Auro-3D, Dolby Atmos TrueHD, Quadraphonic et cetĕra

[Alexander M]

And I thought almost all content available in DSD has been upsampled from PCM at the last production step ... so what?

Yes, that's true. Moreover, many of my friends convert PCM releases to DSD512 and DSD1024 themselves. And often with the help of the full version of PGGB for $1050. Do you think they're crazy? But the sound really does get significantly better, more natural. I was amazed when I first heard it.

 

[LTig]

Yes, that's true. Moreover, many of my friends convert PCM releases to DSD512 and DSD1024 themselves. And often with the help of the full version of PGGB for $1050. Do you think they're crazy? But the sound really does get significantly better, more natural. I was amazed when I first heard it.

I am skeptical regarding sighted auditions:

• Did you ensure that the comparison was under strict controlled conditions (blind or better double blind, levels matched to less than 0.1 dB)?
• Did someone convert DSD back to PCM and did a null test with the original PCM?

 

[Alexander M]

I am skeptical regarding sighted auditions:

• Did you ensure that the comparison was under strict controlled conditions (blind or better double blind, levels matched to less than 0.1 dB)?
• Did someone convert DSD back to PCM and did a null test with the original PCM?

Oh no, no blind testing. These are purely empirical listening impressions. I know many are skeptical, but most of them simply haven't heard this kind of content on comparable systems.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

However, this ASIO driver is proprietary and could only work with Mytek DACs. It's not a one-size-fits-all solution. I didn't find any mention of this driver on the Mytek website.

Yup but it is an indication that just an appropriately constructed driver is necessary.

The main idea of this thread is to use an array of high-quality audio DACs for multichannel audio playback instead of receivers with their mediocre internals.

Or, more practically these days, a multichannel DAC.

 

[Kal Rubinson]

Oh no, no blind testing.

Not surprising.

 

[voodooless]

Oh no, no blind testing.

 

[krabapple]

Absolutely.

If you leave the realm of the humanly audible, sure.

 

[LTig]

Oh no, no blind testing. These are purely empirical listening impressions. I know many are skeptical, but most of them simply haven't heard this kind of content on comparable systems.

Actually we all have heard those differences - it's just that they disappeared under controlled conditions. Without the latter all observations are meaningless. You all heard them, true, but the cause for the observed differences is neither the encoding (DSD or PCM) nor the DAC. It's unconscious bias - sadly. That's the way our brain is wired.

 

[Alexander M]

Yup but it is an indication that just an appropriately constructed driver is necessary.

Or, more practically these days, a multichannel DAC.

There are just no such drivers. Most DAC manufacturers order standart driver versions from Thesycon Software. I wrote to several well-known DAC manufacturers asking if their ASIO drivers support connecting more than one DAC. Everyone who responded said no. One driver = one DAC.

Name a modern multi-channel DAC that supports Native DSD mode via the ASIO driver, with support for DSD512 and DSD1024. Preferably at a reasonable price and not a custom order. Please.
I don't know of any such DACs.

 

[voodooless]

Stop using Windows On Mac you generally don’t need drivers at all, and you can easily create an aggregate device of multiple USB DACs, complete with clock compensation.

 

[Alexander M]

Actually we all have heard those differences - it's just that they disappeared under controlled conditions. Without the latter all observations are meaningless. You all heard them, true, but the cause for the observed differences is neither the encoding (DSD or PCM) nor the DAC. It's unconscious bias - sadly. That's the way our brain is wired.

I don't want to and won't argue. But can you at least agree that different people can have different preferences when it comes to formats, components, music...?

 

[Alexander M]

Stop using Windows On Mac you generally don’t need drivers at all, and you can easily create an aggregate device of multiple USB DACs, complete with clock compensation.

The USB Audio Class 2.0 protocol used on Mac doesn't support native DSD, but only DoP mode. Windows also supports this protocol via the WASAPI driver, but with the same limitations.

Synchronizing the clock frequencies of multiple DACs via their drivers without an external common clock generator is a non-trivial task. And that's exactly what I'm doing in my research. I don't know of any applications that can do this. Maybe you know one?

 

[Alexander M]

When I created this thread, I was hoping for some advice, suggestions, and just a few kind words of support. And I was surprised to see the skeptical and even negative reactions.
I'm trying something new, and I wanted to share my successes and mistakes, but now I'm not sure if anyone wants that here.

 

[voodooless]

Synchronizing the clock frequencies of multiple DACs via their drivers without an external common clock generator is a non-trivial task. And that's exactly what I'm doing in my research. I don't know of any applications that can do this. Maybe you know one?

I don’t think you can do this on driver level. You can do it in your player, or create a virtual sound device that takes care of this.

However you do it, resampling will need to be done. So if the source is DSD, you’ll have to convert to PCM or high rate PDM, and the resample/downsample/decimate to the DACs output DSD rate.

 

[Alexander M]

I don’t think you can do this on driver level. You can do it in your player, or create a virtual sound device that takes care of this.

However you do it, resampling will need to be done. So if the source is DSD, you’ll have to convert to PCM or high rate PDM, and the resample/downsample/decimate to the DACs output DSD rate.

Yes, I'm doing this in an early alpha version of the player, but using the driver capabilities. So far, only for two DACs from different manufacturers, each connected via its own ASIO driver, in Native DSD mode, without any conversion.
The numbers separated by a slash at the bottom of the player are the synchronization indicator.

 

[krabapple]

I don't want to and won't argue. But can you at least agree that different people can have different preferences when it comes to formats, components, music...?

Sure. And some of those preferences are based on audible differences, and some are not. Does that matter to you?

 

[voodooless]

using the driver capabilities

What capabilities are those?

 

[OCA]

Stop using Windows On Mac you generally don’t need drivers at all, and you can easily create an aggregate device of multiple USB DACs, complete with clock compensation.

Did Macs get the fwd delete button on the keyboards yet or do you still have to go left and back delete?

 

[voodooless]

Did Macs get the fwd delete button on the keyboards yet or do you still have to go left and back delete?

Fn+Delete works just fine. Didn’t use this in a decade or so

 

[Alexander M]

What capabilities are those?

Flow control