B&O's Beolab 90 isit the speaker that could?

[iridium]

While my monitors were less perfect, but still more natural and relaxed.

Very good description.
Please note that I have never heard the B&O's Beolab 90, so members please do NOT do not take offense to the following.
There are many "PERFECT" speakers out there, but they are kind of like a lot of "PERFECT WIVES"; how long do they stay PERFECT after the honeymoon!

iridium.

 

[Sal1950]

Do you have horns?

I did. Had to sell that whole rig off for my move to FL. No room for stuff that size here.
My current HSU's have horns on the top.

 

[oivavoi]

Very good description.
Please note that I have never heard the B&O's Beolab 90, so members please do NOT do not take offense to the following.
There are many "PERFECT" speakers out there, but they are kind of like a lot of "PERFECT WIVES"; how long do they stay PERFECT after the honeymoon!

iridium.

I think that a speaker which measured perfectly also would sound perfect. But I'm not sure whether current measurements - or at least not the most common measurements - say all there is to say about how something sounds. Simple frequency plots are not even close to saying everything for example. What I wonder about the Beolabs, is whether there are very subtle forms of driver distortion going on there which are hard to measure. But maybe not.

 

[oivavoi]

Btw, just saw that Siegfried Linkwitz has got to hear the Beolabs, and posted listening impressions on his site:

"Yesterday, late afternoon, I had the opportunity to listen to these speakers for about half an hour using excerpts from a wide variety of my own demo material, which I had brought with me on a thumb drive. My conclusion: Excellent performance in aspects of neutrality of timbre, of dynamic range, of resolution at all levels, of attack and decay, of spatial rendering in width, depth and focus !!!
The BeoLab90 tops what I have heard from any commercial loudspeaker!

My slight reservations are with the bottom end. Bass is tight, explosive but lacks in spaciousness, which I hear rendered from a dipole bass like in the LX521.4. In fairness, though, I must say that the speakers were set up about 9 feet apart, against a long wall and firing across a narrow (15 feet wide?) store room in Stanford Shopping Center. So plenty of open space to the left and right of the speakers, but little room left behind a listener in the equilateral triangle sweet spot. I prefer a setup where the speaker fires along the long direction of the room".

 

[Purité Audio]

I have large horns here, they do sound different, not totally and the ones I use don't have any obvious colourations, voices are not 'cupped' and there is no honk but the presentation is different.
Keith

 

[oivavoi]

I have large horns here, they do sound different, not totally and the ones I use don't have any obvious colourations, voices are not 'cupped' and there is no honk but the presentation is different.
Keith

What horns are that? And are you able to describe in some more detail the differences you perceive between their presentation, and speakers such as the Kiis/LS1/Beolabs?

 

[Cosmik]

...it was as if the Beolabs had put on a lot of make-up to look perfect. While my monitors were less perfect, but still more natural and relaxed.

This might only be me, or it might be something objective. I don't know. FWIW, it gave me the same feeling I've gotten from listening to some systems which have employed room correction rather heavily. The imaging, staging and holography can be very impressive, but it introduces something into the presentation which feels strange - at least for me. I have a hunch that too much EQ can lead to artificiality in a speaker. But it's only a hunch. Would love to see some measurements on this.

The Beolabs use "Active Room Compensation" where an app apparently guides you through a process of placing the mic and measuring test tones. And then there are tone controls, parametric equaliser, peaking filters, shelving filters, loudness contours etc. etc. It must be the case that in any audition, you may be hearing a completely different speaker from the one someone else has heard.

 

[Purité Audio]

What horns are that? And are you able to describe in some more detail the differences you perceive between their presentation, and speakers such as the Kiis/LS1/Beolabs?

It is interesting, firstly the Cessaro 'Liszt' horns are about eight feet tall so the sound physically ( midrange at least )emanates from higher up, the sound fills the room more, horns are not particularly directional .
Ralph ( Cessaro) keeps his horns short so you don't get the 1930's colouration you have with WE and GOTO's long horns.
Their disadvantages are size and cost!
Keith

 

[oivavoi]

It is interesting, firstly the Cessaro 'Liszt' horns are about eight feet tall so the sound physically ( midrange at least )emanates from higher up, the sound fills the room more, horns are not particularly directional .
Ralph ( Cessaro) keeps his horns short so you don't get the 1930's colouration you have with WE and GOTO's long horns.
Their disadvantages are size and cost!
Keith

Thanks. Interesting. Didn't know about that manufacturer. I believe the part of your statement that I've put in bold to be wrong, though. Horns can of course be designed to spread the sound waves to a larger area, especially with larger horns. But I do believe that one of the major reasons for using horns in the first place is because they are more directional than other loudspeaker designs.

 

[oivavoi]

The Beolabs use "Active Room Compensation" where an app apparently guides you through a process of placing the mic and measuring test tones. And then there are tone controls, parametric equaliser, peaking filters, shelving filters, loudness contours etc. etc. It must be the case that in any audition, you may be hearing a completely different speaker from the one someone else has heard.

Interesting, thanks. Didn't know that.

 

[Cosmik]

Interesting, thanks. Didn't know that.

If they were mine, I would be running them on default 'flat' settings, I suspect, and not messing about with any of the room correction and EQ. If I get the chance to hear them, I will request that they turn off the DRC.

 

[Purité Audio]

Thanks. Interesting. Didn't know about that manufacturer. I believe the part of your statement that I've put in bold to be wrong, though. Horns can of course be designed to spread the sound waves to a larger area, especially with larger horns. But I do believe that one of the major reasons for using horns in the first place is because they are more directional than other loudspeaker designs.

I think that is a common misconception, long horns can generate high sold, alpine horns for example, essentially horns are transformers,
Quote
A horn is an acoustic transformer.Just like a mechanical transformer(gear box in your car) or electrical transformer,it changes the acoustic impedance that the driver that is loaded with.A direct effect of this is a very big increase in efficiency,but since there is no free meal,you loose directivity(a good thing in my opinion)
and loose bandwidth(for a specific horn).also a good thing.
I believe this quote is correct,it mirrors my experience.
Keith

 

[dallasjustice]

That's a nice compliment. The LX is a world class speaker in its own right.

Btw, just saw that Siegfried Linkwitz has got to hear the Beolabs, and posted listening impressions on his site:

"Yesterday, late afternoon, I had the opportunity to listen to these speakers for about half an hour using excerpts from a wide variety of my own demo material, which I had brought with me on a thumb drive. My conclusion: Excellent performance in aspects of neutrality of timbre, of dynamic range, of resolution at all levels, of attack and decay, of spatial rendering in width, depth and focus !!!
The BeoLab90 tops what I have heard from any commercial loudspeaker!

My slight reservations are with the bottom end. Bass is tight, explosive but lacks in spaciousness, which I hear rendered from a dipole bass like in the LX521.4. In fairness, though, I must say that the speakers were set up about 9 feet apart, against a long wall and firing across a narrow (15 feet wide?) store room in Stanford Shopping Center. So plenty of open space to the left and right of the speakers, but little room left behind a listener in the equilateral triangle sweet spot. I prefer a setup where the speaker fires along the long direction of the room".

 

[Kal Rubinson]

If they were mine, I would be running them on default 'flat' settings, I suspect, and not messing about with any of the room correction and EQ. If I get the chance to hear them, I will request that they turn off the DRC.

Not possible as the default is a configured response curve that is not flat.

 

[dallasjustice]

Not possible as the default is a configured response curve that is not flat.

Also, folks often use the word "flat" as synonymous with accurate. IME and almost all others familiar with DSP targets, the flat target only looks good in step or amplitude graphs. Otherwise it sounds aggressive and bright. It's not the way to go.

 

[Cosmik]

Not possible as the default is a configured response curve that is not flat.

That's why I put it in 'quotes'.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

That's why I put it in 'quotes'.

OK. Just wanted to be clear since, in the past, some have confused the default response of the 90s by comparing it to a flat reference.

 

[RayDunzl]

OK. Just wanted to be clear since, in the past, some have confused the default response of the 90s by comparing it to a flat reference.

If they can't comprehend what you wrote then, how can you expect them to comprehend what you write now?

 

[Kal Rubinson]

If they can't comprehend what you wrote then, how can you expect them to comprehend what you write now?

No one is beyond hope (and I include myself).