’m a big fanboy, so take everything I say with a grain of salt. But yeah, best speakers ever!! :-D

Picture here (before better floor cable management).

I'm a huge Genelec fanboy myself , the room looks stunning.

 

[paddycrow]

The big Utopias weigh 584 lbs apiece, but that's pretty svelte compared to the 1000 lbs Magico M9.

 

[Ken1951]

No doubt it didn't hurt that the listening space was more akin than a typical living room to the kind of space you'd normally find a grand piano in

It was a really huge room, wood floors, but with oriental rugs, curtains with sheer drapes, and a few pieces of furniture.

 

[Ken1951]

The hi-end Infinity's sounded amazing back in the day. Around what year was this?

Near as I can recall it was circa 1986-87.