Behringer NX1000D Review (Stereo Amplifier)

[hyperlogik]

Does anyone who has had hands on the thing think a completely passive cooling modification might be viable? Maybe something employing a good chunk of the free space and (while it would be a faff to re-open) maybe thermal epoxyed to the inside of the case. Or would you need to rehouse the thing to devote enough space to the heatsink?

 

[Cote Dazur]

Would this be a good option to use with a passive subwoofer, bridged in mono and using the filter/crossover function to taylor the output?
What would be other good alternatives?

 

[sarumbear]

Would this be a good option to use with a passive subwoofer, bridged in mono and using the filter/crossover function to taylor the output?
What would be other good alternatives?

If you can tolerate the fan noise.

 

[djtetei]

How did they get their 300 watt number? Using car stereo "standards?"

Music Group, the current owner of Labgruppen and Behringer brands, officially states that all their amplifiers power ratings are stated as maximum/ peak power into the specific load and the expected continous power would be about half of the declared max power.

https://community.musictribe.com/pages/kba?articlePublicNumber=KA-02240&brand=Behringer

 

[sarumbear]

Music Group, the current owner of Labgruppen and Behringer brands, officially states that all their amplifiers power ratings are stated as maximum/ peak power into the specific load and the expected continous power would be about half of the declared max power.

Do they defined the duration of the peak? One frequency cycle, 1sec, etc. and at what frequency? Otherwise we are back to the 90s battery powered boomboxes that is sold to have 1,000W...

 

[djtetei]

Here are the official specifications as declared by the manufacturer:

And here is their official statement about power ratings:
"We no longer list our amp power ratings by RMS as these tend to not give true results as tests are always done using signal generators and specific waveforms which don't reflect in comparison to music, music comes at fuller frequencies and non linear dynamics which of course as I'm sure you're aware is nothing like a test tone generated from a signal generator. There are lots of topics on the internet about this should you wish to look into it more."

On this thread you can read about my interactions with their officiais.

BEHRINGER KM750 & KM1700 official specifications vs actual specifications

I was interested in acquiring some additional information about those two models from the manufacturer before making a decision to buy, because I wanted to ensure at least 3 dB of headroom between the speakers rated average power and the amplifier rated average power, so here are my findings...

www.audiosciencereview.com

 

[sarumbear]

Here are the official specifications as declared by the manufacturer:
View attachment 218746View attachment 218747View attachment 218748
And here is their official statement about power ratings:
"We no longer list our amp power ratings by RMS as these tend to not give true results as tests are always done using signal generators and specific waveforms which don't reflect in comparison to music, music comes at fuller frequencies and non linear dynamics which of course as I'm sure you're aware is nothing like a test tone generated from a signal generator. There are lots of topics on the internet about this should you wish to look into it more."

There is still no information about how they measure. They only say how they do not measure.

On this thread you can read about my interactions with their officiais.

BEHRINGER KM750 & KM1700 official specifications vs actual specifications

I was interested in acquiring some additional information about those two models from the manufacturer before making a decision to buy, because I wanted to ensure at least 3 dB of headroom between the speakers rated average power and the amplifier rated average power, so here are my findings...

www.audiosciencereview.com

Which member on that thread represents Behringer?

 

[djtetei]

Behringer

Mr Kyle Johnson - Music Tribe Customer Solutions Specialist

 

[sarumbear]

Mr Kyle Johnson - Music Tribe Customer Solutions Specialist

What is his profile name? There are no names used on ASR.

 

[djtetei]

As a side note, I went into a music equipment store, about 300 km from my city, and asked for a Behringer KM 750 to measure its output voltage, without any load. I sent a 1 kHz, 400 kHz and 50 kHz sine tones to the amplifier RCA inputs, sensitivity set to 0.775, gain controls set to maximum, and with an input signal of 1 Vrms (clip lights still off), the true RMS digital multimeter measured 40 V RMS output.

 

[djtetei]

What is his profile name? There are no names used on ASR.

Mr. Kyle Johnson is not a member of this community.
The conversations and his statements were sent to me, to my personal email address, as I opened an assistance requests on Behringer customer support page.

 

[sarumbear]

As a side note, I went into a music equipment store, about 300 km from my city, and asked for a Behringer KM 750 to measure its output voltage, without any load. I sent a 1 kHz, 400 kHz and 50 kHz sine tones to the amplifier RCA inputs, sensitivity set to 0.775, gain controls set to maximum, and with an input signal of 1 Vrms (clip lights still off), the true RMS digital multimeter measured 40 V RMS output.

It looks like a wasted journey as you learned nothing about the power capacity of the amplifier.

 

[sarumbear]

Mr. Kyle Johnson is not a member of this community.
The conversations and his statements were sent to me, to my personal email address, as I opened an assistance requests on Behringer customer support page.

I misunderstood when you said "On this thread you can read about my interactions with their officiais"

 

[djtetei]

Behringer usually state their THD measurements with 1 kHz tone at 50 % max power, while Labgruppen state their THD measurements with 1 kHz tone at 1 dB below max rated power.

 

[djtetei]

It looks like a wasted journey as you learned nothing about the power capacity of the amplifier.

In a perfect world, a high quality amplifier will be able to deliver its no load voltage into any load the amplifier is designed to operate with.
In the real world, one could only guess, estimate or put the equipment to private test equipment to find any current limitations.

 

[sarumbear]

Behringer usually state their THD measurements with 1 kHz tone at 50 % max power, while Labgruppen state their THD measurements with 1 kHz tone at 1 dB below max rated power.

The question is the power rating not distortion. How does Behringer measure their advertised ratings?

 

[djtetei]

How does Behringer measure their advertised ratings?

None of their products user manuals ever mention the testing conditions used.
I will open another support ticket on their customer support page and ask directly about it, but I don't expect a straight answer from Behringer regarding their specific testing procedures. Behringer shy away from disclosing technical details about their products, claiming know-how protection. They also decline any requests for technical drawings and block diagrams, claiming that users may get injured if they try to temper or repair the product on own. All customers are urged to contact local Behringer service centers, which are very few and very slow to respond to service requests, even ignorant sometimes.

 

[sarumbear]

None of their products user manuals ever mention the testing conditions used.
I will open another support ticket on their customer support page and ask directly about it, but I don't expect a straight answer from Behringer regarding their specific testing procedures.

Without defining what they mean by peak, their values are meaningless. We should then place them in the same league as these liars.

Street Blaster X Boombox Speaker - 1000W NFC/Wireless Bluetooth Compatible Portable Outdoor Stereo w/Rechargeable Battery, AUX USB FM Radio MP3 System, Microphone in, LED Lights - Pyle PBMSPG200V2 : Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo

Street Blaster X Boombox Speaker - 1000W NFC/Wireless Bluetooth Compatible Portable Outdoor Stereo w/Rechargeable Battery, AUX USB FM Radio MP3 System, Microphone in, LED Lights - Pyle PBMSPG200V2 : Amazon.co.uk: Electronics & Photo

www.amazon.co.uk

 

[djtetei]

The problem is not so simple.
Yes, you can call them liars because they do not disclose the exact testing and measurement procedures and claim "about" values, but, on the other hand you can't called them liars, because they are not obligated under any law to make such disclosures.
Even for the current product under review - Behringer NDX1000D, we can't say that Behringer lied, because knowing their statement about peak power ratings and expected RMS power measurements, the Behringer NDX1000D measured 148 watt RMS (about half the declared peak power) into 4 ohms and 78 watt RMS (about half the declared peak power rating) into 8 ohms, under test.
Over the years, Behringer products were something of a hit or miss regarding quality control policies, reliability and, especially, customer support. Only recently they tried to improve their image, improving the quality control policies, but the customer support and parts availability are still very problematic. If one has a problem with a Behringer product and requires service, he must be prepared to wait months for a resolution. This can be very frustrating for someone who's business is live event performance or professional music production.

 

[sarumbear]

The problem is not so simple.
Yes, you can call them liars because they do not disclose the exact testing and measurement procedures and claim "about" values, but, on the other hand you can't called them liars, because they are not obligated under any law to make such disclosures.

What about this FTC rule?