Audio Interface Decision

[johnevansdesign]

I need help choosing audio interface hardware. Please pardon this repeated discussion request, but there are so many alternatives. I have researched for some time and have learned a lot, but with all the options and no place to go to see devices and discuss with knowledgeable people, I am here.

Julian Krause said it is important to know what you want to use it for FIRST!
I will be primarily using it as a convenience with my Axe FX processor and guitar, initially routing and adjustment convenience, and later some simple recording and perhaps the wife using the Mic for her needs.
I need to connect:
Axe FX out (XLR, TRS, or SPDIF) Stereo
Looper out Stereo
DAW I/O (meaning PC or iPad playing backing tracks, and future SIMULTANEOUS recording)
FRFR amplified Cabinet Stereo (800 amp)
Headphones, 250 ohm
Keyboard out (future whim)

Connection needs:
I have no idea what my future behavior or desires will be, so I want flexibility (this is all a new build), so ALL advice is welcomed.
1) No computer required to run configuration; I know I will need computer to at a minimum setup some backend routing, but after that, unless I'm recording, I'd like to not have one connected; Just turn on and play my guitar!
2) Power brick required - need my USB port dedicated for PC comms, on or not.
3) I want to have some hardware convenience to adjust BASIC input levels and things I don't yet understand completely, without needing a computer.
4) Selectable profiles and routing: I wanted to possibly be able to run complete bus into headphones (seems easy), but ONLY run Axe FX output to the FRFR amp in one profile, and then complete bus to FRFR in another profile.
5) recallable profiles on hardware
6) rotary encoders for level knobs, so that the computer software and/or hardware knobs are synced and can adjust alternatively.
7) SPDIF would be nice in coax (Axe Fx is coax). SPDIF is not a deal breaker, but maybe good option for this layout. Thoughts?
8) Combo jacks, send/return, separate input sections for bypassing preamps
9) the luxury of adding wife's keyboard in future.

You all may see some bad judgement in my ideas, and I welcome suggestions and alternatives, this part including recording is all new to me.
The main goal is to just sit and play with some looper action or backing tracks, without a lot of monkey farting with a mouse and keyboard while I'm playing, and record in the future. I understand that I'll have the computer for backing tracks, yes, but I'd like to be able to just adjust a knob for something simple; when using the looper, I don't want to plug a computer in at all.

My research has brought me to
MOTU - Ultralite Mk5 and 624. The M6 can't route and save profiles, UGGH. I was told the mk5 was my best choice, but the mk5 can't save profile info to unit, so PC had to be used in conjunction for any routing.
Audient id24 - USB power only, so I'd have to swap the cable on and off computer - UGGH.
SSL 12 - No SPDIF, and stupid USB power only. UGGH.

You all see? I keep hitting "oh this is great, but there's one problem". I could really use some experienced advice.

The Axe FX can do all this routing, but i wanted some convenience without all the AXE FX routing.
Thank you all.
John Evans

 

[MaxwellsEq]

How much can you spend? Have you looked at RME, they are often more expensive than cheaper units, but tend to be gold standard for design and support.

 

[DVDdoug]

The main thing I'd look for is zero-latency direct-hardware monitoring where you can monitor without going through the computer. But that means you can't have any computer-based effects in the monitoring. That's mostly if you are recording vocals or otherwise using a microphone. With a guitar you can split the signal to an amp to hear yourself without worrying about the computer and latency won't matter.

And then of course, the number of input channels.

1) No computer required to run configuration; I know I will need computer to at a minimum setup some backend routing, but after that, unless I'm recording, I'd like to not have one connected; Just turn on and play my guitar!

That might be hard to find. The audio might "pass-through" with only power but I've never seen that advertised as a feature. It would be a lot more convenient to plug into an amp (maybe a practice amp).

Or there are USB mixers that double as audio interfaces. The main limitation is that most of the "small" USB mixers can only record the stereo mix. They can't multi-track. But there more advanced mixers that can multitrack record. PreSonus makes mixer/interfaces that integrate with the DAW some may have motorized pots.

2) Power brick required - need my USB port dedicated for PC comms, on or not.

There's another potential advantage to that. USB power is notoriously noisy and sometimes that noise leaks into the preamp and then you don't know to blame the computer or interface and there's no easy fix.

4) Selectable profiles and routing: I wanted to possibly be able to run complete bus into headphones (seems easy), but ONLY run Axe FX output to the FRFR amp in one profile, and then complete bus to FRFR in another profile.

I dunno... Maybe that's another situation where a USB mixer is better.

5) recallable profiles on hardware

That sounds like a high-end feature. Usually that kind of thing is handled by the DAW.

6) rotary encoders for level knobs, so that the computer software and/or hardware knobs are synced and can adjust alternatively.

Knobs are pretty standard but I believe most little affordable interfaces use pots rather then rotary encoders.

7) SPDIF would be nice in coax (Axe Fx is coax). SPDIF is not a deal breaker, but maybe good option for this layout. Thoughts?

Doesn't it have analog or USB? (It can be tricky to use two interfaces at the same time so USB might not work.)

8) Combo jacks, send/return, separate input sections for bypassing preamps

That seems standard. Plug-in a "guitar plug" and you get a high impedance unbalanced guitar/instrument that will also work as a line-input.

9) the luxury of adding wife's keyboard in future.

The combo jack should handle that as long as you have enough inputs.

 

[johnevansdesign]

I keep bouncing off the price like an invisible force field. I have not spend much time investigating though. I'd LIKE to stay below $750 if I could find the right thing. I started at $250 and the price keeps going up.

 

[johnevansdesign]

The main thing I'd look for is zero-latency direct-hardware monitoring where you can monitor without going through the computer. But that means you can't have any computer-based effects in the monitoring. That's mostly if you are recording vocals or otherwise using a microphone. With a guitar you can split the signal to an amp to hear yourself without worrying about the computer and latency won't matter.

And then of course, the number of input channels.


That might be hard to find. The audio might "pass-through" with only power but I've never seen that advertised as a feature. It would be a lot more convenient to plug into an amp (maybe a practice amp).

Or there are USB mixers that double as audio interfaces. The main limitation is that most of the "small" USB mixers can only record the stereo mix. They can't multi-track. But there more advanced mixers that can multitrack record. PreSonus makes mixer/interfaces that integrate with the DAW some may have motorized pots.


There's another potential advantage to that. USB power is notoriously noisy and sometimes that noise leaks into the preamp and then you don't know to blame the computer or interface and there's no easy fix.


I dunno... Maybe that's another situation where a USB mixer is better.


That sounds like a high-end feature. Usually that kind of thing is handled by the DAW.


Knobs are pretty standard but I believe most little affordable interfaces use pots rather then rotary encoders.


Doesn't it have analog or USB? (It can be tricky to use two interfaces at the same time so USB might not work.)


That seems standard. Plug-in a "guitar plug" and you get a high impedance unbalanced guitar/instrument that will also work as a line-input.


The combo jack should handle that as long as you have enough inputs.

Thanks for the reply. Regarding your answers, a few things stand out:
1) guitar goes to AXE FX, not interface. Only reason I want interface is to route and listen to NON-guitar signals (bypassing Axe), PLUS Axe Digital output (and route to DAW and amp cabinet) or Axe Analog out and convert for DAW and route to amp cabinet. I desire the ability to route this to here and that to there, not all necessarily summed.
7) has USB, Coax spdif, TRS and XLR analog. I need to get DAW I/O by USB, and Interface to Axe I/O by another method. If my analog inputes are too restricted, tehn SPDIF might solve my limitation. This is why I bring it up. Plus, one less conversion problem.
4 & 5 - MOTU 624 can handle both. UL Mk5 will handle all, but you can't save profiles to hardware.

 

[JayGilb]

Welcome to ASR. Glad you found us !

What model AXE FX do you have ?

 

[johnevansdesign]

Welcome to ASR. Glad you found us !

What model AXE FX do you have ?

Axe Fx Mk III Turbo.

 

[johnevansdesign]

How much can you spend? Have you looked at RME, they are often more expensive than cheaper units, but tend to be gold standard for design and support.

Thanks for reminding me to look some more. I found the RME UCX II and it looks perfect. Unfortunately it’s 2x what I wanted to pay max. I don’t think my budget can handle such a high price for such a minimal need. Any thoughts?

 

[johnevansdesign]

I need help choosing audio interface hardware. Please pardon this repeated discussion request, but there are so many alternatives. I have researched for some time and have learned a lot, but with all the options and no place to go to see devices and discuss with knowledgeable people, I am here.

Julian Krause said it is important to know what you want to use it for FIRST!
I will be primarily using it as a convenience with my Axe FX processor and guitar, initially routing and adjustment convenience, and later some simple recording and perhaps the wife using the Mic for her needs.
I need to connect:
Axe FX out (XLR, TRS, or SPDIF) Stereo
Looper out Stereo
DAW I/O (meaning PC or iPad playing backing tracks, and future SIMULTANEOUS recording)
FRFR amplified Cabinet Stereo (800 amp)
Headphones, 250 ohm
Keyboard out (future whim)

Connection needs:
I have no idea what my future behavior or desires will be, so I want flexibility (this is all a new build), so ALL advice is welcomed.
1) No computer required to run configuration; I know I will need computer to at a minimum setup some backend routing, but after that, unless I'm recording, I'd like to not have one connected; Just turn on and play my guitar!
2) Power brick required - need my USB port dedicated for PC comms, on or not.
3) I want to have some hardware convenience to adjust BASIC input levels and things I don't yet understand completely, without needing a computer.
4) Selectable profiles and routing: I wanted to possibly be able to run complete bus into headphones (seems easy), but ONLY run Axe FX output to the FRFR amp in one profile, and then complete bus to FRFR in another profile.
5) recallable profiles on hardware
6) rotary encoders for level knobs, so that the computer software and/or hardware knobs are synced and can adjust alternatively.
7) SPDIF would be nice in coax (Axe Fx is coax). SPDIF is not a deal breaker, but maybe good option for this layout. Thoughts?
8) Combo jacks, send/return, separate input sections for bypassing preamps
9) the luxury of adding wife's keyboard in future.

You all may see some bad judgement in my ideas, and I welcome suggestions and alternatives, this part including recording is all new to me.
The main goal is to just sit and play with some looper action or backing tracks, without a lot of monkey farting with a mouse and keyboard while I'm playing, and record in the future. I understand that I'll have the computer for backing tracks, yes, but I'd like to be able to just adjust a knob for something simple; when using the looper, I don't want to plug a computer in at all.

My research has brought me to
MOTU - Ultralite Mk5 and 624. The M6 can't route and save profiles, UGGH. I was told the mk5 was my best choice, but the mk5 can't save profile info to unit, so PC had to be used in conjunction for any routing.
Audient id24 - USB power only, so I'd have to swap the cable on and off computer - UGGH.
SSL 12 - No SPDIF, and stupid USB power only. UGGH.

You all see? I keep hitting "oh this is great, but there's one problem". I could really use some experienced advice.

The Axe FX can do all this routing, but i wanted some convenience without all the AXE FX routing.
Thank you all.
John Evans

Perhaps if the unit could simply remember the config and routing it was last programmed with. That might work fine since I would typically be playing same equipment. And the switch would occur when I needed computer anyway.
Can anyone confirm and recommend any such units that can perform this way? I heard UL mk5 could, but can’t confirm.

 

[MaxwellsEq]

Thanks for reminding me to look some more. I found the RME UCX II and it looks perfect. Unfortunately it’s 2x what I wanted to pay max. I don’t think my budget can handle such a high price for such a minimal need. Any thoughts?

Consider buying used? RME products are tough and likely to survive several owners. They also support their products for years, which takes the worry out of changes to Apple or Microsoft changes.

 

[LTig]

If you can work around a missing SPDIF I/O have a look at Zooms Livetrak series (L-6, L-8, L-12).

 

[johnevansdesign]

If you can work around a missing SPDIF I/O have a look at Zooms Livetrak series (L-6, L-8, L-12).

Ok. Thank you very much. I will.

 

[johnevansdesign]

Consider buying used? RME products are tough and likely to survive several owners. They also support their products for years, which takes the worry out of changes to Apple or Microsoft changes.

You know I just looked up used RME UCX I, old model, used for $600 ish and also found Motu UL mk 4 for $250. The mk 4 is newer and seems to check all boxes, but I hear great things about RME. Dang this is difficult

 

[johnevansdesign]

Ok. Thank you very much. I will.

Odd duck those, but might just work. Not as flexible and takes up a lot of space, but it’s a contender. No apparent digital as you mentioned.

 

[LTig]

Odd duck those, but might just work. Not as flexible and takes up a lot of space, but it’s a contender. No apparent digital as you mentioned.

Well, digital is USB I/O, input for 2 or 4 channels, output for all channels. And the built-in recorder on SD card, which can be used to create a 2 channel mix without a PC. Of course you can copy all recorded tracks on the PC for further processing with e.g ardour or audacity or else.

 

[johnevansdesign]

It is interesting, thank you again. However I think I’m going to keep my future options open while I learn what they are. I am having trouble no getting a UCX II; totally irresponsible budget overreach just to be more future proof and get w a great company. For $250 the Motu UL mk 4 seems too good to be true. I’d snag the very old RME UCX (c.2012) if I wasn’t worried about loss of windows support and legacy issues. RME seems like a great company and Motu won’t support old equipment. Anyone advise here? I figure at my skill level that I won’t know the difference of UCX vs UCX II.