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Best AV Processor under $3k? Lexicon MC-10, Anthem AVM 60, or something else?

witchdoctor

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Well that's true. But me and the others reading on this forum and the other ones I'm active on, don't buy a processor based on those reviews.

If I can't get a good review on the AVM70, I'll end buying the Emotiva or Monoprice, nothing more to that but a loss for Anthem.

The one takeaway I got from the processor reviews is don't buy them just on measurements, buy them for the features you need.
 

Sleipner

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The one takeaway I got from the processor reviews is don't buy them just on measurements, buy them for the features you need.

Will then we have different needs, nothing wrong with that. I look at the combination of the two.
 

witchdoctor

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Will then we have different needs, nothing wrong with that. I look at the combination of the two.

I have all Paradigm Active speakers in my HT and an Anthem processor would match perfectly. I have an Anthem amp with ARC and really like it. So that is a + feature. The Anthem 2 channel preamp has balanced input but the processors don't, that's a feature I wish was on the processor for me. Ultimately I;ll go to the dealer and compare.
 

Twisteddzyne

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Thank you for the compliment - they're a wonderful Team - you can read the history and science behind ARC here:
https://www.anthemarc.com/advanced-topics/the-history-of-arc.php
https://www.anthemarc.com/advanced-topics/the-science-of-arc.php

ARC is measured around the listening position. Pardon my crude drawing on the screenshot...
ARC Genesis will walk you through where to place the mic in a perfect room, but to know How to place the mic and also place it in unconventional rooms is crucial.

For quick Bullet Points on Mic Placement if your seating position is like how illustrated in the photo:
  • First Position
    • Mic should be set at ear height in or near the main seating position
    • This captures the main image of the room
    • If the back of the chair/couch is higher than your ear, make sure the mic is above the back of the seat cushion so that it's not obstructed
  • Position 2-5
    • Doesn't matter which way you go with the mic, you can follow the diagram as it walks you through in Genesis, you just need to remember which position was which if you do not follow the diagram.
    • Place the mic 2 feet out from the Center in an "X" formation around Position #1 like I attempted to illustrate in the Screenshot
    • Change the height of the mic going 1-2 feet lower or higher than ear height and alternate that at each mic position.
    • If the mic is raised at position 2, go 1-2 feet lower than ear height at position 3.
    • Keep the mic at that height and go to position 4 following the Genesis diagram.
    • Then raise the mic 1-2 feet above ear height for position 5
    • Again, all positions 2 feet out from position 1
For Couch Against the back wall:
  • First Position
    • Place mic at ear height 3 Feet out from the wall in line with the center/main listening position
  • Position 2-5
    • works just like above except you're moving in a W or M form (whichever way you look at it) instead of the "X" Pattern
For a big Multi-Tier Theater Room:
  • Essentially do two "X" Patterns
    • ARC can go up to 10 Mic Positions
    • We recommend 5 for most areas/rooms
      • I have never used more than five positions in any room I've demoed in at trade shows or Dealer Showrooms.
      • You still measure your "X" around the "money seat" in a big theater and then do the same thing behind that picking which row you want to work from depending on how many rows there are.
This is a pretty crude explanation, but again, I can clarify if needed. Hopefully this gets people closer to nirvana with great consistent results.
Chris can the new avm 70 do a 5.1.4 with only rear surrounds enabled?
 

cbrents73

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Chris can the new avm 70 do a 5.1.4 with only rear surrounds enabled?

Sorry, am a little confused by the question. 5.1.4 with only rear surrounds enabled is a 5.1 system - the .4 part is the Atmos channels. Are you asking if 5.1 will still process Atmos? If you download ARC Genesis https://anthemarc.com there is a "Demo Mode" you can run in ARC on the 1120 Receiver and play with all of the settings and configurations without having to have an actual unit. Obviously, the new Generation of product will have more functionality, but overall the setup should be similar. It's in ARC where we typically define the parameters of the system - how many rears, Atmos channels there are, and how and where they are placed (see screenshot of ARC Genesis attached). Let me know if you have any further questions.
Thanks,
Chris
 

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cbrents73

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Sorry, am a little confused by the question. 5.1.4 with only rear surrounds enabled is a 5.1 system - the .4 part is the Atmos channels. Are you asking if 5.1 will still process Atmos? If you download ARC Genesis https://anthemarc.com there is a "Demo Mode" you can run in ARC on the 1120 Receiver and play with all of the settings and configurations without having to have an actual unit. Obviously, the new Generation of product will have more functionality, but overall it the setup should be similar. It's in ARC where we typically define the parameters of the system - how many rears, Atmos channels there are, and how and where they are placed (see screenshot of ARC Genesis attached). Let me know if you have any further questions.
Thanks,
Chris
Chris can the new avm 70 do a 5.1.4 with only rear surrounds enabled?

Meant to add; you can also create up to four profiles within ARC to change the configurations and assign them to various inputs - where you can create up to 30 virtual inputs allowing one source to have multiple inputs and configurations. This allows you to only have to change inputs based on how you label them in order to change to what you want, not create a 100 macros in a control system or on a remote to change the parameters in the input. This works for our MRX Receivers, AV Processors, and our STR Preamp and Integrated Amp.
 

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Jinjuku

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I never realized this is such a pain-point for everyone here? If no one wants to believe that there is any break in with equipment, regardless of what it is, I'm totally fine with that and have absolutely no problem with it.

The real issue is that everyone here has burned in equipment. I've never understood the argument. By the sheer fact of use everyone has 'burned in' equipment.

I also think it may take 300 hours for someone's hearing to become habituated.
 

Jinjuku

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I'd throw the Marantz AV7705 on the list. For the $1200 saved you could do a lot with room treatements that would make the XT32 room correction that much better.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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In my experience with all of them, ARC is the best for brain-dead auto correction setup for people that don't want to mess around. Their heuristics for automatically generating filters and crossovers are brilliant.

Dirac is best for its extra secret sauce in handling multi-reflections, etc but requires some tweaking after auto correction but can sound better than ARC even with tweaking.

Audyssey can be tweaked to 90%+ of either of the above but requires tweaking and some learning curve to get the best out of it and sometimes fighting with unintended consequences with its Dynamic EQ feature, etc. Not as good as others for surround sounds but not deficient by any means.
Guess I'm brain dead. Gee, ARC doesn't allow extensive tweaking?
 

Vasr

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Guess I'm brain dead. Gee, ARC doesn't allow extensive tweaking?

It does but that wasn't what I was saying. ARC gives the best results without any tweaking and great for people who don't want to bother.

If tweaking is on the table for the user, Dirac gives the best results out of them.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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Yes, Audyssey allows you to set the frequency point where eq is effective so you can pick your poison. Some insist that eq should only be used in the base range and others believe in full range. Both have their points, in many of Amirs reviews he discusses where speaker X has problems in its frequency response and a bit of tweaking here and there provides a much improved listening experience. The software designers have to strike a balance between ease of use and complexity. Being able to decide the width of filters is a excellent option but then we begin to cross the line where Joe Sixpack is outside of his comfort zone and he doesn't want to study for 6 months to understand how to make his system sound it's best. Ideally a user would just setup a mic, push a button and walk away and as the software routines become smarter and smarter a some point we will get there. Maybe ending with a program that leaves us with a small number of options like flat, warm, bright, etc. As it stands now we have been discussing 3 or 4 of the semi-automated options that are at the very bottom of the DRC food chain. They all have strengths and weakness and the final results can vary from excellent to poor with all of them depending on a number of variables. There is quite a number of much better room eq solutions out there but they depend on a much higher level of user knowledge and invested time than even the large percent of members here are willing to invest.
That is the problem. ARC eliminates endless tweaking. My experience with Audyssey over the decades was more miserable than my two divorces without a prenup. When an ex comes back and proclaims things will be different, run, don't walk, to Barrow, Alaska.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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All equipment has a break-in period - most just don't know how long it is or don't discuss it...Breaking equipment in also means having a signal playing through it, not just being turned on. The signal playing through it also doesn't have to be loud. If you can put your ear up to the speaker and hear sound coming out, it's breaking in. Thanks!
Myth
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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A number of us internally have done it. When we do trade shows, we do try to burn in our equipment before auditioning it. We recommend our Dealers do it. Good Dealers will talk about it with all of the equipment they sell and usually know the amount of time on all of their products.

To reiterate, break in happens with ALL equipment, but the better the equipment is, the more obvious the differences are.

None of this is new info. Lots of manufacturers can tell you how much break in is required of their equipment.
Sounds like good sales pitch. I think break in is psychological.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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If there's one thing I've learned from this industry - spec's don't mean squat. It can give you an idea of what it's like, but doesn't show the whole picture. You just have to trust your ears, and if you can't hear then I would say find a new hobby because your ears are the only instrument worth believing. Things either sound better or they don't. If it's close, then is it worth the amount of money you're looking at paying?

We are value oriented company trying to give the biggest bang for the dollar spent, but I think a lot of companies try to be what we are. This should be about having fun and enjoying what you're watching or listening to. If receivers were the proper way to build a device to recreate sound, separates wouldn't exist if they weren't truly better. At the end of the day, if you can't hear or tell the difference, then simply don't buy it. I don't think it's any harder than that, I but some people in this industry sure try to make it be...
I purchased Mrx 520. Been at this frustrating hobby before your birth. After I ran ARC, nirvana. At my age, I have become Anthem fan boy.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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Look, I'm totally sorry about all this to all of you - I'm only trying to help, really! I'm not here for anything other than to share the love of our industry and be of help for those that have questions. I don't get paid to be on this site - this part is the hobby for me - not the profession. Maybe I should've remained anonymous, but I want people to feel they can engage with us or any of our Dealers to get what you need. Going to our Dealers is ultimately what I would like to happen the most, but I want to be an ear when someone isn't getting all that they need.

I'll keep my opinions to myself and just try to give answers to what's asked - deal?
Ohhhh, don't worry. You just need to be "woke" politically correct. Otherwise, you will be censored. The post baby boom generation is easily offended. Just agree with them and address everyone as "it" and you will have no problems.
 

Alice of Old Vincennes

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I got to say friends, I have lost all confidence in Emotiva's engineering department. Yes HDMI, HomeTheater codecs, and all the rest of a AVR's required tasks add up to a very complicated stack of software and hardware, without a doubt IMHO, the hardest to stack to implement well in home audio. But that's not an excuse, AFAIK all the other guys have been fairly successful in bringing their products to market in a reasonably reliable manner.. Over the last 10 years I've owned a super cheapo BOTL Pioneer VSX-822-K reciever plus Marantz 7701 and 7703 pre-pros, none of the 3 have exhibited any real software or hardware failures that made the products troublesome to use. They have all been able to perform there advertised tasks without a major issue.
I don't like to beat up on Emotiva, I have the Emotiva DC-1 DAC that I loaned to Amir 3 years ago to test and it ran for him and me without software issues to comment on. It did have some built shortcomings to talk about but over the last 5 years it's performed for me perfectly both as a DAC, excellent headphone amp, and minimalist 2 channel remote controlled preamp.
I don't know how well Emo's other products have performed on the market but I haven't heard all the complaining on their amps, preamps, etc I have for years now on there HT front ends. It's well past time for them to pull their heads out of their **** and get the HT gear performing before it destroys their entire image..
I don't mean to hurt anyones feelings but this is simply the way I see things, I could in no way ever recommend a Emo HT front end to anyone I liked.
YMMV


Why, Denon-Marantz has offered it for years along with many others? And after years of stagnation it appears to be catching on in the multich music world.

Again why, others don't seem to have any issues bringing it to market this year?

Better get off the pot here too. In the 2 ch world along with the multich, having 2 or more subwoofers has began to be the norm for putting together a smooth deep base response system. For that you'll need DLBC, Audyssey's been doing it for years now.

:facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm::facepalm:
Emo censors complaints on their site. XPR sucked.
 
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