Audeze LCD-XC Review (Closed-back Headphone)

[JaMaSt]

Audeze owners after 3 weeks.

 

[staticV3]

Is this the 2020 or the pre-2021 version ersion ?
they have different FR. And if I’am not mistaken, the built-in profile is for the pre-2021 version. maybe @amirm can post the measurement post eq for his profile against the built-in one in order to verify this.

looking at other measurements of the two versions, it becomes clear that Amir measured the updated 2021 version.

The original one had a distinct M-shaped error curve relative to OE2018:




The new version looks more like this:


Which matches pretty well with Amir's measurements:

 

[FreaK]

@amirm : how does it sound compared to your DCA Stealth?

Also, Dan Clark said quite some time ago that he will send you the Aeon 2 Noir, did he forget it?

 

[CedarX]

The dB levels that Amir is quoting is at 425Hz, but that doesn't invalidate my prior post I wrote to you - that still all stands. You just have to imagine adding 20dB (the difference between 114dB-94dB distortion graphs) to the following frequency response graph to imagine where the bass would be with a +20dB bass boost (it would be at 112dB at 20Hz to name one point):

Amir does not measure HP linearity--i.e. whether the FR keeps the same "shape" at different levels or not. Is it because 99.9% of the headphones are "linear" and that measurement would be mostly useless?
I am not questioning the above answer at all, but I also wonder about this type of EQ projection for those heaphones where the manufacturers claim they played with "resonances" to tune the FR response: wouldn't this be an indicator of potential non-linearities?

In the case of the LCD-XC and Audeze headphones in general, can one assume that low distortion and clean group delay are good indicators of an absence of weird resonances or non-linear behaviors?

 

[Red@]

looking at other measurements of the two versions, it becomes clear that Amir measured the updated 2021 version.

The original one had a distinct M-shaped error curve relative to OE2018:
View attachment 188281
View attachment 188282
View attachment 188284

The new version looks more like this:
View attachment 188288

Which matches pretty well with Amir's measurements:
View attachment 188289

But it should be specified in the OP.
Next year they'll push a new silent revision...

 

[Jimbob54]

But it should be specified in the OP.
Next year they'll push a new silent revision...

Ive been trying to google the version history of the XC- I dont even know which mine is! (second hand ebay). Something of a black hole.

 

[Merkurio]

I can only say good things about Audeze and their customer service, even though I’m from Mexico, the attention provided was exceptional with the three products I’ve bought in the past (Audeze LCD2C, iSINE 20 and iSINE LX).

However, as much as I like their blank canvas approach (extremely low distortion to play with EQ), the comfort remains to be an issue due to the weight, that’s why I sold the LCD2C years ago (being one of the “lightest” in their LCD lineup)

Give me a LCD2 with the weight and form factor of the new LCD5, the characteristic low distortion and linear bass to begin with EQ at <$1000 and I’m ready to jump again.

 

[Robbo99999]

If this is 114db at 425hz, there is only an amount of bass equal to that which a more harman-correct headphone would have at somewhere around 94db to 100db.

And there isn't any method to deduce from this graph how much bass distortion this headphone would have if its bass were increased to the level of a more Harman-correct headphone.

It's ok, you don't understand the graphs. I'll do my best to illustrate how you work out what frequency response you could have in this headphone in the bass with a +20dB bass boost and this will indeed equate to the distortion (in the bass) that is seen in the 114dB distortion graph. See the red line I drew in on the following graph, that's what the frequency response could look like if you were to give this headphone a +20dB bass boost - I think that's enough bass right!!!

And the bass distortion you would see from the above +20dB bass boost would be the green line in the following graph (in the bass region of course as that's what's been boosted which I've circled in red):

So if you only boost to Harman levels of course the bass distortion is gonna be absolutely fine, even lower than illustrated here. Instead I'm showing you what would happen if you gave a +20dB bass boost whilst listening at about 94dB at 1kHz which is more than enough.

 

[phoenixsong]

I remember working for a headphone shop a few years ago when I had teenage ears- the sound of the XC from back then was interesting but did not blow me away (probably because I was more enamoured by the massive soundstage of the HD800). Forgot the rest of my impressions since then, other than the headphones being unbearably hefty and chunky ^^" That seemed to be a different version though, from what I've heard Audeze has come up with and incorporated "Fazor" and other tech into their headphones since then (*EDIT: Yup definitely different version, the one I tried had wooden cups which would definitely affect the sound. Is it now a running theme for headphones with low distortion to be closed-back with carbon fibre cups? The Stealth too) Finally, I liked the fact that you specifically praised the company for sending you headphones for testing alone @amirm , as I've heard (and personally experienced) less favourable things about the company/their headphones with regard to QC/failing issues and some drama over a supposed collaboration with another company some of us here know very well

That distortion measurement is just *chef's kiss* though. Shall make it a point to at least try this new version once I can- will probably learn something out of it

 

[Robbo99999]

Amir does not measure HP linearity--i.e. whether the FR keeps the same "shape" at different levels or not. Is it because 99.9% of the headphones are "linear" and that measurement would be mostly useless?
I am not questioning the above answer at all, but I also wonder about this type of EQ projection for those heaphones where the manufacturers claim they played with "resonances" to tune the FR response: wouldn't this be an indicator of potential non-linearities?

In the case of the LCD-XC and Audeze headphones in general, can one assume that low distortion and clean group delay are good indicators of an absence of weird resonances or non-linear behaviors?

Compression can happen in headphones at higher volumes, but I think it's generally not a big factor, for instance following is what was measured for the HD560s I sent to Oratory:

I suppose some headphones might show more compression than others, and I suppose in those headphones then if you were to give a +20dB bass boost then you would get less of that 20dB addition, maybe you'd only end up with +18dB if you measured it or something. I don't think it's a big effect though, it's more important to note the distortion at different SPL's because then you wouldn't boost it too much anyway if distortion was getting crazy and you listen at loud listening levels (you'd hear it).......if you only listen at low to moderate levels then most headphones can take gobs of bass boost even if they don't measure particularly well in distortion on this site. So for example the LCD headphone being reviewed in this thread (the LCD-XC) shows low distortion at the highest SPL (114dB) in the bass, so really there is zero concerns with this headphone re bass boosting EQ.

 

[beagleman]

I have a pair of Ultrasone headphones, and the bass is just about "right" down to the deepest notes and test tones. In fact if anything I feel it may be slightly TOO much deep bass.

Why do I get the feeling that just about every headphone tested seems to not fit the harman deep bass portion of the curve, yet, I do not get the feeling in real use, that most decent phones are lacking in deep bass??


Maybe I need to send mine in?

 

[Jimbob54]

I have a pair of Ultrasone headphones, and the bass is just about "right" down to the deepest notes and test tones. In fact if anything I feel it may be slightly TOO much deep bass.

Why do I get the feeling that just about every headphone tested seems to not fit the harman deep bass portion of the curve, yet, I do not get the feeling in real use, that most decent phones are lacking in deep bass??


Maybe I need to send mine in?

Do that. I for one reduce bass on any 'phones or IEM that get anywhere near Harman levels- maybe more from what I'm used to than objective "preference".

Its one of the reasons I want to hear the Stealth as I believe it might be Harman bass done right, whereas sticking an 8dB low shelf on something like the HD800 is just plain wrong! BE interesting so see how the Ultrasone comes out.

Apropos of nothing...Im picturing Amir's listening test

 

[Robbo99999]

Do that. I for one reduce bass on any 'phones or IEM that get anywhere near Harman levels- maybe more from what I'm used to than objective "preference".

Its one of the reasons I want to hear the Stealth as I believe it might be Harman bass done right, whereas sticking an 8dB low shelf on something like the HD800 is just plain wrong! BE interesting so see how the Ultrasone comes out.

Apropos of nothing...Im picturing Amir's listening test

It's not plain wrong to stick a +8dB Low Shelf on a headphone, far from it, what matters is the resultant frequency response as long as distortion is under control. There's nothing magical about a headphone like the Stealth that does Harman bass without EQ vs a headphone that requires +8dB Low Shelf to get there, as long as distortion variable is kept in check......it's the same thing, it's not hoodoo voodoo.

It is of course possible that people have different experiences with headphones due to different levels of bass seal that is created when they wear them - different anatomies, so could be a lot of what people think they like in a headphone frequency response is skewed by not getting a good seal, but that's probably not relevant in your own particular case as you don't like Harman Bass (too much bass for you), unless you're basing that on planar headphones that can give a bass boost in some parts of the bass when not sealing perfectly (whilst sacrificing the low subbass at the same time).

 

[amirm]

Amir does not measure HP linearity--i.e. whether the FR keeps the same "shape" at different levels or not. Is it because 99.9% of the headphones are "linear" and that measurement would be mostly useless?

That and the fact that the data my not be completely reliable. I for example don't know how the microphone compresses at extreme levels. And that the shape of linearity is impossible to interpret. When I first started I did a lot of linearity tests and results were just not useful.

 

[Jimbob54]

It's not plain wrong to stick a +8dB Low Shelf on a headphone, far from it, what matters is the resultant frequency response as long as distortion is under control. There's nothing magical about a headphone like the Stealth that does Harman bass without EQ vs a headphone that requires +8dB Low Shelf to get there, as long as distortion variable is kept in check......it's the same thing, it's not hoodoo voodoo.

It is of course possible that people have different experiences with headphones due to different levels of bass seal that is created when they wear them - different anatomies, so could be a lot of what people think they like in a headphone frequency response is skewed by not getting a good seal, but that's probably not relevant in your own particular case as you don't like Harman Bass (too much bass for you), unless you're basing that on planar headphones that can give a bass boost in some parts of the bass when not sealing perfectly (whilst sacrificing the low subbass at the same time).

Lax lingo on my part. To my ears sticking that much bass on the HD800 is wrong. It ruins them for me.

 

[GaryH]

it becomes clear that Amir measured the updated 2021 version

 

[GaryH]

Compression can happen in headphones at higher volumes, but I think it's generally not a big factor, for instance following is what was measured for the HD560s I sent to Oratory:View attachment 188308View attachment 188307View attachment 188306

I suppose some headphones might show more compression than others, and I suppose in those headphones then if you were to give a +20dB bass boost then you would get less of that 20dB addition, maybe you'd only end up with +18dB if you measured it or something. I don't think it's a big effect though, it's more important to note the distortion at different SPL's because then you wouldn't boost it too much anyway if distortion was getting crazy and you listen at loud listening levels (you'd hear it).......if you only listen at low to moderate levels then most headphones can take gobs of bass boost even if they don't measure particularly well in distortion on this site. So for example the LCD headphone being reviewed in this thread (the LCD-XC) shows low distortion at the highest SPL (114dB) in the bass, so really there is zero concerns with this headphone re bass boosting EQ.

Compression also shows up as distortion in the measurements, so you can infer the former from the latter. (And this means if it's claimed the measurement mic compresses at extreme levels, its distortion measurements at those levels would be inaccurate too.) As Oratory said in his message to you about his measurements of your HD560S:

You'll notice that for very low frequencies, the measured frequency response starts to become slightly different at very high signal levels, that's because the driver can't reach the full excursion anymore and starts saturating/distorting. Remember though that this only happens at very high signal levels. Not a big problem.

The power compression necessarily causes harmonic distortion (because the characteristic curve is nonlinear). So if we look at THD at different voltage levels, we see that for very high levels (equivalent to 113 dB at 1 kHz) we see 5% THD at 20 Hz.

 

[CopperFox]

And the bass distortion you would see from the above +20dB bass boost would be the green line in the following graph

There is no data whatsoever in the graphs about distortion of bass at the two higher levels (104db and 114db). This is not difficult to understand.

 

[staticV3]

There is no data whatsoever in the graphs about distortion of bass at the two higher levels (104db and 114db). This is not difficult to understand.

This graph shows the LCD-XC's distortion across the entire frequency range including bass at 94, 104, and 114dB SPL:

 

[CopperFox]

This graph shows the LCD-XC's distortion across the entire frequency range including bass at 94, 104, and 114dB SPL:
View attachment 188333

Wrong. It is allegedly calibrated at 425Hz and therefore will have bass at -10 to -20 lower than it would be with a Harman-correct headphone.