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Audio Listening With Age Diminished Hearing

jeffbook

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Like Frank Dernie, my 70 year old hearing has diminished. Mine without the excuse of F1 engines at full song right next to me. I still play trumpet with no real effect from hearing loss and listen to live performances and my music system with maximum enjoyment. I have no doubt that anything above 9 -10 kHz is an auditory illusion, but it doesn't affect my enjoyment of either live or recorded music.
 
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PETERPAN

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I'm about to hit 70. Recently I had a hearing exam and my right ear doesn't hear as well as it used to - not even close. But my left ear functions very well per the doctor. After a brief Q&A, he said the issues in my right ear are likely due to age, but it's possible the right ear was damaged at some point years ago that I was not aware of.

Curious if any others who enjoy audio have experienced the hearing issues that come with aging, and how they have dealt with it.
 

PETERPAN

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It should not stop you from enjoying your music. It is more common than you might think. The only way to deal with it is to accept the inevitable progression of life. Many people like me have TINNITUS, and a degredation of some frequencies, but I still enjoy all my music like always.
 

KeithPhantom

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It should not stop you from enjoying your music. It is more common than you might think. The only way to deal with it is to accept the inevitable progression of life. Many people like me have TINNITUS, and a degredation of some frequencies, but I still enjoy all my music like always.
Don't worry about the frequencies you cannot hear, they are usually masked by other tones lower in frequency or they are somewhat annoying if they are present throughout the music in an excessive way.
 

JustAnandaDourEyedDude

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I started using one last year. It took an adjustment period but I think nothing of it these days. The nasal pillows were a fairly easy adjustment. You may also toss and turn less often while using the CPAP. Even if you don't, once you're used to it, it'll toss and turn with you. Good luck!

Thanks! That is good to know that one can eventually adjust to it. I will try much harder to stick with it and adjust to it this time around.
 

carlob

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I'm 55 and can't hear anything past 14kHz or maybe 15kHz at the most.
Too many rock concerts I think.
 

JustAnandaDourEyedDude

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Been using a Bi-PAP for about 16 years now, took about a week to get used to wearing the head gear, mine being a mask that covers my nose and mouth. Now I can't sleep without it.
Like the above post mentioned, your tossing all night might be reduced with the CPAP, I say try again.

My hearing seems pretty good still at 52, considering all of the metal concerts I've been to. I guess the ear plugs I have been wearing since the early 90's have helped.

Thanks. I will give it another try, as the apnea is more severe now. And hope to get used to the mask as you did. I use ear plugs from time to time, too.
 

davidc

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Hello. I have been aware of the fact that my hearing was slowly degrading for many years now. And some close listening buddies it seems, also suffer hearing loss to some degree. Perhaps this is a more common problem that it may seem, maybe even so drastic that age related hearing impairment probably occurs with most humans.

So I bit the bullet and went to a hearing specialist for some testing, and the inevitable fitment of hearing aids. The hearing tests are not what I underwent many years ago when younger and today computers and software replace the test gear of old. The tests involved hearing and repeating a series of spoken words that diminish in gain as the sequence continues. Ultimately, a curve is produced for each ear that clearly shows the hearing abilities of each ear at particular frequency ranges. My left ear was worse than my right ear ... probably caused by too much driving with the window open. My car windows are almost never open now.

The aids that I selected were fitted and the audiologist showed me my results and explained some things to be aware of. Then he sent me out into the mall and said "walk around a little and have a listen". Well, I didn't have to walk 100 feet to realize just how noisey the mall is. And that I could hear and understand people talking and I could hear the terrible mall music playing. Revelation, I had to sit down and just listen. We went back to the audio shop and bought the aids.

On the way home I thought, geez my car makes a lot of noise but that radio sounds better than I thought it did. And the clicking tappets are telling me that the oil needs changing. And I can actually hear my wife talking to me and understand what she is saying. Arriving at home I walked down the entrance hallway and across the living room to my chair, and stopped dead in my tracks thinking who is following me. Since My wife was in the kitchen I turned quickly and nobody. Just old hardwood floors popping a moment after I stepped on them. That really made me laugh.

And then there is the music. I have several pretty good systems around the house but I was eager to go downstairs to where my better system lives and put on something to listen to. Well it was like a new amp and speakers had followed me home. The highs which is where most of my correction is presented were like I remember from when I started the HiFi interest, all those years ago. And with much louder and clearer highs came a significantly improved sound field. I have come to think that listening to music now demands that I put in my hearing aids before commencing.

Discussions with other audio minded acquaintances now suggests that they also would benefit from investing in some hearing aids. At the cost of a nice amplifier, roughly, or less if extended medical plan benefits are available it now seems to me to be perhaps the best investment I could make for the enjoyment of listening to music.

VERY MUCH RECOMMEND GETTING HEARING TESTS AND PURCHASING QUALITY HEARING AIDS !!!

It's great that the hearing aids helped you. You are so, so lucky. Especially that they helped you with music. Very unusual.
 

Wes

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re CPAP - Google "CPAP masks for active sleepers"

re tinnitus - my PCP suggested trying an herbal mix pill from KAN - it's on Amazon & seems to help
 

davidc

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Good to know CPAP machines have come a long way since I tried them. I toss and turn all night, so the nasal interface may not work.

Much of the tossing and turning could be due to the apnea...as you can't breathe and "wake up" you will usually change position. Also, the bed could be part of the reason.

One of the theories as to why people toss and turn when sleeping is that the body becomes uncomfortable. A pressure point develops and you unconsciously move. One of the original advertising aspects to the Tempurpedic memory foam mattress was that it significantly reduces tossing and turning because the pressure points don't develop as much. We bought one back when Tempurpedic was the only brand. About 18yrs ago. It was a life-changer. I went from the usual tossing and turning to falling asleep, and waking up 4-6 hrs later in the exact same position. Amazing.

There are now many brands to choose from, all with no risk return policies. The bed also help my wifes back issues immensely.
 

davidc

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Good to know CPAP machines have come a long way since I tried them. I toss and turn all night, so the nasal interface may not work.

I have sleep apneas as well. It is terrible. Fortunately, I am very tolerant of the mask.

But masks are very specific. What may work for one person may not for another. When I first started with it, the nasal pillow masks had just come out (20 yrs maybe). The first normal face mask I tried in the sleep study sucked, I slept great, but it was annoying. Then, the techs said, "Hey, lets try this new one out on you!". The nasal mask worked great.

If you get another sleep study done, ask the techs if they have any nasal masks you can try. Try more than one.

Interestingly, medical insurance considers the masks a disposable item. They will usually pay for a mask every 3 months, so that gives you the ability to try a new one each time. Unfortunately, most ENT's and the techs at the sleep centers won't be able to advise you. Go online to the websites that sell CPAP equipment. Look at the reviews and what their best-sellers are and ask your insurance companies DME (Durable Medical Equipment) provider to order a specific one. They may resist at first...they may say you need a specific Rx for it from your doctor, but just keep pushing.

Take care of the apnea, not only is it a very dangerous health condition but my God, when you finally get a good night's sleep you will be ecstatic.
 

davidc

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I'm 55 and can't hear anything past 14kHz or maybe 15kHz at the most.
Too many rock concerts I think.

That's pretty much normal. I didn't go to a huge amount of concerts (I'm 59), but I did lie down next to the speakers of my stereo for hours on end, for decades on end. That's how I could get it rock concert loud, without disturbing everybody else. I regret that now as I am paying for it with tinnitus, and "hidden hearing loss". That is the difficulty with hearing conversations when there is a lot of background noise. The tinnitus is pretty loud, but it doesn't drive me crazy. Interestingly, being an audiophile, I can categorize and describe it better than even a hearing specialist doctor can!

It is primarily at about 8-10kHz but spans from about 5kHz to 15kHz. I would say it's the equivalent of about 80dB SPL. It's phasing and harmonics constantly shift, and different for each ear. Occasionally a single tone will play...just now at about 2kHz for about 10 seconds at about the same volume. Really weird.

It gets in the way of listening to soft music, but not loud. If the music is too loud, say 105dB SPL, it will start to distort. When I go to a concert, I wear special musician's earplugs (OTC, not the custom made ones), that reduce the SPL by about 15-20dB but don't alter the spectral characteristics of the music.

I really regret not taking better protection of my hearing as a teen and young adult. I should have listened to my mother when she told me to turn it down. The decrease in freq response with age would still have happened, but I might not be suffering from tinnitus and the "hidden hearing loss".

Unfortunately, hearing aids are not of much benefit with the hidden hearing loss, but Bose makes an earbud they call Hearphones. These are specifically for this problem. They are directional, active noise canceling with lots of features that are very effective. Almost everybody that tries them says they are way, way better than conventional hearing aids.

In addition, they are "musical" meaning they are like audiophile stuff, not like the usual hearing aids.
 
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AudGuy

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It's great that the hearing aids helped you. You are so, so lucky. Especially that they helped you with music. Very unusual.
Yes, I consider myself quite fortunate that I have realized some relief. Is it unusual that I would find some relief ?

What I found was that it helps if you start with the best aids available. FWIW ... $5K CDN before medical plan assistance. Musically speaking, the aids I use link using BlueTooth to devices running an app that lets me assert that I am engaging in one of several different kinds of hearing activities. The EQ for the aids is adjusted according to my activity, music ramps up high frequencies. Others including noisey restaurants and other similar venues will tend to attenuate high frequencies and boost in the range of typical human voices. It will also attenuate in the region that would be background "NOISE" and this makes this environment much easier to tolerate, indeed even begin to enjoy. There are other abilities to this app that include monitoring the range of noise you have been exposed to. Android or IOS, I use both but find IOS a tad bit better.

When I got the aids listening to music sounded a bit strange but better in spite of that. I did ask about Tinnitus and the audiologist suggested that I use my aids for a while then we'll discuss Tinnitus issues. By the time a couple of months went by I found that with the aids in, Tinnitus was all but gone. As I grew used to hearing with aids, the Tinnitus receded and eventually became significantly diminished. At the same time, I began to realize that music was becoming more clearly defined, with sound stage being much more evident. I am hearing new sounds in music that I have heard many times before and this has me eagerly exploring my music library.

The aids I am using are the behind the ear with a wire to an in ear Ear Bud type setup. When linked with BT, I can stream to the aids playing music although they are not really designed for this. the limitation being pretty much no BASS. And they also link to my iPhone so that I can hear the phone through the aids. This is a BIG benefit in noisy conditions.

And like everything, there is a downside. For me I now react to noise more, pets, kitchen clanging, doorbells, etc. I have always had an aversion to this stuff but it is worse now as my hearing is more sensitive with aids, we do live in quite a noisy world. But all-n-all, I am quite fortunate because I still spend more of each day without my aids in than with indicating that my hearing is still adequate for general daily needs.
 

JustAnandaDourEyedDude

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I have sleep apneas as well. It is terrible. Fortunately, I am very tolerant of the mask.

But masks are very specific. What may work for one person may not for another. When I first started with it, the nasal pillow masks had just come out (20 yrs maybe). The first normal face mask I tried in the sleep study sucked, I slept great, but it was annoying. Then, the techs said, "Hey, lets try this new one out on you!". The nasal mask worked great.

If you get another sleep study done, ask the techs if they have any nasal masks you can try. Try more than one.

Interestingly, medical insurance considers the masks a disposable item. They will usually pay for a mask every 3 months, so that gives you the ability to try a new one each time. Unfortunately, most ENT's and the techs at the sleep centers won't be able to advise you. Go online to the websites that sell CPAP equipment. Look at the reviews and what their best-sellers are and ask your insurance companies DME (Durable Medical Equipment) provider to order a specific one. They may resist at first...they may say you need a specific Rx for it from your doctor, but just keep pushing.

Take care of the apnea, not only is it a very dangerous health condition but my God, when you finally get a good night's sleep you will be ecstatic.

Thank you for sharing your experience with sleep apnea and the CPAP/mask that worked for you. Thank you also for some excellent information there and in the previous post, and for good advice. I will keep in mind this info, including the memory foam mattress and using the DME provider to get well-rated masks. Yes, when this pandemic is under better control, I will undergo a third sleep study, and hopefully this time the CPAP system will lead to good sleep for me.
 

JoachimStrobel

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I developed my tinnitus many years ago while shooting an assault rifle during my compulsory military training in the 80’s and not wearing ear protection. I did not shoot a lot. I thought: If I got it so quickly, it means that almost every soldier in combat got it too. And then I understood why Stereo and Hifi did not have such a huge audience In Germany in the 70’s as it had later...
I can only say, that listening to music in a concentrating way helps my tinnitus a lot - I forget about it when the sound is good.
Somehow I believe that a properly Eqed loudspeaker can better compensate for hearing loss than a tiny device in the ear with a micro loudspeaker...
 

RayDunzl

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I don't tune my gear for my ear.
 

Vincent Kars

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I don't tune my gear for my ear.

I can only ++++1 this.
No use to boost higher frequencies to a absurd level.
Beside, acoustical music (listening to classical most of the time) doesn't contain much high frequencies.
My hearing is capped at 13 kHz but I could still discern between a good recording and a mediocre one :)
 

cistercian

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When I was young my hearing was very acute. My father did a lot of competition shooting and I always
wore hearing protection. In that sport many suffer hearing loss. I always used inside the ear and outer
headgear for 50db+ attenuation. I even used hearing protection when going to rock concerts.
So at nearly 59 my ears are quite good still! Even so, HF loss is creeping in and lucky for me it is not so
severe that using the right response curve cannot level it. I cannot hear 23kc anymore. Oh well.
I have always been careful with the headphones and listen pretty quiet. Since I am an avid SWLer and ham
being able to pick a voice out of the noise is precious to me so I have been cautious to protect my ears.

I expect as the years proceed things will not sound the same...which is normal. My eyes are certainly degrading
fast which I hate. I am just glad I am still alive and in decent health.
 

Haflermichi

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Shit, you guys are scaring me lol.
"Be scared, be very scared"
Sorry, bad paraphrase from The Fly. Great SciFi movie by the way...

Not to be too alarmist but if you value your hearing, you should consider protecting it whenever and wherever you can.
This hobby is critically dependent on it.
I'm 54 and have moderate tinnitus and hearing loss.
Part of the hearing loss spectrum is genetic, which you can't control and the other part is environmental, which you can.
When we're young we can be told or forced to protect our hearing but it's hard to realize and accept future repercussions of our
actions when we're young and "invincible".

Many rock bands, many rock concerts, many motorcycles, many power tool projects+ genetics=where I am now.
You can't go back in time and I wouldn't trade those life experiences for the world.
But I do have multiple sets of earplugs in all my bags and cars now.
When I go to music shows and movies I use affordable "musician's" plugs.
I haven't yet sprung for the type with custom molded earpieces.

My attitude is I'm going to do every damn thing possible to protect what remains of my hearing.

You have to make it become second nature even if people look at you strangely.

My wife is an optometrist and my work mandates eye protection zones so safety glasses are also second nature now too.
Consider if you were a fine art painter and lost your vision, or a wine afficionado and lost your sense of taste and smell.

I once helped a store I worked for put together those giant metal palette racks in a small concrete room.
It was a manager and a bunch of kids younger than me. I was the only one with plugs.
When the hammer pounding started some of the kids, the smart ones, reacted like they were struck by lightning and immediately
plugged their ears with their hands. The not so bright ones (macho boys) didn't even seem to notice and just kept pounding away!
It was astonishing.
Fortunately, as an adult, I had enough influence with the manager that he agreed we should stop immediately and go buy
a box of plugs.

My tinnitus affects me everyday. I hear it right now and it's never, ever going to go away.
While I am fortunate that I can still enjoy this great hobby of ours I do wish I had "listened" way back when.
It's all in your hands.
 
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