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Audiopraise VanityPro Review (HDMI Audio Extractor)

Rate this product:

  • 1. Poor (headless panther)

    Votes: 5 3.2%
  • 2. Not terrible (postman panther)

    Votes: 15 9.6%
  • 3. Fine (happy panther)

    Votes: 77 49.4%
  • 4. Great (golfing panther)

    Votes: 59 37.8%

  • Total voters
    156

ozorfis

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The BMD solution also works with some caveats: no hdcp, center and lfe channel might be swapped
I would only recommend this for PC use and people who really want it, like owners of a Denon 5803A.
As I got them cheap I decided to implement AES -> SPDIF pulse transformers and added the T-pad for attenuation, which brings the added benefit of galvanic isolation.
All in all this was around 400€ used and totally worth it to me.
 

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PavelV

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The BMD solution also works with some caveats: no hdcp, center and lfe channel might be swapped
I would only recommend this for PC use and people who really want it, like owners of a Denon 5803A.
As I got them cheap I decided to implement AES -> SPDIF pulse transformers and added the T-pad for attenuation, which brings the added benefit of galvanic isolation.
All in all this was around 400€ used and totally worth it to me.
That is one futuristic oscilloscope :) (date is 2039). May I ask how much or if the time base is delayed from the trigger point in your SPDIF Jitter.jpg? It does not say on the screen. Use 10ms to get plots comparable to those in our measurements here: https://audiopraise.com/projects/internal/vanitypro/hdmi-audio-jitter/ Also, to see the accumulated jitter with trace persistence real time sampling is probably more appropriate instead of equivalent-time sampling.
 

ozorfis

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It is an old scope (Tek TDS-724A) whos timeekeeper battery is slowly dying :D Many thanks for the professional response. I had not specified a delayed trigger and it´s totally possible that the ET sampling averages the jitter out - it looks a bit too good. I just wanted to see if something was totally off and of course confirm the voltage level. I might delve a bit deeper into the matter in the future.

Edit: I think I got it now - thanks for the hint. I was probably on the triggered edged :facepalm: and hence saw no Jitter - I shall repeat with a delay of 10 ms, if I find another stereo jack that is.
 
Last edited:

ozorfis

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Of course I had to test this. My scope was choking heavily, but I got some results. As my scope cannot sample faster than 1GS/s real time sampling ends at 50ns time base like in your article. With equivalent time sampling I can go to 12.5ns, but the jitter seems to increase due to the sampling method.

This was measured with approx. 10m of 110Ohms cable, terminated with a 110R resistor, 2 XLR and one stereo jack as connectors. Thank you for showing me how to measure this properly ;) and a merry christmas everyone!
 

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egradyh

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I'm happy to report that I ordered another VP that is working perfectly with my Oppo 105D and Berkeley Alpha DAC 3. No more dropouts with SACD or Blu Ray audio. As before, the audio quality remains superb.
 

j8352938

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Does it actually decode DTS, DD+, TrueHD, etc? I see no mention of codecs on their site (other than DSD - no movie codecs). It looks like it expects 7.1 PCM.

Update: found the FAQ:

The VanityPRO does not feature any compressed multichannel audio decoders such as Dolby Digital, DTS, Atmos, etc. The VanityPRO needs to receive decoded LPCM or DSD audio.
 

Nattage

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That's right, that's what it expects. If you've not already got one you have to factor in an Apple TV 4k to do this. But it's worth it for the sound quality.
As a long time user of Shield and android TV on my TV itself, this erked somewhat. And I still leave the shield running to network serve files on attached storage to the ATV.

But the apple remote turns my TV on as well and I prefer the feel of it and the interface.

Short of £20k you're not going to get a better surround processor.
 

HooStat

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That's right, that's what it expects. If you've not already got one you have to factor in an Apple TV 4k to do this. But it's worth it for the sound quality.
As a long time user of Shield and android TV on my TV itself, this erked somewhat. And I still leave the shield running to network serve files on attached storage to the ATV.

But the apple remote turns my TV on as well and I prefer the feel of it and the interface.

Short of £20k you're not going to get a better surround processor.
I just had a post a few weeks ago where we sort of figured this out. And you already have it! I would be curious as to how you are enjoying it and which Genelec speakers you are using. It is an amazing system that takes advantage of Genelec's GLM.

In terms of limitations, in case anyone else looks at this. The AudioPraise is limited to 8 channels. (The ATV only sends 5.1 PCM anyway, so it isn't a problem.) There is no Atmos or any of the newer codecs. No upmixing stereo to multichannel as far as I can tell. The ~$1,000 cost for the 9301A (required to sum the bass for the 5 channels unless you are using full-range Genelecs) plus the $1600 AudioPraise is a lot to spend when you can get inexpensive 5.1 processors via analog.
 
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Nattage

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see my pictures! fronts are "Ones", rears cheapest little 8030s DAC'd with an EX5 (topping?).
Pretty sure I've had the ATV output 8 channels. Maybe using Infuse App to play MKVs. Don't quote me on this.
I got the 9301A for a steal on Ebay. So bass summing sorted when feeding the VP stereo only.
I've reviewed above. This thing is sublime!
It is a lot compared to analog processors, but they're all limited by poor DACs or DAC implementations.
It's not a lot when compared to DataSat and the likes, which are the only other devices outputting multi channel digital audio.
 

j8352938

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That's right, that's what it expects. If you've not already got one you have to factor in an Apple TV 4k to do this. But it's worth it for the sound quality.
As a long time user of Shield and android TV on my TV itself, this erked somewhat. And I still leave the shield running to network serve files on attached storage to the ATV.

But the apple remote turns my TV on as well and I prefer the feel of it and the interface.

Short of £20k you're not going to get a better surround processor.
I have the Oppo 203 with the Vanity card. The Oppo has an HDMI In, and it decodes everything. Tis a shame they don't make those anymore. For a while I just ran that directly into my old Meridian DSP5000s, but it couldn't deal with my PS5.
 

HooStat

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see my pictures! fronts are "Ones", rears cheapest little 8030s DAC'd with an EX5 (topping?).
Pretty sure I've had the ATV output 8 channels. Maybe using Infuse App to play MKVs. Don't quote me on this.
I got the 9301A for a steal on Ebay. So bass summing sorted when feeding the VP stereo only.
I've reviewed above. This thing is sublime!
It is a lot compared to analog processors, but they're all limited by poor DACs or DAC implementations.
It's not a lot when compared to DataSat and the likes, which are the only other devices outputting multi channel digital audio.
I didn't look at earlier pages in this thread -- it looks amazing! Very impressive. Did you say that you can control volume with the Apple TV remote now? That would be a game changer for home use.
 

Nattage

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Can confirm the ATV4K outputs 8 channels, from the Infuse app playing MKVs with said channels at least.
Volume control as far as I know has to be in the DAC(s) or beyond at the amps/speakers.
I use the Genelec wireless remote or the wired rotation knob. If that's plugged in the wireless remote won't do volume, just on and off.
I've extended the volume knob cable, so it sits next to where I sit and since it's so tactile, I can hide the cable and as easy to reach as any remote, that's what I use.
 

HooStat

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Can confirm the ATV4K outputs 8 channels, from the Infuse app playing MKVs with said channels at least.
Volume control as far as I know has to be in the DAC(s) or beyond at the amps/speakers.
I use the Genelec wireless remote or the wired rotation knob. If that's plugged in the wireless remote won't do volume, just on and off.
I've extended the volume knob cable, so it sits next to where I sit and since it's so tactile, I can hide the cable and as easy to reach as any remote, that's what I use.
Thanks for following up with more information. And great news about 8 channel output. I will look into the Infuse app.

As for volume control, that is a bummer. In theory, ARC should allow the ATV to tell the AudioPraise to change the volume using the HDMI connection. But if that isn't working then it really makes the unit less useful for me. I have Genelec and I find it annoying to have to change the volume with their little remote, or with the knob (I have both).

EDIT: I found in the JVB Digital FAQ that they only use ARC and not eARC:
The HDMI subsystem of the VanityPRO is HDMI2.0a compatible. Therefore it can only support ARC (2ch), not eARC.
 

Nattage

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To be fair, I think even if you had a Trinnov or DataSat you'd be needing to control volume separately.
Especially if you don't want to be controlling volume in the digital output and if you're using active speakers with room correction like the Genelecs.
Can't see that changing anytime soon as we're a niche bunch who consider such things.
 

PavelV

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As for volume control, that is a bummer. In theory, ARC should allow the ATV to tell the AudioPraise to change the volume using the HDMI connection. But if that isn't working then it really makes the unit less useful for me. I have Genelec and I find it annoying to have to change the volume with their little remote, or with the knob (I have both).
Hi there,
The volume control via CEC has been added in the firmware version 4, so it should work as you describe. Getting it working is a little fiddly as the feature has to be enabled on the sink side (TV) and different manufacturers call it different names. ARC is just audio and does not carry any control commands. We are testing a relatively simple solution for eARC too. I will post some update when finished.
Regards,
Pavel
 

HooStat

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Hi there,
The volume control via CEC has been added in the firmware version 4, so it should work as you describe. Getting it working is a little fiddly as the feature has to be enabled on the sink side (TV) and different manufacturers call it different names. ARC is just audio and does not carry any control commands. We are testing a relatively simple solution for eARC too. I will post some update when finished.
Regards,
Pavel
Since the FAQ response says otherwise, can you clarify if the CEC volume control works for both multichannel and stereo? And just to be clear, if someone connects their AppleTV4k to the AudioPraise with firmware 4 or later, they should be able to control volume in the AudioPraise unit? If so, that is great to know. Thank you.
 

HooStat

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To be fair, I think even if you had a Trinnov or DataSat you'd be needing to control volume separately.
Especially if you don't want to be controlling volume in the digital output and if you're using active speakers with room correction like the Genelecs.
Can't see that changing anytime soon as we're a niche bunch who consider such things.
I am not sure I follow this. Why wouldn't I want to control the volume in the digital output of the AudioPraise? That seems like the logical place to do it. (If it is a question of whether digital volume control is "good enough" then I don't worry about those things even though I appreciate that others do.)
 

PavelV

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Since the FAQ response says otherwise, can you clarify if the CEC volume control works for both multichannel and stereo? And just to be clear, if someone connects their AppleTV4k to the AudioPraise with firmware 4 or later, they should be able to control volume in the AudioPraise unit? If so, that is great to know. Thank you.
Hope there is no confusion with the direction of the CEC volume control. That normally comes from the TV. Once enabled, the TV speakers are muted and volume control setting is passed from the TV via CEC to the HDMI source device - in this case the VanityPRO - which performs the volume adjustments instead of the TV. The other way around - controlling the volume of the VanityPRO from the Apple TV should be possible as well, but we might need to test it first. Stereo/multichannel is irrelevant as it should work with all audio.
 

HooStat

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Hope there is no confusion with the direction of the CEC volume control. That normally comes from the TV. Once enabled, the TV speakers are muted and volume control setting is passed from the TV via CEC to the HDMI source device - in this case the VanityPRO - which performs the volume adjustments instead of the TV. The other way around - controlling the volume of the VanityPRO from the Apple TV should be possible as well, but we might need to test it first. Stereo/multichannel is irrelevant as it should work with all audio.
So, it sounds like it would work with the TV volume control, but not the Apple TV volume control.

In my living room, I use the Apple TV remote to turn everything on (Anthem 520 MRS receiver, Sony TV, Apple TV). I use the Apple TV remote to choose my programming and to adjust my volume (on the receiver). So, I am imagining that by replacing the receiver with the AudioPraise, it would work the same way?

Just to clarify, HDMI audio + video goes from Apple TV to receiver and from receiver to TV.
 

PavelV

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Let me test it and I will report back. If it works then great, if not I am sure we can add this function with a new firmware.
 
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