Archaea
Active Member
My Onkyo 5508 has 132kHz/32 bit Burr-Brown DACs supposedly with their proprietary Vector Linear Shaping Circuitry (VLSC)
My Denon x6700h has the AK4458 8-channel DAC.
I would like to know how these DACs compare technically?
@peng @bigguyca
I fully know placebo can rule your mind in comparisons like this when you can't A/B immediately, but I've always liked the sound of the Onkyo 5508 compared to the Denon's I've owned for music (X4520CI, and X6700hH) with maybe the exception of my last (now sold) Denon X7200WA, which I think is on par with the Onkyo 5508 -- especially when I used my favorite Denon X4520CI audyssey mic for setup.
I can't really figure out why my preference stands. I'm using the same single Audyssey mic for all - as I've learned in the past when you find an Audyssey mic you like the sound follows it -- just keep it. The sound you like will follow you AVR to AVR since the AVR is tailoring your sound to that mic's inherit frequency response.
(22) A brief comparison between two Audyssey Multi EQ XT32 mics | AVS Forum
I'm using the same amp for my main speakers - in this case a Sherbourn 7-350 amplifier (and a Crown XLS 402 for the heights with the Onkyo) (or the onboard Denon amps for the heights with the Denon).
I'm toying with the various DSP and surround modes, stereo listening, pro-logic, dolby surround, multichannel stereo. etc.
Always fighting internally with that reembrace that I really liked the Onkyo for music playback and figuring this has got to be in my head, (and it still might be -- placebo being what it is), I grabbed my 5508 from my secondary bedroom system and set it up in my main system again, re-running Audyssey with my same mic from the same positions, and have been listening to music these last couple hours.
Yes, I like this Onkyo better than my Denon x6700h for music. When I first got the Denon x6700h I loved it for cinema, with the 13 discrete channels and Atmos and DTS-X, but from the very beginning I never fell in love with it for music.
What attribute is making me prefer this nearly 10 year old pre-pro for music over the Denon? Could the DACs be the key? More likely, admittedly it's placebo, or the specific music DSPs that I personally/subjectively like better on the Onkyo (since most of the time I listen to music with the DSP modes. I've compared amps, and even receivers blind A/B/C/D in stereo on several occasions and in fast switching I know I can't tell the difference between an Onkyo, Denon, and Pioneer with all processing off and just level matched stereo playback --- but here in this day's testing all processing is NOT off, and I'm listening with many speakers, with multiple layers of processing and DSP engaged -- so I probably talked myself towards the answer.
Audyssey is mostly off on both systems. Or on, at my choice and knowledge and testing. I like to tinker and constantly play with things. For this little comparison today I've just been listening to the AVR raw on the same "quickdemo' files from my NAS that I ALWAYS use to compare -- directly played by the each AVR over it's local network functionality and the built in AVR DAC. No external player...This is just the AVR playing my favorite MP3s, FLAC files etc from a network location with it's built in playback functionality.
This preference isn't bass levels or audyssey I constantly fidget with bass levels and adjust to taste remote in hand all the time. Is this likely just placebo? Probably -- reinforcing itself when I do these tests -- expect an opinion like that I like the onkyo better for music - come to that opinion with bias, and thus reinforce that opinion.
ughhh...even knowing that - - - this testing is going to make me want to change out AVRs again.
Do you think this is more likely to be something like the difference in DSPs? Or the difference in DACs?
How can you actually compare DACs - is there any website that has a rundown of the different DACs used by AVR manufacturers and how they compare directly? Burr Brown used to be all the rage, you don't see it advertised anymore.
My Denon x6700h has the AK4458 8-channel DAC.
I would like to know how these DACs compare technically?
@peng @bigguyca
I fully know placebo can rule your mind in comparisons like this when you can't A/B immediately, but I've always liked the sound of the Onkyo 5508 compared to the Denon's I've owned for music (X4520CI, and X6700hH) with maybe the exception of my last (now sold) Denon X7200WA, which I think is on par with the Onkyo 5508 -- especially when I used my favorite Denon X4520CI audyssey mic for setup.
I can't really figure out why my preference stands. I'm using the same single Audyssey mic for all - as I've learned in the past when you find an Audyssey mic you like the sound follows it -- just keep it. The sound you like will follow you AVR to AVR since the AVR is tailoring your sound to that mic's inherit frequency response.
(22) A brief comparison between two Audyssey Multi EQ XT32 mics | AVS Forum
I'm using the same amp for my main speakers - in this case a Sherbourn 7-350 amplifier (and a Crown XLS 402 for the heights with the Onkyo) (or the onboard Denon amps for the heights with the Denon).
I'm toying with the various DSP and surround modes, stereo listening, pro-logic, dolby surround, multichannel stereo. etc.
Always fighting internally with that reembrace that I really liked the Onkyo for music playback and figuring this has got to be in my head, (and it still might be -- placebo being what it is), I grabbed my 5508 from my secondary bedroom system and set it up in my main system again, re-running Audyssey with my same mic from the same positions, and have been listening to music these last couple hours.
Yes, I like this Onkyo better than my Denon x6700h for music. When I first got the Denon x6700h I loved it for cinema, with the 13 discrete channels and Atmos and DTS-X, but from the very beginning I never fell in love with it for music.
What attribute is making me prefer this nearly 10 year old pre-pro for music over the Denon? Could the DACs be the key? More likely, admittedly it's placebo, or the specific music DSPs that I personally/subjectively like better on the Onkyo (since most of the time I listen to music with the DSP modes. I've compared amps, and even receivers blind A/B/C/D in stereo on several occasions and in fast switching I know I can't tell the difference between an Onkyo, Denon, and Pioneer with all processing off and just level matched stereo playback --- but here in this day's testing all processing is NOT off, and I'm listening with many speakers, with multiple layers of processing and DSP engaged -- so I probably talked myself towards the answer.
Audyssey is mostly off on both systems. Or on, at my choice and knowledge and testing. I like to tinker and constantly play with things. For this little comparison today I've just been listening to the AVR raw on the same "quickdemo' files from my NAS that I ALWAYS use to compare -- directly played by the each AVR over it's local network functionality and the built in AVR DAC. No external player...This is just the AVR playing my favorite MP3s, FLAC files etc from a network location with it's built in playback functionality.
This preference isn't bass levels or audyssey I constantly fidget with bass levels and adjust to taste remote in hand all the time. Is this likely just placebo? Probably -- reinforcing itself when I do these tests -- expect an opinion like that I like the onkyo better for music - come to that opinion with bias, and thus reinforce that opinion.
ughhh...even knowing that - - - this testing is going to make me want to change out AVRs again.
Do you think this is more likely to be something like the difference in DSPs? Or the difference in DACs?
How can you actually compare DACs - is there any website that has a rundown of the different DACs used by AVR manufacturers and how they compare directly? Burr Brown used to be all the rage, you don't see it advertised anymore.
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