Audeze LCD-XC Review (Closed-back Headphone)

[04gto]

Here you go:
Audeze
And more info here:
LCD-X and XC Update

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Off the topic of mods and the wisdom of performing them, I have a practical question:

Does anyone know how to tell by looking whether a given LCD XC is the 2021 model or, the 2014 model? At some point I would like to buy some, but probably secondhand (save $300-400 this way) and not all listings provide the model year.

2021 model has a black plastic cup.
Also, the best tell-tale sign is, if you run your fingers on the inside of the cups, on the diaphragm, you will feel the Fazor ripples.
On 2021 there are seven fazors.
Older types have more.
I am pretty certain.

 

[04gto]

2021 model has a black plastic cup.
Also, the best tell-tale sign is, if you run your fingers on the inside of the cups, on the diaphragm, you will feel the Fazor ripples.
On 2021 there are seven fazors.
Older types have more.
I am pretty certain.

If by "black plastic cup" do you mean the carbon fiber laid over plastic? (according to Audeze support when I asked if it was real CF)
There is no correlation between the change from wood to carbon fiber. The carbon fiber cups were released a year or more before the "2021" changes (which actually started November 2020). Also the old version had 8 fazors the newer one has 6 (not 7). You can easily feel these through the pads with your fingers. Please refer to the links I posted above which contains info directly from Audeze. 100% certainty achieved. No guessing necessary.

 

[nyxnyxnyx]

I'm just curious, how many of you here exactly perform a completely valid double blind test and volume matched test with high succession rate and presented with noticeable, accurate measurements to back up any of your findings? I'm willing to bet the ones that actually do all those works are probably the 1% of this forums population, or even less as far as my assumption goes based on what I've seen.

 

[markanini]

(pointless tangential diversion combined with absurd arguments implying engineers are more likely to listen to subjective rumour rather than measurements)

I'm sure you would entertain evidence that undermines your contribution as an engineer employed by an audio company. As for other people YMMV.

 

[Ken Tajalli]

If by "black plastic cup" do you mean the carbon fiber laid over plastic? (according to Audeze support when I asked if it was real CF)
There is no correlation between the change from wood to carbon fiber. The carbon fiber cups were released a year or more before the "2021" changes (which actually started November 2020). Also the old version had 8 fazors the newer one has 6 (not 7). You can easily feel these through the pads with your fingers. Please refer to the links I posted above which contains info directly from Audeze. 100% certainty achieved. No guessing necessary.

Thanx. good to know.

 

[kemmler3D]

Having run the product (not engineering) end of a headphone or two for my job, I would be inclined to listen to a user who had performed competent measurements or had very specific, compelling technical hypotheses for specific observed phenomena. If you have solid evidence of something engineers may have overlooked (hey, we all have limited budgets and schedules) that can be legitimately interesting.

The guy who writes in saying they tried X or Y and "it sounds totally different" would get a sincere thanks for being enthusiastic about the product, but I certainly wouldn't pass it to engineering.

I once shipped a firmware update that didn't change anything about the tuning, but I asked our users whether they noticed a change in sound quality anyway. More than half said it improved. This is why companies don't listen to their customers without a clear reason to do so. You end up chasing essentially random data.

 

[nyxnyxnyx]

Having run the product (not engineering) end of a headphone or two for my job, I would be inclined to listen to a user who had performed competent measurements or had very specific, compelling technical hypotheses for specific observed phenomena. If you have solid evidence of something engineers may have overlooked (hey, we all have limited budgets and schedules) that can be legitimately interesting.

The guy who writes in saying they tried X or Y and "it sounds totally different" would get a sincere thanks for being enthusiastic about the product, but I certainly wouldn't pass it to engineering.

I once shipped a firmware update that didn't change anything about the tuning, but I asked our users whether they noticed a change in sound quality anyway. More than half said it improved. This is why companies don't listen to their customers without a clear reason to do so. You end up chasing essentially random data.

I met many guys who own hi-end DAPs and the similar thing happened too. Although they have varying opinions/experiences, most seem to agree that every firmware or software update seems to change sound from slightly to significant. Some are even actively trying to go back to older firmware(s), even if it is not encouraged or allowed by the company making those DAPs.
But in all fairness, some of them have a running hypothesis that those companies try to "degrade" the sound quality of their DAP so that the newer flagship will sound better and be more impressive. Would be wild if true lol.

 

[markanini]

Having run the product (not engineering) end of a headphone or two for my job, I would be inclined to listen to a user who had performed competent measurements or had very specific, compelling technical hypotheses for specific observed phenomena. If you have solid evidence of something engineers may have overlooked (hey, we all have limited budgets and schedules) that can be legitimately interesting.

The guy who writes in saying they tried X or Y and "it sounds totally different" would get a sincere thanks for being enthusiastic about the product, but I certainly wouldn't pass it to engineering.

I once shipped a firmware update that didn't change anything about the tuning, but I asked our users whether they noticed a change in sound quality anyway. More than half said it improved. This is why companies don't listen to their customers without a clear reason to do so. You end up chasing essentially random data.

I take it you were given the responsibility by your employer to ensure software quality. Given constrained budgets and schedules, how would your employer react to issues that were beyond the scope of a software update, after a major project runs? Or that evidence of such an issue was spreading on forums and social media?

 

[Robbo99999]

I take it you were given the responsibility by your employer to ensure software quality. Given constrained budgets and schedules, how would your employer react to issues that were beyond the scope of a software update, after a major project runs? Or that evidence of such an issue was spreading on forums and social media?

Come on, just leave it, you're fast becoming known as King of the Irrelevant Tangents!

 

[kemmler3D]

Given constrained budgets and schedules, how would your employer react to issues that were beyond the scope of a software update, after a major project runs? Or that evidence of such an issue was spreading on forums and social media?

Ugh, you're bringing up past traumas...

What actually happens if you ship hardware with problems depends on how bad the problems are. It can go as far as a physical recall, but in general the best thing you can do is have good customer service and a generous return / exchange policy.

This is really if it's a case of basic functionality, reliability, or safety.

If we're talking something like a quirk in the FR that shouldn't be there, but isn't a showstopper, you either fix it in the next production run or chalk it up to personal preference.

most seem to agree that every firmware or software update seems to change sound from slightly to significant. Some are even actively trying to go back to older firmware(s), even if it is not encouraged or allowed by the company making those DAPs.

I would bet you very good money that if the release notes don't say anything about improved sound, the sound is exactly the same as it used to be. Companies don't usually miss a chance to tout better sound. As a marketer, I took every chance I got to tout better sound, no matter how marginal.

And the idea that they'd degrade sound over time as part of an obsolescence campaign is wild. You'd get caught by someone doing measurements and never recover your reputation. It's the kind of idea marketers would talk about JOKINGLY but never do, because it's so obviously a terrible idea. People be crazy.

 

[Peterinvan]

Off the topic of mods and the wisdom of performing them, I have a practical question:

Does anyone know how to tell by looking whether a given LCD XC is the 2021 model or, the 2014 model? At some point I would like to buy some, but probably secondhand (save $300-400 this way) and not all listings provide the model year.

I have the 2019 model. Steel headband with suspension strap, and bubinga wooden cups. They are still my reference headphones

 

[Peterinvan]

Having run the product (not engineering) end of a headphone or two for my job, I would be inclined to listen to a user who had performed competent measurements or had very specific, compelling technical hypotheses for specific observed phenomena. If you have solid evidence of something engineers may have overlooked (hey, we all have limited budgets and schedules) that can be legitimately interesting.

The guy who writes in saying they tried X or Y and "it sounds totally different" would get a sincere thanks for being enthusiastic about the product, but I certainly wouldn't pass it to engineering.

I once shipped a firmware update that didn't change anything about the tuning, but I asked our users whether they noticed a change in sound quality anyway. More than half said it improved. This is why companies don't listen to their customers without a clear reason to do so. You end up chasing essentially random data.

I always look at the release notes to see what changes are in the “upgrade”. If it does not seem to offer anything I need, my attitude is if it aint broke leave it alone

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Alrighty

Did what you suggested,
grudgingly!

Audeze LCD-XC 21 & effects of small venting

A while back, I asked on LCD-XC review page, for feedback on subjective effects on bass output, by removing one screw from the cups. I got talked down to by some members, as to the pitfalls of such an experiment, and how without measurements, it would be a waste of time. And the wasting time...

audiosciencereview.com

 

[Robbo99999]

Did what you suggested,
grudgingly!

Audeze LCD-XC 21 & effects of small venting

A while back, I asked on LCD-XC review page, for feedback on subjective effects on bass output, by removing one screw from the cups. I got talked down to by some members, as to the pitfalls of such an experiment, and how without measurements, it would be a waste of time. And the wasting time...

audiosciencereview.com

That's good that you decided to get a miniDSP EARS so you can measure it and see the result of your mods. I think that's a fine approach...I mean it is easier to EQ it, and that's still my advice to people vs doing hard mods, but at least now you can see the effects of your physical mods on the frequency response and also if it has any negative effects re distortion.

 

[reptilianbrain]

Hey guys, I am considering a TOTL closed-back, and am zeroing in on LCD-XC, but have a couple of questions:

1. I have HD800s which I like, would LCD XC or D9200 be a better pair for it?
2. I always EQ my headphones. Is it safe to say, that with EQ LCD-XC would be on par with DCA Stealth?

 

[Robbo99999]

Hey guys, I am considering a TOTL closed-back, and am zeroing in on LCD-XC, but have a couple of questions:

1. I have HD800s which I like, would LCD XC or D9200 be a better pair for it?
2. I always EQ my headphones. Is it safe to say, that with EQ LCD-XC would be on par with DCA Stealth?

At least the LCD XC has been measured on here, so you know what you're getting, D9200 hasn't been measured on here, but the frequency response of the D9200 over on Oratory's website looks like it EQ's quite well to the Harman Curve. Difficult to answer if EQ'd LCD-XC would be on par with DCA Stealth, The Stealth measures better overall. You're probably just gonna have to make a judgement call from the various measurements, and maybe try to find out if there are any quirks re fitting to different people's heads (any issues), and perhaps try to check the internal cup size & shape so you can make sure your ears fit completely inside without touching if possible. Read up some user reviews to see if there are any reliability problems with the various headphones, etc, that kind of thing....but it will come down to your judgement in the end.

 

[Jimbob54]

Hey guys, I am considering a TOTL closed-back, and am zeroing in on LCD-XC, but have a couple of questions:

1. I have HD800s which I like, would LCD XC or D9200 be a better pair for it?
2. I always EQ my headphones. Is it safe to say, that with EQ LCD-XC would be on par with DCA Stealth?

If you get the XC, get a neck brace. Takes EQ well due to low distortion. From a Harman perspective one of the better tuned LCDs.

Cant comment on the 9200 but the Denon X000 / X200 generally are bass canons. By all accounts the 5200 is the sweet spot though and they regularly come up on Amazon open box/ warehouse. The Denon 7000 I have is a very easy wear, beefy bass. The LCDs dont hammer you with bass in stock mode but of course can be EQd up.

 

[Ken Tajalli]

Hey guys, I am considering a TOTL closed-back, and am zeroing in on LCD-XC, but have a couple of questions:

1. I have HD800s which I like, would LCD XC or D9200 be a better pair for it?
2. I always EQ my headphones. Is it safe to say, that with EQ LCD-XC would be on par with DCA Stealth?

I have the XCs and have heard the Stealths, side by side.
I don't think you can EQ any headphone to sound like another. That being said, no matter how much I EQ the XCs or Mod them, they tend to sound like themselves (bright!), EQ can only iron out certain areas, The XCs retain their own character (to me, wonderful).
The Stealths sound much warmer, that upper bass hump (deliberate) is very noticeable if you listen to them side by side with another headphone. Personally, I couldn't live with that. They sound very very good, but I think the XCs are better value considering the asking price.
The Stealths are lighter and more comfy, but on pure sound quality (after EQ), resolution, bass quality . . . I think they are on a par, even though they sound different.
Yes the XCs are heavy compared to others, but unless you are a petite, slim girl, no neck brace is required.
I hope it helps.

 

[Zibi]

I do own one, I like its sound, yet I voted "not terrible", because after a while, when I wear it, the weight and pain (pressure will the carbon headband) becomes unbearable for me = not acceptable IMHO.
It is excellent that Amir put the weight chart on top position, people should not overlook this major issue.

I have auditioned XC and DC A2 Noir on my RME ADI-2 dac. XC was much more detailed and analytical and I believe a little better match with RME. I really like them. However, since I use my headphones for long sessions I got concerned that XC will be fatiguing and difficult to use. Bought DC A2 Noire which weigh just 328g. So less than half of XC.