OP
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- #21
Yes but direct sales only I believe?
Keith
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Best Passive loudspeaker designs!
- Thread starter Purité Audio
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Keith
OP
- Thread Starter
- #22
Again direct sales, which I understand makes perfect sense for the manufacturer.
Keith
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OP
- Thread Starter
- #23
Any measurements for the newish Fink ‘Epos’?
Keith
Keith
staticV3
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Epos ES 14 N - best passive Speaker in SpiNorama.org so far? (7.4/10 with equalisation without subwoofer)
The brief but exciting listening experience with the Wilson Sasha V on Saturday (Deutsche HiFi Tage 2023 in Darmstadt, Germany) got me thinking. Why does it sound so pure in tone? Then I thought about the one-hour german podcast kHz & Bitgeflüster Episode #12: The perfect loudspeaker - And why...
www.audiosciencereview.com
The absence of vertical off-axis measurements is a bit suspicious.
Edit: looks like a weak spot
OP
- Thread Starter
- #25
Thanks Static, we are getting a pair of these, which are passive but at £80k a pair …
Actually they aren’t released yet, we are getting these,
Keith
Actually they aren’t released yet, we are getting these,
Keith
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I get it, you are looking for something you can sell so direct sales don't work. Revel speakers test well, but the future of the company is in doubt.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #27
Yes exactly, also Revel are distributed by the same mob as JBL who are just useless, twenty years ago a chap ( who I know) gave the whole Harman portfolio to one retailer to ‘distribute ‘, in recent times they have swapped to Arcam? whom they acquired but they don’t appear to be any better.
Keith
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Focal tends to make well measuring passive speakers and has favorable EU pricing (compared to US). Although I don't know what it's like to sell that brand.
I have a pair of the Elac Uni-Fi Reference UBR-62 Speakers. Overall they are good and I like them, but the midrange is being pushed hard at its low end, and just missing some dynamics. Elac's published specifications indicate the low-mid crossover frequency is 260 Hz. I measured mine, and they are crossed over at 200 Hz, and this is done with a first order high pass filter. Coincidentally, the Uni-Fi reference towers are specified to crossover at 200 Hz. So, I don't know whether the wrong crossovers were put in my speakers, or the published specifications are incorrect.
The best-measuring passive loudspeakers I have encountered happen to be something I was already a dealer for: SoundLab. I was on the factory floor one day when they were playing pink noise through a speaker that was going to be shipped in the next few days.
The factory was essentially a small metal warehouse, maybe 14 meters by 16 meters, and the ceiling was maybe 4 meters. The speaker was off to one side along the long wall, toed-in pretty far, and a microphone was set up unusually far in front of the speaker, maybe 2.5 to 3 meters. The microphone was connected to a spectrum analyzer, and they were playing pink noise through the speaker.
I walked over and looked at the spectrum analyzer and was astounded by what I saw. The curve was hashy of course, being an ungated and unsmoothed in-room curve, but aside from the hash it almost looked like it had been drawn with a ruler. Except for a +/- 2 or 3 dB up/down jog around 500 Hz, the response sloped gently and uniformly downward by about 3 dB per decade from somewhere in the 20's to about 20 kHz. The up/down jog spanned about 1/3 octave, if that much, so the ear's averaging characteristic would tend to average it out; in other words, that anomaly LOOKED worse to the eye than how the ear would perceive it.
I have some experience with frequency response measurements and have NEVER seen an unsmoothed ungated in-room measurement that good, before or since.
I asked Roger West (the designer) why in the world he didn't publish his speaker's frequency response measurements. He told me that he was afraid someone would measure his speakers and do so improperly and get a different result, and then accuse him of posting fabricated measurements.
So unfortunately the opportunity is not there for showing customers an impressive set of measurements. Imo the main "objective-analysis based" selling points of the SoundLabs have to do with their radiation pattern, let me know if you'd like me to elaborate.
The factory was essentially a small metal warehouse, maybe 14 meters by 16 meters, and the ceiling was maybe 4 meters. The speaker was off to one side along the long wall, toed-in pretty far, and a microphone was set up unusually far in front of the speaker, maybe 2.5 to 3 meters. The microphone was connected to a spectrum analyzer, and they were playing pink noise through the speaker.
I walked over and looked at the spectrum analyzer and was astounded by what I saw. The curve was hashy of course, being an ungated and unsmoothed in-room curve, but aside from the hash it almost looked like it had been drawn with a ruler. Except for a +/- 2 or 3 dB up/down jog around 500 Hz, the response sloped gently and uniformly downward by about 3 dB per decade from somewhere in the 20's to about 20 kHz. The up/down jog spanned about 1/3 octave, if that much, so the ear's averaging characteristic would tend to average it out; in other words, that anomaly LOOKED worse to the eye than how the ear would perceive it.
I have some experience with frequency response measurements and have NEVER seen an unsmoothed ungated in-room measurement that good, before or since.
I asked Roger West (the designer) why in the world he didn't publish his speaker's frequency response measurements. He told me that he was afraid someone would measure his speakers and do so improperly and get a different result, and then accuse him of posting fabricated measurements.
So unfortunately the opportunity is not there for showing customers an impressive set of measurements. Imo the main "objective-analysis based" selling points of the SoundLabs have to do with their radiation pattern, let me know if you'd like me to elaborate.
Count Arthur
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Erin has been quite positive about several Wharfedale models:
They are widely available though, so I'm not sure if that would make them not "special" enough for you to stock.
Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary Speaker Review
Wharfedale Linton 85th Anniversary Review
www.erinsaudiocorner.com
They are widely available though, so I'm not sure if that would make them not "special" enough for you to stock.
I understand several questions/comments about measurements. But I wonder how anyone that doesn't accurately measure for themselves (which isn't a small feat with speakers), in *their* environment, can 200% establish if those measurements are (a) valid in their room, and furthermore (b) entirely neutral. Speakers are probably the most relevantly "subject-ivvy" (tried to coin a new adjective there) in any chain.
I do agree with many of the brands that have been put forward here, though, they have been repeatedly recommended and have good reputation - and the latter matters especially with speakers.
Just my 2c
I do agree with many of the brands that have been put forward here, though, they have been repeatedly recommended and have good reputation - and the latter matters especially with speakers.
Just my 2c
Loads of stockists, but I'm not sure how many could do a proper dem.
OP
- Thread Starter
- #36
March appears to have made a fine effort with his Purifi based ‘Sointuvas’
Keith
staticV3
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We also have measurements of the upgraded Sointuva AWG, which is even flatter on-axis and with more bass extension:
Measurements for speaker March Audio Sointuva AWG
www.spinorama.org
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OP
DTTOM37
Active Member
As Lars Risbo let slip through FB last week, there may be in forseeable future some plans and the tweeter arriving from the SPK16 reference model.
"Working hard on getting the tweeter in production. After that we will update spk16 and publish plans. The waiting time is painful for us all
DanielT
Master Contributor
One can wonder why this is the case. Why does no manufacturer of passive speakers seem to make as good measuring speakers (regarding ALL their models) as a manufacturer of active speakers such as for example Genelec makes?
I have a guess as to what this is due to.
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